Having "It"

Karl is actually a great athlete

and keeps himself in good shape. Although it doesn't really matter, I always hated how out of shape Toledo was, compared to Donahue, and glad to see we at least got a coach he keeps himself in shape.

I also loved seeing donahue on one side representing the bruins, and Fat sloppy john robinson on the other representing SUC. That was a perfect symbol of hard working UCLA compared to lazy, legacy riddled SUC.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 8:41 AM PDT reply actions

Oooooh

A "leader" who keeps himself in good shape. Yeah we can see how that is working out involving bigger things:

That is one of the dumbest line of argument I have seen on BN.

by bluestreet on May 8, 2007 8:46 AM PDT up reply actions

what am i arguing?

Just saying I like when a coach takes pride in remaining in good physical shape. If you are going to work with athletes, you should at least be disciplined enough to keep in shape.

Pete Carroll does, Karl Dorrell does, Ben Howland does, etc.

I just think people like Robinson, Toledo, and Majerus should take being physically fit as part of their job description in leading student athletes. I left off Charlie Weiss because I believe he actually has some serious medical conditions.

If some coach who had a 100 pounds of fat was telling me I needed to hit the weights, I would find it laughable.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 8:56 AM PDT reply actions

Still a ridiculous argument

Majerus is a damn good coach.

So is Bill Parcels who clearly doesn't meet your criteria of being in "great shape."

There are coaches around in college and pro ball who may have weight issues ... but are good leaders ... much better than KD.

Just because KD is in "good shape" doesn't make him a good coach or doesn't mean it would make his players pay closer attention to him when he asks them to "hit the weight room."

That is just silly.

by bluestreet on May 8, 2007 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions

I didn't say it made him a good coach

Nor did I say overall it made other people bad coaches.

What I am saying is that a coach of an athletic team should hold himself to a standard of remaining physically fit as an example to his student athletes.

It doesn't define success, but I can't believe anyone would argue that a coach shouldn't be physically fit? Do you think Majerus's lifestyle and morbid obesity are a good example to his student athletes?

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 9:16 AM PDT up reply actions

Uhm

I certainly wasn't arguing that a "coach shouldn't be physically fit." The simple point here is that it is ridiculous to assert somehow a student athlete would give more attention to a HC who is "physically fit." That is just a silly argument. Surely a smart athlete is going to pay attention to a coach who actually knows something about the game and exhibits a total command and control over his program.

By your laughable argument Steve Lavin was a good college coach since ya know .. also looked physically in good shape. I mean dude was his on exercise bikes all the time even during recruiting trips. So surely all the kids listened to him when he told them to hit the gym. Just a laughable argument on many levels.

by bluestreet on May 8, 2007 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Blowing things a bit out of proportion, BlueSt.?

"Overly defensive people tend to generate hostility in others which generates combativeness. Such people are often described as hypersensitive to criticism and, in extreme cases, paranoid. Overly defensive people seem to be chronically angry and frustrated and often have underlying depression."

Don't make me ask WestwudWiz to put you on the couch...

by Nars on May 8, 2007 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions

Who is being defensive?

Street or Silverlake with a silly argument to defend KD?

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions

It was just a comment

And it sounded like he was mostly pointing out his preference for a fit coach over a fatass.. Perfectly legit in my eyes.

by jatteratious on May 8, 2007 10:02 AM PDT up reply actions

Accordingly

I think it is legit to point out that comment that someone prefers a head coach based on how he looks is kind of silly.

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions

How am I defending KD?

I stated he was in good physical shape. I did not state he is a good coach. I don't think there is any arguement or controversy regarding his being in good shape. Although I give him a D+ as a coach, not the F that many on here do, I certainly wouldn't say he has proven to be a good coach in his first four seasons.

I figured since the post was about how throwing out a first pitch reflects on the coaching abilities of Dorrell and Howland, it seemed within the topic to talk about how physicial fitness reflects on coaches. It certainly doesn't define them, but unless one would argue that Coach KD is in bad shape, I don't see how my post would be "defending" him.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions

Yeah

I am sure your comment was not meant to defend KD in a post that once again made him look a dolt (based on his own actions). Yeah okay whatever.

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions

Eh

My read is that Silver is just making a personal preference statement. To me its the equivalent of saying "I like oranges better than apples". Both statements are sort of random, meaningless in a broader context, and a without basis. There are lots of similar comments posted just like this one, but they are generally ignored. I just thought it was funny how flustered Street got by this comment in particular.

