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UCLA Should Roll BYU

So apparently lot of BYU fans are feeling good about the Saturday game. I mean they are feeling soo good that they are humming Erasure tunes in their fan forums. I am not kidding people. You have to click on this link to believe it. Yes, Erasure.

Meanwhile, their players are feeling good enough after a 20-7 win over Stoop's Mildcats that its leading to comments like this out of Provo:

OK, so Arizona and Oregon aren't USC or UCLA. But the Wildcats were touting this as their best team in the Mike Stoops era, and BYU dominated in Saturday's 20-7 victory.

"When we take on someone that has that type of hype we want some of that notoriety," BYU sophomore wide receiver Austin Collie said. "We want people to know that we're a powerhouse team. I feel like we're one of the best programs in the nation. What we're striving to do is to get to a BCS bowl game and we're willing to take out whoever we've got in front of us."
Man that's lot of big talk coming out of some team and their fans from the MWC.

So is BYU really all that impressive as some of them fans are making them out to be? Uhm ... not really.

Sure they have won 2 Pac-10 games in a row. But I don't really care much for their throttling over a dispirited Oregon team in the Rose Bowl, which finished the regular season on a 3 game losing streak getting blown out in 2 of 3 of those games before losing to their archrival from Corvallis.

As for their `dominating' win over Arizona? I am sorry. I am not all that impressed with the nonsense about "best team in Mike Stoops era" considering Little Stoops has a career record of 12-22. Not to mention the fact that Arizona was breaking in a new OC, who didn't have a lot of time to implement a new spread offense he brought over from Texas Tech changing up the entire Arizona offensive scheme (in contrast to UCLA where Dorrell brought in Norvell to run his WCO).

Couple of other numbers related to BYU football program we should all note: Now as for their last Saturday's game against Arizona, let's look through the game stats. Here are some points that kind of stick out to me:
  • BYU rushed for 104 yards in 32 carries averaging only 3.3 yards per carry against one of the more mediocre rushing defenses in the Pac-10. Arizona was 6th in the Pac-10 last year in rushing defense.

  • Mentioned above how Zona was breaking in a new OC who they hired this off season who was breaking in an entirely new offense. It amounted to an anemic Zona offense, which Cougars were able to handle in front of 65,000 home fans. Yet consider this even though they shut down the Zona running game (a pathetic 32 yards in 19 carries), the Cats put together a fairly decent passing attack as Tuitama completed 72 percents of his passes throwing for 216 yards. I'd think our offense with all our athletes would do much better than that.

  • 20-7 margin is hardly a "dominating" win. It is even less impressive when you consider that BYU Cougars did not score their last TD with 3:30 left in the 4th quarter, after Arizona had turned the ball over in downs near the midfield.

  • Two of BYU's TDs came via short drives (36 yards and 43 yards) after taking over with great field positions. So against a mediocre Arizona defense infront of their home crowd, BYU really put together just 1 drive over 70 yards that resulted in a TD. They only had another drive more than 70 yards, an 83 yard drive which resulted in BYU turning the ball over in downs.

  • As uclabruins05 noted Cougars had only 2 (count them 2) plays of 20 yards or more against the Mildcats. Bruins had something like 9 (IIRC) against Stanford.
Also keep in mind this will be BYU quarter-backs' first road start in his career. I don't believe Max Hall has ever attempted a pass on the road. Ever. So I would think a UCLA defensive secondary that is eager to make up for its less than average (kind of embarrassing actually given all the preseason hype) would be fired up and be ready to lay a smack down on Hall and his receivers. Right?

So tell me again why BYU which has lost 14 starters from last years' team and is replacing 25 players, should have any chance against a stacked UCLA team with 20 returning starters, a fired up Rose Bowl crowd for the home opener, and a team that is looking to win the Pac-10 championship in Dorrell's "Show-Me" season?

BYU apparently has one trump card. And it may go back to preparing and coaching:
Much is always made about an opponent's advantage in athleticism and speed whenver BYU plays a BCS program like UCLA or Arizona. Mendenhall and his players take no issue with being "slower, smaller and less athletic" but they don't believe SPARQ testing results or 40 times win football games. They feel they can counterbalance any athletic advantages with position mastery, competitiveness and sound fundamentals. He also belives this BYU team is the most physically prepared of any he has been a part of, and that conditioning level is a factor late in games.
Well we have heard all the talk about our players being more physically mature than ever, faster and quicker than ever. We have heard all the hype about fast-twitch muscle training and Doc Kreis's training program. So there is no reason BYU should have superior conditioned athletes compared to UCLA.

And as for coaching is concerned what is Dorrell getting paid millions bucks a year for? Losing to teams from MWC. I don't think so.

Not only a BYU victory at the Rose Bowl should be out of the question, it should be extremely disappointing and frankly inexcusable if somehow BYU improves its record against UCLA to 2-6.  If UCLA has truly arrived under Dorrell in his fifth season, the Bruins should roll all over the Cougars to an impressive blowout victory.

UCLA should destroy the Cougars this Saturday.

No pressure Karl.

GO BRUINS.

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If KD
wants to continue to post passing grades for this season, he had better beat BYU by more than 2 TDs. That seems fair considering we set the bar for Stanford at 3+ TDs. Anything less and we're looking at another Rice moment.

by Tydides on Sep 5, 2007 5:08 PM PDT reply actions  

game thoughts
I will be at the game on Saturday sitting in row 51.  I am going to be pumped for this game.

I gotta tell you the play that has stuck with me most since Saturday is the flea flicker.  That play means more to me than the 5 passing TDs or Bell's great game.  It shows that maybe we are going to have a fun offense this year.  The fact that it looked great and worked great is a bonus; just the fact that they called is was huge.

So, I am going to be real pumped on Saturday.  I am going to be loud on defense, especially on third downs.  Believe me, I have a voice that carries.  I expect a good crowd, not Cal or ND size, but this is a good year so far.  Albeit, very early we are ranked, won our opener in good style and put up good offensive numbers in our opener.  Now, I know that it was against Stanford; but people will be excited.

I expect the Rose Bowl to be real loud for BYU third downs.  I expect our defense to want to show that they are better than they showed last week.  I expect Olsen to be more on the mark this week.  I expect Bell to have another great game.  I expect Markey to still get caught early and go down on first contact.

I will be optimistic, but cautious.  That is why I voted for the 15-20 point win in the poll.  I hope for a bigger victory, but 17 points sound about right to me.  Believe me, I would like a BIG blowout, like 49-10 or something like that.  But I don't see it.  Let's say a 17 point win where it felt like more, maybe because BYU points came late in the game.  I don't know.

BTW, I think it's going to be around 90 degrees out there so if your going bring plenty of water and something to cool off with.

by FullertonBruin on Sep 5, 2007 5:50 PM PDT reply actions  

I will be there
This is my first year as a season ticket holder and I am pumped up.  

The weather will be great (albeit hot), the tailgating will be outstanding, and if I happen to catch a glimpse of a coed or two, or a cheerleader, well, so be it.

Also, I agree about the flea flicker.  The players like running those types of plays and, if they are having fun, there will be more energy on our side out on the field.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 5, 2007 6:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

LOL @ this:
"In other words, we might actually get 80 to 100 yards rushing on them, while holding them under 60. Such an advantage will pit BO's performance against Max's. Here, I must admit, I'd give the edge to Max. I saw far more mistakes by BO than I saw by Max on saturday."

Oooooookaaaaaay.

Reading all of these delusional BYU fans has me really hoping for a beatdown. I hope the D comes out on fire and lets them know they are in the RB.

by Ajax on Sep 5, 2007 7:22 PM PDT reply actions  

Wow...
Seems "history" is an academic strong point at UCLA. And to think I came into this week's matchup with some respect for the Bruins. Y'all need to come down from your PAC-10 pedestal there. I can't say for sure that BYU will win but your boys better be ready to knock some heads because our Cougars are not scared or intimidated by them. We aren't as fast, but we're fearless, big and physical. From a knowledgeable Cougar fan here are some things you dorks in So Cal need to know...
  1. BYU's O line is not only big and experienced, they are deep. Nearly every positin on the line can rotate in througout the game. Consider this, our backup center is a former SEC All-American as a freshman.
  2. BYU's running backs. Your boys on 'D' will have some big headaches when they wake up Sunday morning. Tonga is a punishing blocker, so blitzing will not be easy. Lucky for you guys, Fui Vakapuna is not 100% and it showed last Saturday. So he may not be much of a factor. BUT...keep your eye on Harvey Unga. The kid is a stud. He's 6'1 and 220 lbs and he has glue for hands and he's deceptively fast.
  3. BYU's linebackers. You don't realize just how good they are. Bryan Kehl is arguably one of the fastest at that position anywhere in the country. He'll run down receivers from behind and running backs NEVER get to the outside corner on him. Poppinga is fantastic as is David Nixon (a guy Texas A&M wanted BADLY).
  4. Our defensive secondary is not impressive on paper, no blue-chippers and no 4.3 speed guys. But don't let that fool you. They are fundamentally very sound and they know how to tackle. Collectively they are very efficient.
  5. Expect BYU's D to give your O fits. Last week against UA the Cougars rarely blitzed and kept their play calls minimal. They want to blitz more. Ben Olson is a pocket passer, he is not a mobile guy that will take off very often. He better watch his blindside because I will guarantee that he gets popped at least 3 times in this game. Because he is a lefty his blindside will be to his right. That being the case watch Kehl or Nixon to come from that side unblocked. Nixon did it at TCU last year and the QB never regained his composure. Stanford is lousy, and would probably finished in the bottom 3 of the MWC. I don't think you guys are giving BYU enough props. That's fine, I'd rather have it that way and have them come into your stadium and rough you guys up a bit.
  6. BYU has won 11 games in a row and 12 of their last 14. Two losses by a combined 9 points and a top-10 scoring defense.
Go ahead and get comfortable, expect your 3 TD victory and big day from Ben Olson. We prefer it that way. It makes it more fun after the win!!

ps- Ben Olson is really not as big an issue as the media are making it. I respect him as a person and I am glad he decided to serve a mission (as I did). He's a fine young man. I personally don't blame him for leaving BYU because of the mess it was under Crowton. As it turns out, BYU is doing just fine without Big Ben. I don't want BYU to beat Ben, or even hurt him. I just want BYU to beat UCLA. Period.

by Slugger on Sep 6, 2007 9:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

It will be fun
seeing us So Cal "dorks" beat BYU on Saturday.  Next time you visit this site, please try and show a little respect and drop the name calling.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

Good thing that "slugger" was here ...
to set us cali dorks straight. After reading that, I just hope our players can make it back on the team bus back to westwood under their own power.

I do hope that these BYU fans do realize that for all the talk about having a vs. Pac-10 win streak, you guys played Arizona last week. Don't talk about what our game at Stanford said or didn't say about our team when you just played a home game against the #7 or #8 team in the Pac-10. That does not show much about your team either. Lets just wait until Saturday afternoon and see how this plays out, ok folks?

btw, it is good to hear someone from BYU on the blogs/boards not completely bashing Olson. I certainly understand BYU fans being displeased in his decision to transfer - the act of leaving + the effect of not recruiting the position in believing him to return, but some folks are taking it to a ridiculous level.

by bruinhoo on Sep 6, 2007 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

MMFE
Most Myopic Fans Ever

I know there's not much going on up in SLC, and you are completely obsessed with everything Brigham Young, but you guys are getting way too carrier away..

"Your boys on 'D' will have some big headaches when they wake up Sunday morning."

Yeah, from partying all night after smoking the little church boys from SLC. Then again, a W over BYU isn't really anything to get excited about.

by Ajax on Sep 6, 2007 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

A big fan of soap?
Sorry, with a name like "Ajax" it just begs the question.

Sorry for the name-calling (dorks) but you guys drew first blood by calling us BYU fans "delusional".

I just watched a 7-min highlight vid of your game last week against Stanford and here's what I came away with...

Defense looked pretty good. Not great, but really good.

Offense looked unimpressive. Stanford's defense was HORRIBLE. Missed tackles, out-of-position, letting guys get back them. They looked terrible. Any MWC team could beat Stanford against that kind of defense. The majority of UCLA's yardage came on blown plays. Don't count on that against BYU. The Cougars know how to tackle, and know how to be in position. We will give up yards, but getting a "big play" is very difficult. Olson has a good arm but he showed me nothing to make me nervous. He stays in the pocket which leaves him open to the linebacker blitz. Our inside linebackers (Poppinga and Staffieri)are great at filling holes along the line of scrimmage and our outside linebackers (Kehl and Nixon) don't let people get by them on the outside. They are big and fast. Kehl can run down most RB's and WR's from behind. He was toe-to-toe with our CB last year on a pic-6 down the field.

I'm not here to disrespect the Bruins and UCLA fans. But if you guys seriously think that you are that much better because you are UCLA, play in the Rose Bowl and are part of the PAC-10, then it will be that much more fun to see the Cougars compete against you. Win or lose, UCLA will have to play a great game because the Cougars are not afraid or intimidated. They don't care that it is the Rose Bowl. As Bronco has stated, it happens to be another field of grass that is 100 yrds long. They'll approach it the same they do any game.

You guys can have your speed and athleticism...cuz we'll beat you down with our physicality.

Looking forward to Saturday.  

by Slugger on Sep 6, 2007 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

You don't think the Bruins can bang?
I hope the little cougies feel the same way.

Just ask the Southern Cal O-line about how our D lacks physicality.

You think 600+ yards of O is un-impressive? Hopefully we can improve on that number Saturday.

by Ajax on Sep 6, 2007 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

Enough is enough
I've had enough of this argument that Bruin fans are claiming we will destroy BYU because we are in the Pac-10, are playing in the Rose Bowl and, well, just because we are UCLA.  Exactly who has made ANY of those arguments here, amongst all of us "dorky" UCLA fans?