What's more, this singular weird comment has generated almost as many posts as the Drew Gordon commit.

by Nars on May 8, 2007 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions

reading comprehension

Yet again, you state by my arguement Steve Lavin is a good coach. For the third time, I am not making the arguement that all physically fit people are good coaches. That is absurd on its face. It is a straw man.

What I am saying is that coaches should consider remaining in good shape as part of their job and an example they set for student athletes. And, I prefer to have a coach who is disciplined enough to remain in good shape over one who isn't, all other things being equal.

If their coaching abilities were equal, I would prefer a guy who is on the exercise bike a lot over a guy who is looking for the next all you can eat buffet.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 9:54 AM PDT up reply actions

Uh yeah

I am sure it wasn't you in the initial post saying how it was great to have someone who is in "great shape," and how a coaching being in good shape helped shape the perception of the program (using Donahue as an example). That in itself is just a bad take.

A college head coach should be measured on how the leads the program, teaches his student athletes, and the kind of result he produces on and off the field (classroom). Not sure how being in "good shape" has anything to do with it.

KD looks fit. Good fit. But that has no bearing whatsoever on whether he is an effective head coach ... which to date if you judge by his record suggests otherwise.

Stop trying hard to defend a mediocre head coach.

by bluestreet on May 8, 2007 10:02 AM PDT up reply actions

again, read what i wrote,

My first sentence:

Although it doesn't really matter, I always hated how out of shape Toledo was, compared to Donahue, and glad to see we at least got a coach he keeps himself in shape.

NOw, does that say KD is a good coach? no

What is states, which I went on to explain in further detail in subsequent posts, is coaches who deal with student athletes should take being physically fit as part of their job descriptions, since their job is maximizing the physical abilities of others, and should be an example. I wouldn't want a coach who smoked two packs a day either.

You can certainly disagree with that premise, but interpreting it as a "defending a mediocre coach" doesn't reflect what I was writing.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions

One more thing

It doesn't make you a good coach, but it certainly should be part of your leadership example to the student athletes you coach.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 8:57 AM PDT reply actions

Keep the passion going, guys!

It is interesting when what seemed to me to be a fairly innocuous comment could generate such a heated dialogue. Let's keep that passion but transfer it to a more worthy subject, such as the still unexplained and still under the rug "White Nation" or the fact that justsc seems to have an infinite number of "get out of NCAA sanctions free" cards. Basically everything that makes up justsc is worthy of contempt, and in my opinion, contempt expressed with passion is a wonderful thing.

(And Nars, if you like oranges better than apples, it proves you want Mr. Dorrell to be permanent head coach for life. I just thought I would weigh in on the argument.)

by Fox 71 on May 8, 2007 12:25 PM PDT reply actions

Dog Days of Sports

With school almost over, minor sports dominating the horizon, and nothing but boring NBA basketball and baseball on TV -- there's not much to talk about around here.

Thanks to all of you for finding something to drive a thread to more than 18 entries.

At my age, I need distractions and fillers. You are doing a great job to meet my needs.

sjh

by Class of 66 on May 8, 2007 1:36 PM PDT reply actions

Hey

"Dumbest...Argument...Ever!"

by BruinFan1 on May 8, 2007 2:03 PM PDT reply actions

Fat or In-shape coach

Its getting to the point where some one cannot state a simple opinion without being harrassed on this board. Bluestreet wasn't saying that Dorrell or any other coach is a better coach because he is in shape!! Christ.

I have got better things to do than read this stuff.

by BruinPete on May 8, 2007 2:27 PM PDT reply actions

I Concur Somewhat With BruinPete

Use your common sense for a second. How many Dorrell supporters do we have here on BN? Besides the few trolls that pop up every now and then, I can't name one person here who actually thinks Dorrell is doing a good job. I think everybody knows that BN isn't exactly a Dorrell fanbase.

With that being said, I don't think I've ever seen Silverlake say anything close to supporting Dorrell's body of work. With that context in mind, I surely did not take what he said as support of Dorrell in any fashion.

Now, if you thought that he was supporting Dorrell (which, again, would be odd considering this is BN), why wouldn't you ask before you call his opinions dumb? It may be the old debating classes in high school coming back to me, but saying that another person's opinions are dumb or stupid without even a follow up question for clarification is a big "no no."

That especially goes for a place like BN. We're all Bruins, so I would think we should give each other the benefit of the doubt before we start getting angry over spilled milk.

Oh, and for clarification reasons, I posted that "dumbest argument ever" thing because I saw the argument as totally unecessary, not because the arguments were lacking in any intellectual merit or anything like that (I can see how that post might make me look like I'm being hypocritical), but because it could have been easily avoided by what I previously stated.

by BruinFan1 on May 8, 2007 3:24 PM PDT reply actions

Silverlake

Is a Dorrell supporter. Sure here on BN he is playing the card of how he is going to give Dorrell one more year which is cool. But given his track record he has always been quick to defend KD.