You may disagree with the argument about the teams head-to-head historical records.  Ok, fine.  You may not think UCLA's win over Stanford was all that impressive, given the opponent.  That's fine, too.  

But give your argument a rest, would you please?  Name just one person on BN who has said that UCLA will win because we are in the Pac-10 and BYU is not.  NO ONE has made that argument because it's ridiculous.  Teams from lesser-known or lesser-publicized conferences beat teams from bigger conferences all the time.

Let's just stick to the facts about who has the better coaches, players, plays, etc.  No one is making the arguments you claim we are making.  It's not fair to argue that and it's getting old.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ummm
One BYU fan said they predict a 34-9 win on Saturday.  That is completely delusional.

by SuperBruinMan on Sep 6, 2007 6:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sorry but
Saying BYU is from SLC is like saying USC is in Westwood.  The Zoo is in Provo.

by SuperBruinMan on Sep 6, 2007 6:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hey Slugger
What's with the name calling? Didn't one of your 6 mothers teach you any manners? Come on!

Wow, after reading your synopsis on the Cougars it's a wonder they're not ranked #1 in the country! You guys will surely beat all of your MWC opponents by 5 touchdowns this year!

Actually I do predict this to be a close game, closer than it should be. Not because B.Y.U is as good as you say they are, but because we have a retard for a head coach that probably won't have his kids inspired, motivated, and properly prepared, and probably won't take the opportunity to put you guys away before all of us Bruin fans have to sweat out a 3 point victory.

So please don't come back here and gloat if this one is close or god forbid you guys are lucky enough to pull this one out. There will be plenty of "other discussion" around here (pertaining to "leadership") without having to deal with your little insults.

"if I don't do my job, I'm going to get fired" -Karl Dorrell

by godblesstyus95 on Sep 6, 2007 10:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Come On!

If that wasn't an Arrested Development reference, then I apologize :)

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 10:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not intentionally
but must have been buried in my subconscious somewhere! LOL
"if I don't do my job, I'm going to get fired" -Karl Dorrell

by godblesstyus95 on Sep 7, 2007 8:27 AM PDT up reply actions  

Wow
That's quite an analysis.  They show some good numbers in beating Arizona, so it follows that they will do the same against us at the Rose Bowl.  This Cougar fan obviously is not a grad student.  There are a couple of logical flaws there.

Bottom line, as Ajax put it, this guy is delusional.  They might beat us - who knows.  There is that other factor that has been mentioned from time to time, but which we will let pass in light of a good win over a bad Stanfurd team.  That particular factor is the only one that might get them a victory.  But in my opinion, the likelihood that they will beat us is quite remote because our team is more talented than their team.  

And in a one on one fight between the quarterbacks, I'll take ours.

I can't make it to the game on Saturday (it's too long a commute.)  But I hope there is a sea of Bruin Blue and noise like never before.  We've been saying it about the team, but there has to be a challenge to all Bruin fans.  If you think you're a fan, then get to the Rose Bowl.  Why not you, and why not now to anyone who considers staying home.  How about 80,000 plus, and LOTS of noise.

by Fox 71 on Sep 5, 2007 8:23 PM PDT reply actions  

I'm excited about this ball game.
  Here's to the offense continuing their new found greatness and to the defense erasing all doubt that they are for real.

  Here's to getting to hear the victory bell again after Bruin touchdowns.

by True Blue and Gold on Sep 5, 2007 8:42 PM PDT reply actions  

Is it election season already?
Is it election season already? Because the "expectations" spin on this one reminds me of one of those "Senator whatsisname will destroy candidate whocares in the debate, I don't even know whey they're having it."  Its a setup for post-event content.

If "destroy" is a 20+ win with the outcome not in doubt after 3 quarters -- then if we destroy BYU, I'll be surprised.  That team is confident, has older players, and a good O-line.  They have WR & RB with some real talent, and a good linebacking corp.  

UCLA doesn't have the pure team speed to make blowing a team like this out a guarantee.  UCLA has better athletes for sure, but our gap is that we need pure burners at the skill positions via recruiting.

I really hope I'm wrong -- I was at the Freedom Bowl where Gaston Green ran all over the Cougars.  And I was there when Wayne Cook & team really humiliated them.  I'd love to see a strong, confident win led by good execution on O and a strong, stout defense marked by solid tackling.

But I'll be happy with just the W and leave the style points based purely on the scoreboard for some other day.  Speaking of which, I'm pleasantly surprised people aren't ripping the coaches for the run-heavy attack Saturday -- if its working, stick with it.  

But Sports can be surprising.  Our fine basketball program doesn't always destroy inferior opponents.  So lets go 2-0 and the polls will follow if the Bruins keep winning.

by BruinEric on Sep 6, 2007 6:00 AM PDT reply actions  

Our fine basketball program
gets the benefit of the doubt when it comes to expectations because they have actually delivered in the past: 2 Pac-10 titles, 2 Final-4s, and its led by a coach who embraces those high expectations and we have full confidence that he will hold himself and his players accountable over those expectations.

Can't say that about our football program. And like it or not until they f*cking deliver, we are going to constantly remind everyone what exactly we expect from this in Dorrell's 5th season.

by Nestor on Sep 6, 2007 6:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh and
Don't compare Howland to Dorrell to make excuses for our mediocre football coach. Thats an insult to best basketball coach in America.

by Nestor on Sep 6, 2007 6:23 AM PDT up reply actions  

Geez
Not going to reply every single post below, so here's my overall reply.  I am missing out specific critiques, but this isn't a point-by-point reply.  Because I aint having that debate.

So I guess I provided fresh bait for everyone with big-time message board debate histories and grudges to tee off on a new guy who just started reading this blog on the McNair thing.  If BruinsNation is supposed to be a moderate-free zone, I understand.  Its your site.  

I know so many Bruins have a flame-war fest re: our coach, but I really don't participate in that, and if you believed I'm starting some Howland/Dorrell thing, you're wrong.  I should've left it at football and picked another team.  

So here...what I stated was a plain fact -- teams with much wider talent gaps than UCLA vs. BYU and with better coaching staffs just don't always blow out even THOSE opponents.  Look at Texas' struggle this past week.  BYU is better than Ark. St.  And Texas is better than UCLA.  Of course there are blowouts, but our talent gap isn't 72-10 type "BLOWOUT" wide with BYU.  To really smoke a team you need blazing unstoppable gamebreakers, and I haven't seen them yet here.  The implied critique of our recruiting just went unnoticed I guess...

I'm not sure people are reading my post for what it was...too many people on the boards skim and just interpret a post as "this guys' a Lavin-lovin Blue Fool" or "this guy's a never-happy crank."  

Sorry, but I'm in the middle, and straw-manning my stuff is weak sauce.  I mention we're weak on speed because of recruiting -- do people think that's an excuse on our coaching staff?  

Saying BYU is pretty good isn't "making excuses" or playing up a team.  Just because they're not in a BCS conference means less and less each year as well-coached teams with unique schemes and a few good players can do very well.  At this point in our program, I will be happy with a win and will not fret over style points based solely on the size of the victory scoreboard.  (did all of you read the word SOLELY there? The last post wrote "based purely" to say the same thing)

If the team executes well and so does BYU and UCLA wins by one score, I'm happy.  If the team plays very poorly and shows serious flaws that indicate many future losses, but still wins by 20 because BYU makes a lot of unforced errors, I'm happy that we won but disconcerted.  Heck, I was plenty happy  when McNown-to-Melsby led our 1998 team to that last-second win at Oregon State, but concerned that some flaws were exposed.

I haven't missed a home game in a long time, but I had to leave CA unexpectedly for a few months.  I'll be rooting for my Bruins from here in TX.  You all can have the last word on this topic.

by BruinEric on Sep 6, 2007 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

There are two approaches to this game
Those Bruins fans with BCS aspirations for UCLA believe that the Bruins must win and win convincingly.

Those with less lofty goals merely want to enjoy a Bruin win, period.

Therein lies the difference in outlook regarding this game.

by bluegold on Sep 6, 2007 8:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ridiculous
If our football team, which by and large are expected to do great things (not Romper Room "great things" like 9 wins) then beating a MWC team at the Rose Bowl should be a cakewalk. Otherwise, we're looking at our struggle against Rice last year (wasn't that the second game as well?) as a cautionary reminder of how last season fell apart.

If I'm going to believe that this season is going to be different, there damn well better be some evidence on the field.

And you're "surprised" that we aren't ripping on a heavy running performance where one of our backs almost went for 200 yards? Imagine that. That's the kind of stupidity equivalent to throwing unconditional support behind a coach with the second worst record since WW2. Since this isn't the Romper Room, you can check your shock at the door. I'm pleasantly surprised the people at the Romper Room can actually use a computer instead of drooling into a cup all day.

Guess what, our basketball team may not always "destroy" inferior opponents (you probably define this as a 20+ point win) but they also don't abandon fundamentals (see: ND) and lose unexplainable games to said inferior opponents. Like you said, if it's working, stick with it. Our basketball team just "works", our football team to date does not. Your comparison is invalid.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 6:38 AM PDT up reply actions  

Playing up an inferior opponent
is the ploy of losers.  Lavin used to play up the likes of Northridge, Pepperdine, etc. after losing to them.  Rather than admitting he was a lousy coach, he tried to convince people that the opponents were actually excellent teams, and therefore losing to them (and at Pauley, for heaven's sake) was no shame.

I am whiffing a scent of that here.  BYU is not in UCLA's league in any way, shape, or form.  Plus, we are playing at the RB.  If UCLA cannot trounce BYU, then you have the Lavin deja vu all over again with KD.  

by bluegold on Sep 6, 2007 6:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

Just for the record...
Howland plays up inferior opponents all the time.  He does it in a very classy way giving teams their due respect.  That's all any of us should be doing to an extent.  If we play up their difficiencies, then our win will look like nothing.  It is always about striking the proper tone.  We should win, but we shouldn't be dickheads about it either.

by isodore on Sep 6, 2007 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

I take slight issue with that
The misconception is that Howland schedules an easy non-conference schedule because it isn't always filled with "big name" schools. However, as our SOS rankings the past few years have shown, the teams he brings in to play us usually are solid teams that simply don't get recognition. Two years ago when we were bringing east coast teams into Pauley, there was much complaining and whining, but when Selection Sunday came around, and many of these "no name" east coast schools ended up winning their conference and earning tournament berths, the whiners were nowhere to be found. Go figure.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

Howland DOES play inferior opponents
all the time.  That's because with the athletes Coach Howland recruits and the way he coaches them, we're BETTER THAN OUR OPPONENTS.

by Fox 71 on Sep 6, 2007 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ah
A clever play on the "hardest schedule in the country" bit.

Touche, Fox.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Fox
breaking out the BOLD type.  I love it.  

Don't get too techno on me.  There is something quite charming about being "old school."

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

Bold = accident
I was putting in some &*$# to use for swear words, and I found out that anything between asterisks comes out in Bold.

by Fox 71 on Sep 6, 2007 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not in UCLA's league???
No kidding, Mr. Obvious. BYU is in the MWC and UCLA is in the PAC-10. Are all of your classes there this easy?

Now seriously, to say that BYU is not in UCLA's league "in any way, shape, or form" is a pretty bold statement. Much like Mike Belloti who said before (and after) the LV Bowl that BYU could not compete in the PAC-10. Hmmm...that would explain the 30-point drubbing they got from an "inferior" MWC team. Inspired to play that game? Who knows. Frankly it doesn't matter to this game. You UCLA fans want to bring up past history between these two teams as if it somehow portrays BYU as being a weak, over-hyped program. Well, in those "past" years the Cougars haved logged big wins over Penn State, Oklahoma, Kansas State, Miami, Texas, Texas A&M, Washington, Georgia Tech, Notre Dame, Arizona State, Oregon, Virginia and Michigan. If you want to count historical events then you have to acknowledge these wins. All-Americans, Hall of Famers, a Heisman, Outland, Butkus, and O'brien award winners. Dozens of NCAA records in passing as well as three current NFL head coaches who began their careers at BYU (Andy Reid, Brian Billick and Mike Holmgren).

To say BYU's program is anything less than successful is ridiculous and obsurd. Relating this to the game this Saturday, BYU WANTS to play teams like UCLA. They have every intention to come in and leave with a "W". So your Bruins better be ready to bang because the Cougars will not roll over and die.

by Slugger on Sep 6, 2007 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

Alright "Slugger"
we get it. You guys are big, tough as nails, and BYU has an unrivaled legacy in college and professional football, with a coach who runs the tightest ship around, with 6 gigantic running backs and linebackers who eat nails and shi* out steel.

We're sorry we posted on our UCLA football forum that we want to win by 2 touchdowns. We're so stupid and ignorant.

Really, now the main point I take away form all this nonsense is that the Provo fan base has one gigantic Napolean Complex, and that everyone BYU football fan is walking around with a huge chip on their shoulder.

Ultimately, most of the activity here has been set off by the big talk coming out of the BYU players/fans...

by norcalbruin95 on Sep 6, 2007 3:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

LOL AWESOME REPLY
you gotta love the BYU fans' passion for football though.

I kind of looked at this game as a gimme before the season and was worried about UTAH.  All this activity has made me a little more worried about BYU on Sat.

Vegas has us +7.  Also Tracy on BRO predicts a 6 pt. victory.  I mean, he's just another fan but still.

I wouldn't be surprised if we won by 2 touchdowns though.

------ formerly bruinmikeh

by bruinduro on Sep 6, 2007 8:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's the 2nd Game
of the year.  Who knows how good BYU is.  I just read an ESPN article that ranked BYU's defense as the 10th best in the country (incidentally ours was ranked 8th best - http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=feldman_bruce&id=3003092).  I wouldn't discount the Cougars as much as people are and if you're expecting a 3TD+ victory a la Stanford, then prepare to be dissapointed.