Also I have seen him post on BRO premium asking people's opinions on this community inviting open criticisms (at least that is how his post appeared) from a message board filled with delusional Dorrell lackies.

It's not that unreasonable to see him as a Dorrell supporter.

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions

I'll Take Your Word For It

but I really don't see how that post you linked to is dispositive proof of Silverlake's allegiance to KD.

by BruinFan1 on May 8, 2007 3:38 PM PDT up reply actions

Trendlines

From that comment thread it was obvious Silverlake was asking people not to criticize KD because it hurts the program. It came across as someone who doesn't want to hear any objective criticisms of KD just so we can always bask in the glow of happy thoughts.

I will concede my post above was snarky. That's what happens when you are saddled with a mediocre football coach who really hasn't showed any evidence of doing something special on the football. It creates a caustic atmosphere around the program. But in retorting to snark Silverlake came up with a silly reply and he got called out for it. That is all.

But to me it is not difficult to see how silverlake is always a little jumpy in defending a mediocre football coach in the name of supporting the program.

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions

i feel like the scarlett letter

I might have to wear a red KD on me from now on. Just kidding, guys.

I support KD in that I hope he succeeds and don't see the point of bringing up his failures from past seasons at this point. He's the coach until at least 12/07, so it seems pointless to me. He will be evaluated based on this season, and rightfully fired if he isn't successful. I hope he succeeds, but if he doesn't I have no qualms about firing him at the end of the season. He hasn't done a good job thus far.

HOWEVER, my post had nothing to do with any of that. It was just making a point that I think coaches should be in shape and I don't like having slob coaches represent UCLA. It doesn't translate into wins and losses, but its about taking pride in yourself and holding yourself to some of the same standards you would expect the student athletes under your charge to have. It didn't have any other meaning than that. I'm not sure how so much got read into it, but I do seem to be something of a lightening rod around here.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 8, 2007 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions

You Hit The Nail On The Head

I think, from a personal standpoint, I hate "snarky" responses (I admittedly have never heard of that word). They seem to cheapen discussion and make what could be intelligent conversation devolve into bickering.

Thank you for admitting you were bing snarky and thank you for explaining why. I understand where YOU are coming from much better.

by BruinFan1 on May 8, 2007 3:50 PM PDT reply actions

Snarky?

You have never heard of that word?!!!!

Classic example of a snarky:

Admitted I don't even have 5 percent of sense of humor of that guy. :)

But seriously I got through the Lavin days by maintaining a "snarky perspective" on UCLA hoops. I am afraid same thing is happening with UCLA football.

by Nestor on May 8, 2007 4:00 PM PDT up reply actions

How can any true Bruin fan give Dorrell a D+?

I give him an F for "failure" and "fuck off"...and that goes for Dorrell and his athletic physique, as well as anyone who supports him. I support the kids, not him...he has ruined my football experience over the past couple of years.

by meow meow on May 8, 2007 6:00 PM PDT reply actions

I gotta agree with Meow on this one

I don't give Mr. Dorrell points for anything. Any positive thing he is alleged to have done is more than offset by all the bad. He is the worst of any person to be called head coach at UCLA since WWII. (I won't call him the worst coach because that implies that he has in fact been a coach, which in my opinion is giving him far too much credit.)

A D+ is MANY grades too high. I don't know whether its possible to have a grade below F, but there should be, and is should be permanently retired in memory of Mr. Dorrell.

by Fox 71 on May 8, 2007 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions

the reason I don't give him an F

He runs a clean program and graduates his players.

I am proud that he recruits players who can speak publically and reflect well on the University.

He had a 10 win season

He beat SUC when they were #2

Notice, I don't give him an average or passing grade, but to me an F would be someone who never has a good season, who runs a corrupt program,can never beat SUC, and/or has players that make you cringe when they speak to the media.

Steve Lavin turned into an F his last two years. KD might still do that. But at this point, I would give him a D+. If he gets to a BCS bowl this year, I would raise that to a 5 year C grade. If he doesn't, I would lower it to a D or lower and show him the door.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 9, 2007 9:17 AM PDT up reply actions

Dorrell never has put together a complete season

I don't believe anyone here was all that impressed that 10 win season featuring two humiliating beatdowns when the Pac-10 championship was on the line. If you think a regular season which ended with that disgusting 19-66 loss than your standards are lot lower than I imagined.