That being said, I expect us to win by double digits (10-12), and to play a solid game (no turnovers, limited penalties, solid tackling, good play calling - taking what their D gives us).  Our D will have to carry us for most of this game and help provide the O with good field position.

Go Bruins!

by DblBruin on Sep 6, 2007 8:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

1983 game won by BYU was not at the Rose Bowl
It was played in the LA Coliseum.  You'd have to be over 25 to know that.  Great game. Steve Young proved he was headed to the NFL (by way of the old USFL).

by mindzeye on Sep 6, 2007 8:10 AM PDT reply actions  

Pretty sure you are wrong about the Coliseum
According to the website, the Rose Bowl was our home at the time of the 1983 game.  

http://uclabruins.cstv.com/facilities/ucla-rose-bowl.html

by Free the 16 on Sep 6, 2007 8:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

PUT YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR MOUTH IS
First, let me set the record straight.  I'm a Bruins fan all the way to the bone, but there are some problems with this article.

Hey, this isn't meant to be an antagonistic comment, but I was noticing that both the Vegas oddsmakers and the Offshore bookies are both pitting UCLA as only a 7 point favorite.  I think it's funny that all of us UCLA fan posts are predicting a huge win, a blowout of "at LEAST 2 touchdowns" as one person has said here.  And yet, if you want to REALLY see what the statistics show about the upcoming game, check the odds.  UCLA will probably win, but neutral parties are really predicting a close game.  

Now for another soapbox moment.  To point out that BYU is 1-6 against UCLA is ridiculous.  Those were different teams, different times, different players, different coaches.  There's no comparison.  Saying BYU is 1-12 in road games against ranked opponents since '99 is a much more telling statement.  Still, their coaching staff has only been around for the last 2 years (this being the third), so even those stats aren't as important as current trends.  Last year, BYU was 1-1 against ranked teams on the road.  

Finally, to say that BYU has to have a "dominating" win, or to have more "plays over 20 yards" is ridiculous.  A win is a win, a first down is a first down, and UCLA would be stupid to overlook that.  

UCLA will probably win this one, but the game is going to be a lot closer than the embarassing arrogance of this article supposes.  

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 9:27 AM PDT reply actions  

Uhm
Yeah. I am sure you are a UCLA fan.

Our previous record against BYU is absolutely relevant because we are going to judge our team's performance in this game based on what our program has done in the past against non BCS conferences.

If you were actually a UCLA fan you would know the expectations we have set for this team which has been affirmed all over the place in last few weeks including from our own players.

Dorrell and his supporters have pointed to this year as - the year - for years. We are expecting a BCS team at UCLA. And we expect a BCS team blowout teams like BYU at our home turf. Its that simple.

As for BYU fans if this post bothers you guys that is tough sh!t. This post has more to do with what we are expecting from our team, our coaches. If you are all hot and bothered about it, then talk about in your forums. But if you come here to engage in drive by flaming, you will be gone. And no one here is going to feel sorry about that.

by Nestor on Sep 6, 2007 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

I hate to generalize
but where do all these sleazy BYU fans come from?

I distinctly recall A LOT of fans of other schools visiting BN and showing a lot of respect and class during March Madness.  It is too bad we are not, so far, seeing the same type of class from the BYU trolls visiting BN.

There must be some quality BYU fans out there.  It would be nice to hear from them if they want to say something intelligent and non-insulting.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, but...
It's OK for us to judge ourselves based on what we have done in the past, but what we have done in the past is not an indicator of what's going to happen in the RB Saturday.  

Secondly, expectations are always high, at least for me, even when we lose to Rice on the road in the 2nd game.  If we lose to BYU this weekend, I will STILL have high expectations, but I'm trying to show that the reality is that this is predicted by those who "put their money where their mouth is" to be a closer game than you think.  And what's KD supposed to say?  "Guys, I think this team sucks. I can't wait for next year."  Sure, the planets seem to really align this year for us, but in the end, you have to realize that a coach is never going to be pessimistic.  Just like the offensive line Weber at BYU said, "This is the best offensive line I've ever been around."  Do you think he's going to say anything different?  That's what coaches have to say!

It's OK to have these high expectations.  But don't get all hot and bothered when people come in here with a little dose of reality and suggest that there's a possibility you could be wrong.

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hot and bothered?
It is actually you coming on here, taking the time to register an account and insult the moderator right off in your first comment.

So I hope you are looking at a mirror before accusing someone else being all "hot and bothered," by some "article" on BN.

by Nestor on Sep 6, 2007 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

say what....
"Secondly, expectations are always high, at least for me, even when we lose to Rice on the road in the 2nd game." - from your post.

Jackass - UCLA did not lose to Rice.  That right there shows you are an idiot BUY fan.

You are a loser.

by FullertonBruin on Sep 7, 2007 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's so sad
that you try to preemptively diffuse criticism by lying and saying you're a Bruin fan when the rest of your post (including the tone and pronoun misplacement) clearly indicate that you are not one.

I will take the likely justified assumption that you are a BYU fan, and correct you on the subject of arrogance. We are consistent in our lofty expectations for this season, and beating inferior teams (and yes, BYU is an inferior team) on our home field convincingly is part of the package for a BCS contender. I am not comfortable PREDICTING that we will have a 2-3+ TD win over BYU because we have struggled in the past against inferior teams en route to mediocre finishes. HOWEVER, if this is truly the year that this team and this coach meets the self imposed expectations, then it is necessary that BYU become a victim of a blowout at the Rose Bowl.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 10:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Rice?
Thinking that BYU is an inferior team is probably correct.  They are from a smaller conference and a mid-major program.  But so was Rice.  And look what THEY did to us.  It would be much classier if we would welcome BY-WHO to the Rose Bowl, give them the same respect that we ought to give to ALL opponents (even Rice, even Appalachian State), and then beat them soundly.  Stuff like I've seen on this post though is probably just going to be fodder for BYU bulletin board material, and most of it (including stuff I've said, as a BRUINS FAN) is premature and speculative anyway, just like all of these types of sites.  Speculation and prediction I can handle.  It's arrogance and rudeness that's embarassing.

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 2:07 PM PDT up reply actions  

Bulletin board material?
Are you kidding me? If this makes it onto their teams bulletin board, then they've lost already, because that means they don't have any real motivation to win here.

You want things to be sugarcoated for all the opposing fans so their little feelings don't get hurt. I couldn't care less. We have enough problems with KD that I am not in the mood to be charitable with praise for other teams. I will call a spade a spade, and an inferior team an inferior team because that's the only way KD will ever be held accountable if he fails to deliver. Otherwise we're back to the old Lavin "they were a lot better than people give them credit for" BS excuse.

BCS contenders beat teams like BYU at home by 14+ points. That's the bottom line.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

"...embarassing arrogance"?
Expecting the UCLA FB team to excell is not arrogance.  First, KD himself says this is his best team.  Second, KD's players have openly expressed lofty goals.  Such proclamations are consistent with the expectation of blowing out a MWC team.

What would be truly embarrassing is to merely eek out a win this Saturday.

by bluegold on Sep 6, 2007 9:40 AM PDT reply actions  

What's he supposed to say?
What's KD supposed to say?  "Hey fans, sorry, but I don't have high hopes for this team.  Let's look forward to next year, because these guys are going to lose a lot of games."  Optimism is in a coache's syntax every single year.  Did anyone hear KD say last year, "You know, I actually think we're going to have a mediocre year."  Instead, he predicted win after win after win.  And what did we end up with?  I'll believe it when I see a "W" for us this Saturday.

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

"...inferior opponent"???
A UCLA blowout over an "inferior opponent".  LOL.  I'm glad you guys think so.  I hope the Bruins on the field believe it will be a cakewalk too.  When you lose you won't have to "play up an inferior opponent".  Just remember and remind your friends, that at the end of last season we were ranked 15th in the nation.  Because we lost our qb John Beck to the Miami Dolphins we drop out of the rankings?  We should still be ranked at 15.  That's not saying that BYU's game against the Wildcats last Saturday was a measuring stick of the power of BYU.  What you saw there was a very conservative BYU game plan.  I'm saying there is definite continuation for BYU from last years success.  The article talks as if this is a rebuilding year.  That's not the case.  Here's the matchup.  Forget about your 300 yds rushing.  That's not going to happen this weekend.  This is a battle against a run stopping BYU defense.  The matchup will be the UCLA passing attack against the BYU passing attack.  If the BYU secondary can get some picks and BYU can keep possession of the ball and move the chains, look for a high scoring but close game -and a BYU victory.

by eric3170 on Sep 6, 2007 11:33 AM PDT reply actions  

Way to go out on a limb
So IF BYU wins the turnover battle by "getting some picks" and the possession battle, then they'll win. Way to stick your neck out there. You'll probably win if you have more points than we do at the end of the game too. Not sure about that one though.

Like it or not, BYU fans are the only ones that believe that UCLA is the inferior team in this matchup. Look at all the national publications that have pumped up the expectations for our team based on the returning talent on the field. They sure as hell aren't basing their predictions on the genius of our coach, so it must be talent. If we lose to BYU in the Rose Bowl, it is, quite frankly, an embarrassment, and KD should be fired on the spot.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions  

Look, Eric
First get something straight.  BYU is an inferior opponent to UCLA.  It has inferior players.  From the stuff I'm seeing here, it has students/alums with inferior intellects.  No wonder Ben wanted to transfer.

Also, Eric, have you ever been to Westwood?  Let's put it this way.  Once Ben (or anyone else) compared Westwood to Provo, the choice becomes pretty simple.  It doesn't take much insight to figure out that if you could have gotten accepted at UCLA you would have been a Bruin in a second.  And we would have liked your spirit and your enthusiasm.  But spirit and enthusiasm needs to have a little dose of reality now and then (although App State proved that it's not that big a factor.)  

BYU is a nice little team from a nice little state in a nice little conference who is coming to town to play what is a big game for BYU but what is in reality a nothing game to UCLA.  It is of course news when an inferior team beats a superior team, and it could happen.  But it ain't likely.  Good luck.  I know you'll come back to crow if BYU pulls an Appallachian State upset, but will you come back to eat crow if it doesn't happen?

by Fox 71 on Sep 6, 2007 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions  

are you serious?
And I thought WE were lofty in our predictions!  BYU wouldn't be ranked, even if they HAD kept Beck.  And if you want to feel like you have continuity from last year, I challenge you to go watch Hall struggle in the red zone last weekend.  Yes, I saw the game.  

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

We need to start keeping track...
of the "Most Ridiculous/Blindo/Homer posts of All-Time" on bruinsnation. I would say that this one would qualify for top-10 honors.

"We should still be ranked at 15" That's a classic.

And speaking of continuity, WOW, you finished on top of the MWC, a mid-major conference with a total of 3  teams that finished over .500. Oh, and you beat a demoralized Oregon team that didn't care to be in the Las Vegas Bowl after ending the year in a dismal slide. Wow, I'm impressed.

Funny thing is, the BYU players/fans seem to be the ones that are talking more smack. Touchy crowd these BYU folks...

by norcalbruin95 on Sep 6, 2007 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

UCLA vs BYU
I will be polite because even though I am a Cougar fan, I grew up in SoCal (born in Santa Barbara) lived in SB, Shandon, Atherton, SD & Pasadena - on Linda Vista overlooking the Rose Bowl). In 1976 I converted to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (BO's church). I have read all the comments and wish to respond as follows:
  1. On paper UCLA should win but sometimes the better team on paper doesn't win (last year you beat USC and as a good friend said who lives in Camarillo at the BYU game last Saturday...UCLA has the 2nd best athletes in LA; USC gets whoever they want); by the way USC came to Utah and stole Havili from us but that is OK because it's great when LDS athletes go to other great programs
  2. We are ranked #10 in the ESPN top 10 defenses in the country (you are #8); wow, that is pretty amazing in itself; so our defenses are close; but if that is the case, our offense should be in the top 10 also because even though we lost Beck (Dolphins), Brown, Harline & Coats (Bengals), our OL is better and according to Coach Weber who is our OL coach and used to be the same with you, is one of the best in the country and our RB's, TE's & WR's are comparable to last year; so that leaves the QB - Hall is not at Beck's level yet but is playing within himself and does not have to be the game winner
  3. Even though someone said you are a 7 point favorite there are other odds makers who have you at 4.5; take away 3 for home field advantage and we are somewhere between 4 - 1.5 depending on whose odds we're using and that means a close game
  4. Even though this game does not ruin our season if we lose, if we win, we have a good chance of running the table and could go to a BCS bowl which would be huge
  5. I make no prediction because I do not know how it will go but I expect it to be close either way
You have a great site and I will be routing for you to knock off USC because you will be in the same position as we are against you.

GO COUGS!

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 6, 2007 12:29 PM PDT reply actions  

Good man
See Cougar fans?  It's not that hard to be a true fan, deliver an intelligent, well-written post in support of your team, and to be respectful at the same time.

I have noted elsewhere that the odds line seems low to me.  I personally see UCLA winning by about 2 TDs, which is why the current line makes me wonder.  The oddsmakers are generally pretty good at their business and setting accurate lines.  So, maybe they know something I do not.

It should be a fun game.  Good luck on Saturday.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Maybe the line is low because
the odds-makers expect a lot of homer betting from delusional BYU fans.  You know, similar to how they set Oakland Raider lines.  

by bornagainbruin on Sep 6, 2007 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

weren't the genius
odd makers predicting our victory over stanford at 14 points?

by bruinbunz on Sep 6, 2007 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yep
And they aren't geniuses, but they are more right than they are wrong.  But they still get it wrong at times.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 7, 2007 5:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

The difference between
SoCalLDSetc and Eric is there to see.  One is a grown-up, one is a kid.