And also ... beating SUC at home should not be a big deal. It should be always EXPECTED by any self respecting UCLA fan who has some modicum of standards.

I am glad KD runs a clean program. But if you take a closer look the academic performance of our football program is not the best in the Pac-10.

KD has been nothing short of a miserable failure any which way you look at him.

by bluestreet on May 9, 2007 9:22 AM PDT up reply actions

This Argument

Hey, all you kids, time out! Go to your rooms! Now! I hope that BN is not some sort of politically correct venue where any post that can be construed as even remotely favorable to KD is condemned and the poster flamed. That's just crazy. Let any Dorrell supporter write what he wants, no matter how stupid and annoying you may find it. There is no way that anything counts but the facts. Let them speak.

by Oldguy on May 8, 2007 10:00 PM PDT reply actions

Silverlake...

They are just roughing you up aren't' they? What's gotten into everyone here? If there's so much controversy over a simple post I wonder what the reaction would be to a serious comment. Check this out: I think Karl Dorrell is such a mediocre coach that a cave man can do a better job than what he has done in his term as head coach. Yes, a cave man. How do you like them apples?

"I've got nothing against God; it's his fan club I can't stand."

by txbruin on May 9, 2007 12:44 AM PDT reply actions

Seriously

this whole thing has been blown way out of proportion. I don't think it's appropriate to start blacklisting people based upon their perceived beliefs about Dorrell. It's starting to get a little Fox News-ish in here.

by Ericppk on May 9, 2007 1:09 AM PDT reply actions

Hey - wait a minute

What's the matter with the news that I post?

by Fox 71 on May 9, 2007 5:37 AM PDT up reply actions

I love it when anyone supports KD

Because it is very easy to refute and it makes for a good discussion...which is what a blog is about, I thought. Now this thread got a bit out of hand with some nitpicking, but the general topic of KD's worth as a coach makes for passionate discourse. And then everyone with a brain realizes that he still SUCKS!

You don't have to be in shape to inspire athletes. Otherwise, Mike Holmgren and Andy Reid would also be shit out of luck. It certainly wouldn't hurt, but it's not a requirement. I'll take experience and knowledge over fitness any day in a coach, and I am 100% positive that most people he would as well. Even Silver. He just wishes that KD had a brain to go with that fit body, that would be nice.

by tasser10 on May 9, 2007 9:32 AM PDT reply actions

Cruz Bustamante

Vote for me- I lost weight!

Did he win? No

by SuperBruinMan on May 9, 2007 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions

I knew this thread would never end.

it's a lot like the famous Seinfeld pilot.

"What's it about?

Nothing.

Nothing?"

No disrespect intended, but I just knew this one would mutate and keep growing.

sjh

by Class of 66 on May 9, 2007 1:12 PM PDT reply actions

I was late to the show!

But I do love Seinfeld. Let's do a thread on that!

by tasser10 on May 9, 2007 2:12 PM PDT up reply actions

Don't bother me Tasser

I'm trying to look busy at my desk (doing nothing). I have a very angry expression on my face which helps fool the bosses.

No soup for you!

by Barnes2JJ on May 9, 2007 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions

I'm working on my project

It's a rubber balloon to put in oil tankers. I'll be throwing it out the window in a bit to see if it works.

by tasser10 on May 9, 2007 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions

oh, and p.s.:

there is a Soup Man a block from my office in Manhattan. The Soup Nazi sold out and franchised!

by tasser10 on May 9, 2007 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions

WHAT?

I was planning on visiting the Soup Nazi later this year during our trip to NY. Is he no longer around? What's the skinny? I'm talking about the ORIGINAL dude.

By the way, have you ever worked for Vandelay Industries?

by Barnes2JJ on May 9, 2007 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions

sorry i'v e been away for a while

i was taking a nap under my desk and then had to visit my private disabled restroom.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 9, 2007 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions

The "move" Jerry - the "move"

That is what all those (alleged) sexual criminals from cross town are trying to find out. They are trying to figure out what was that "move" so that they don't have to go around trying to (allegedly) assault Trojan women.

by bluestreet on May 9, 2007 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions

He IS the original dude.

The Soup Man franchise was started by the Soup Nazi, aka Al Yeganeh. He closed shop, sold out and opened soup chains and started selling his soups in supermarkets. So, the original soup shop is gone, but the Soup Man soups are supposedly the same. They are very good but somewhat pricey.

I did sell latex for a while before moving on to bras. But now I am selling playground equipment and I have my own bathroom.

by tasser10 on May 10, 2007 6:49 AM PDT up reply actions

But

do you wear mansierres?