On paper, UCLA should beat BYU handily.  On paper, Michigan beats App. St. handily.  But we play on Rose Bowl Turf, not paper.  BYU is a good team, with well-deserved accolades.  We should win this game, and thus become 1-0 on the season (2-0 if you count scrimmages.)  But if we don't play our best game, or if Mr. Dorrell suddenly becomes Mr. Dorrell again, BYU starts the season 2-0, and we enter the bidding to get Lloyd Carr's services for next year.

by Fox 71 on Sep 6, 2007 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Great comment
Nice job.  I knew there were some BYU fans out there with some class.  Most of the guys who are dredging this stuff up from BYU are really rude.  It's cool to support your team, and yet give credit and respect where it's due.

GO BRUINS!

by Olson Watcher on Sep 6, 2007 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Dangerous game
I think we should win this game easily, if all is right in the world. Unfortunately I am always weary of the KD factor. In case we start misfiring on offense and playing loose on defense, it could be a long day. And if BYU plays a disciplined, mistake-free game, they have a very good chance of winning.

The bottom line is, KD better have this team prepared and on fire. It's the first home game so the crowd won't be as big. Our boys need to have their wits about them. If they play as they did in the 2nd half against Stanford, they should be fine and win by 17. Otherwise, we will be sounding the alarm loud and clear.

by tasser10 on Sep 6, 2007 12:58 PM PDT reply actions  

$$ where the mouths are
BYU posts (except for the adult post). How strongly do you feel about your convictions? I feel strongly enough about the Bruins that I would take the paper odds in the L.A. Times on Saturday morning and take UCLA. Any BYU folks feel that strongly?
Bill
BillSouthBay

by Mensgym on Sep 6, 2007 2:04 PM PDT reply actions  

re the point spread
The casinos and sports books typically know what they are doing in setting the lines, but it seems that the vast majority of bettors see UCLA as being undervalued by the spread 20 to 1 favoring UCLA to cover, in one of the most lopsided "betting trends" of the weekend.

by bruinhoo on Sep 6, 2007 2:31 PM PDT reply actions  

Who drew first blood here?
You guys are making alot out of us Cougar fans being "rude" and talking smack. Uh, you guys pretty much open it up whenever you refer to BYU as "inferior" or a "cakewalk" for the Bruins. Those are insults to us. So yes, we tend to fight back to defend our reputation and what we see as being narrow-minded stereotyping.

That's fine, you all can run your mouths about how "superior" you are. That's all well and good. Just don't whine and cry when you realize on Saturday that BYU is not the pushover you think they are. I guarantee you UCLA will have to play a GREAT game to get past us. UCLA is a paper team, and paper teams don't always win.

I don't want to cast a negative image on BYU fans. Though admittedly there are some that are ridiculously myopic in their opinions. But when we see BCS teams casting names on us such as "inferior" we take exception to it. We (BYU) are unfortunately part of the MWC which has a reputation of being weak. But that doesn't mean BYU is therefore weak. It's baggage we have to deal with every year. Teams like San Diego State, UNLV, Colorado State and Air Force (they compete hard but are physical disadvantages) rarely do anything good so it brings the conference down. New Mexico gets there but never turns the corner. But to just assume that BYU is inferior and UCLA will "roll" is a bit unfounded. Wait, and you'll see what I mean.

by Slugger on Sep 6, 2007 3:00 PM PDT reply actions  

You just don't get it
It doesn't matter how good you think your team is. We have a coach that needs to deliver the goods in his 5th year with superior talent. If you have a problem with your characterization as the inferior team in this matchup, then suck it up and deal with it cause I don't feel like sugarcoating it for you.

I like that we play a team like BYU here in the second game, as they are clearly a solid but not spectacular team, the exact type of team that has been KD's undoing from day one. We have a chance to truly see whether or not our coach is ready to deliver the goods. If he is, we will win by 14+ points. If not, then it will be a struggle as you say. If, God forbid, we lose, then we need to find a new coach immediately. This is about us. It is about UCLA football and the mercurial performance of our head coach.

And btw, the posts here are in response to your delusional boards who don't seem to realize that BYU is NOT favored in this game, and rightfully so.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Actually...
You might want to read the first lengthy post re: BYU titled "BYU Notes: First Look". You'll see things quotes/comments like-
  • "They are a pretty solid team..."
  • "They started this season with a nice win over an Arizona team..."
  • Praising Hall for a solid game
  • Praising Harvey Unga for his big game
  • "the Bruin DL is going to have a challenge on their hand having to stop the BYU rushing attack..."
  • "As for BYU offensive line, it's a solid front..."
  • "...the Cougar defense had a great start in 2007 by dominating an anemic Arizona offense..."
  • "...it was total domination by the Cougar bunch..."
I wouldn't call that "running our mouths" about how superior we are. Mostly, things started to heat up when some bold statements started to pour out of the mouths of players/fans in Provo...

by norcalbruin95 on Sep 6, 2007 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

FYI
This is a Bruin FAN site.  Of COURSE, you are going to hear some rah-rah'ing for UCLA because you intentionally have posted, again and again, on a UCLA FAN site.  Good grief.  

And it's not about who "drew first blood."  Be respectful and stick to reasoned arguments and you can participate in a real debate here.  There is no need to get all bent up over comments which you may or may not have misinterpreted.  And you are confusing our expectations for our program, and our underachieving coach, versus what we actually think will happen on Saturday.  There is a big difference.

Simply because a few idiotic BYU fans posted on BN today, should I take that to mean that all BYU fans are idiots?  No, I don't believe that at all.  

We will all know, in about 50 hours from now, who was right about all this.  

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 6, 2007 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

It's funny that
You say it is unfortunate BYU is in the MWC because in the past the only that has stopped BYU and Utah from joining the Pac 10 has been BYU's academics.

UCLA played a GREAT game on Dec 2, 2006.  If that performance is repeated we'll win by more than 3 TDs.  A solid effort from UCLA on Saturday will get the job done.

by SuperBruinMan on Sep 6, 2007 6:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

academics?
The Pac-10 in the past has used academics as an excuse for keeping BYU out because BYU does not engage in as much research as the average Pac-10 school.  That's because BYU is primarily an undergraduate institution.  If you actually compare the undergraduate programs, BYU compares favorably to most PAC-10 schools.   The average ACT score for BYU undergrads is 27.8.  UCLA, which is also a great school, has an ACT average of 28.  I think most of you UCLA fans know that among PAC-10 schools UCLA is regarded as one of the better academic institutions.  BYU is actually fairly similar.

I'm an Arizona native and I can tell you from personal experience that it was much easier to get academic scholarships and admission at the PAC-10 schools in Arizona than it was at BYU.  Admissions  at ASU and UofA are simply not as competitive.  After attending both ASU and BYU, I can tell you that spills over into the classroom as well.  BYU is a better school than it often gets credit for.

by SomewhatRational on Sep 6, 2007 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Was that the reason?
I hadn't really heard about that, and you're right, if ASU, UA, and SUC can pass the academics bar, BYU certainly should be able to. Part of the problem might be that you guys are an entire state over, skipping Nevada. I know that some teams potentially travel farther North-South right now, but I'd have to think either the Pac-10 is not interested in expanding at all, or it's got to be the travel thing, because the academic excuse doesn't fly.