I'm crushed about the Soup Man/Nazi. I wanted to visit the original location and receive the same (rumored) surly treatment. I know it sounds silly, but it was on our list of things "to do." His (or whoever's) website makes it appear that his original store exists.

I'm sitting here now crying all over my puffy shirt.

by Barnes2JJ on May 10, 2007 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions

I prefer to wear

a bro over a mansierre. Much more support!

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 10, 2007 8:06 AM PDT up reply actions

Good point

I got a bro a few years ago from my girlfriend at the time. I think her name was Mulva.

by Barnes2JJ on May 10, 2007 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions

Nope

That location is gone. The lines there were ridiculous! I think he made a big mistake, personally. Too much time went by between his closing and his return. He should have capitalized on his fame, just gotten a bigger space. He sold out, I'm sure he did well for himself. But now he has a lot more competition.

Maybe I'll buy you a cinnamon babka to make you feel better.

by tasser10 on May 10, 2007 8:35 AM PDT up reply actions

Drat

Well, thanks for the scoop. I missed the boat (or rather, the soup) on that one.

A cinnamon babka would be lovely. Or just a muffin top.

by Barnes2JJ on May 10, 2007 8:44 AM PDT up reply actions

Just make sure you make the WHOLE muffin

then you pop the top, and ditch the stump.

by Tydides on May 10, 2007 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions

One of my favorite

episodes - rarely seen in syndication - shows Jerry and Elaine at Bruin Alum party and some guy comes in who looked a little like Leinhart, so naturally they called him a mimbo. But when he tried to pass himself as a Bruin, Jerry instantly called him a "truin." We have some of them coming here, too, from time to time.

Anyway, you would have liked this episode.

by Fox 71 on May 9, 2007 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions

71 Are You the Master of Your Domain?

sjh

by Class of 66 on May 9, 2007 8:22 PM PDT up reply actions

What do you think?

by Fox 71 on May 9, 2007 8:45 PM PDT up reply actions

This thread

I'm surprised by this thread. And not for the reasons some others are. I was surprised that folks would react so negatively to bluestreet's comments.

At the outset, I got it. Whether or not someone thinks it's good for KD to be fit isn't exactly isn't the most controversial subject. But, don't be fooled. Imo, Silverlakebruin's comment isn't as innocuous as he would have you all believe.

I've followed BN for a long time. And some people are always pushing it. Always trying to get in their shots. Some folks think its fun to annoy others. To try to get under people's skin. And they'll take advantage of whatever they can to try to score some cheap points. Sure, they're passive-aggressive. Not to mention a bit immature.

But that's what I think we are seeing in silverlake. He wanted to make his latest pro-KD comment. He probably thought it would be fun to poke some KD critics in the eye in a tiny way. And now he's trying to dance away again with some drivel about how he thinks KD is a D+ coach.

I could be wrong, but in my opinion, it's just like when uclagradscdad drops by to defend SC. So, I think it's fine for someone like bluestreet to call him out on it, even if it all seems trivial to some people.

by EricBruin on May 9, 2007 4:04 PM PDT reply actions

Wow

What have I done to deserve such a hateful, insulting, mean spirited post?

Jesus, you don't have to agree but calling me:

A maker of harmful comments (innoculous=harmeless)
A person who is "always pushing it"
A person who is "always trying to get in their shots"
A person who finds it "fun to annoy others"
A person who likes to "get under people's skin"
A person who will "take advantage of whatever they can to try to score some cheap shots"
A "passive aggressive" person
An "immature" person
A person who finds it fun to "poke some KD critics in the eye" (i know this is figurative)
a person who "dances away" from my statements

You don't know me, and you certainly haven't earned the right to insult me.

"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"

by silverlakebruin on May 9, 2007 7:21 PM PDT reply actions

Looks like we're all bored!

Don't worry about it Silver, in my opinion you can say whatever you want as long as you don't insult anyone and can support your argument. But obviously there are people here who will criticize or agree with every last word you write. We're starving for Bruin sports! I think you've made your point, personally I thought your comment was rather innocent...but even a little spark can create a big fire. Just roll with it, I don't think every one of those comments by Eric was directed at you.

by tasser10 on May 10, 2007 6:57 AM PDT up reply actions

I disagree with Tasser

I think everyone involved in the fight should take it all very seriously and keep slugging it out.

(We have a long way to go until football season, and this fight is much more interesting than anything on television. I'm not sure I remember what the fight is about, but you guys are doing a great job! Keep it up.)

by Fox 71 on May 10, 2007 6:59 AM PDT up reply actions