FWIW, if the Pac 10 does become the Pac 12 at some point in the future, my vote would be for BYU and Utah to get in. Not that my vote counts for anything, I'm just saying.

by Tydides on Sep 6, 2007 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

not many take the ACT
most applicants take the SAT and have one of the highest average scores in the nation. The ACT in CA is, for whatever reason, usually taken by economically disadvantages applicants, so the scores are lower than the average scores for SAT applicants.  The ACT is not a good metric to use when comparing UCLA average scores.
editor, DumpDorrell.com ... formerly posted as DumpDorrell

by BruinCore on Sep 6, 2007 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

True
Most UCLA applicants do take the SAT for admission, rather than the ACT (I can't recall anyone I know that, to my knowledge, took the ACT).

Looking at SAT scores, the current incoming class (Fall 2007) had an average score of 2008 (new test, out of 2400).

According to Princeton Review, under the old SAT scale (400-1600), the average score of a UCLA admit was 1289. That of a BYU admit was 1179.

Because I am bored, here's the rest of the Pac-10:

  • Arizona St: 1106
  • U. of Arizona: 1115
  • Cal: 1300
  • Oregon: 1114
  • U$C: 1350 (with well-documented doctoring of reported data)
  • Wazzu: 1072
Stanford, Oregon St, UW not listed.

Looking at the academic argument, from an SAT standpoint, academics would not seem to be a valid reason to keep BYU from joining the Pac-10. As shown above, only the California schools (and UW, if memory serves) have average admit scores higher than those reported by BYU. Also consider that as state schools, most of the pac-10's scores are likely depressed to a degree due to in-state admission requirements (Cal/UCLA take ~90% CA residents, for example) which do not affect BYU (or Stanford/U$C).

by bruinhoo on Sep 6, 2007 9:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

LOL
Though admittedly there are some that are ridiculously myopic in their opinions.

Really? Any idea where I might find one?

by Ajax on Sep 6, 2007 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

Food for thought
As a BYU grad living in So Cal who isn't often able to go back to attend BYU home games, I'm eagerly awaiting this opportunity to see my team play on Saturday.  And while I respect BN and your right to have any expectations you want about your team (including the desire for your team to roll over every opponent on its way to a BCS bowl and a national championship) and to say anything you want to say on your fan site, I thought I'd offer a little perspective.
  1.  Most BYU fans don't hate Ben Olsen.  Contrary to some posts and newspaper articles, most Cougar fans think Ben did what he thought was best for his situation and would probably have done the same thing if they were in his shoes.  BYU's program was crumbling and he made a decision to go where his future looked brighter.  Some passionate fans would hate any player who left their school for any reason, whether justified or not -- I'm sure you guys can think of some examples at UCLA -- and the media loves to play up the revenge factor because its more interesting than writing stories about how everyone loves each other.  But most BYU fans would love to have had him stay in Provo, particularly after seeing him last week (I was also a huge BO fan in last year's opener when UCLA downed the Utah Utes), and hope he does well every week except when playing BYU.
  2.  We know UCLA's program is stronger and has more tradition than BYU's.  Facts are facts.  UCLA's football program has a bigger budget, gets better athletes, plays on national TV more often, has better weather, plays in a more historic conference and generally attracts more attention than BYU does.  UCLA leads by far in the head-to-head matchup between the schools, has sent more players to the NFL, etc.  But stats aside, there's a reason that you play the game rather than simply letting a computer tell you the statistically likely outcome -- sometimes the underdog wins, and sometimes when that happens it's not a fluke.  So please forgive us for having a bit of the little brother syndrome: when the national media invented the term "mid-major" to impose second class status of any team not playing in a BCS conference, it perpetuated the idea that teams from certain conferences are always inferior to teams from certain other conferences.  When our program is going in the right direction, we've recruited some good athletes, have a system we believe in and coaches who know what they're doing, we (like anyone) aim as high as we can.  So, Fox 71, please save your "superior" and "inferior" labels and your patronizing attitude about our "nice little school" and "nice little conference" until after the game.  If our guys get humbled by your guys on Saturday, we'll acknowledge that we got schooled by a great team.  I only hope there are Bruin fans that would do the same if BYU plays a great game and comes out with the win.  
  3.  The game will say a lot to both teams about what to expect the rest of their seasons.  Last week's win over Stanford was a solid victory for UCLA, but BYU is better than Stanford and will be a good test.  Similarly, while I was glad BYU beat Arizona last week and was encouraged with what I saw from our defense, AZ's offense wasn't really clicking; our offense, while it had its moments, showed that its not yet the well-oiled machine of last year.  A win on Saturday would be HUGE for us.
Can't wait for Saturday -- BYU fans will be there in force in the Rose Bowl.  Here's hoping I don't get an apple in the back of the head like I did at the Coliseum a couple of years ago when BYU played USC.  

by Trickster on Sep 6, 2007 3:26 PM PDT reply actions  

You guys are sooo Cool
Man you bruins fans really think your team craps gold bricks. Are you really that delusional? What happened between last year being one game above five-hundred and this year acting like the freakin Indy Colts? Lets see???....???? Oh you beat Stanford! That means nothing!! they scored 17 points on your d? they only scored more than 17 twice last year. And they had 331 yrds. passing, UCLA had 286. How imperceptive can fans be? You are in for a rude awakening. Craig James of ESPN said BYU would win this game and it is not really going to be an upset. When you come down from your clouds BYU just might be pounding your team into the Pasadena soil. You are USC and CAl's little brother...face it! don't wave the Pac-10 flag too much on other conferences cause some of us other teams in the Pac-10 aren't really sure we like you acting like part of the fam. 7-5!! wow!! oh and didn't BYU route the ducks that kicked your trash last year?

by Boiler on Sep 6, 2007 6:35 PM PDT reply actions  

How stupid can you be?
Stanford had 59 pass attempts last week, more than twice as many as UCLA.  UCLA's passing yards per attempt last week was the highest in the conference (9.86 yds).  And while beating Stanford on the road (by 28) may not mean much, it certainly means more than beating Arizona at home by 13.

BTW- Why don't you actually say what Pac-10 team you're a fan of?

by SuperBruinMan on Sep 6, 2007 6:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

Too funny
My first impulse is to delete comments like this.  They're so devoid of genuine interest; just a cry for help from a myopic troll.  But, then again, it will be fun to re-read these Saturday night after a good win at the Rose Bowl.  So, I'll let it stand as a testament to an apparently large segment of the BYU fan base.  Wow.

by Menelaus on Sep 6, 2007 9:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Setting the record straight
Wow.  As a BYU student and fan I have to say I'm embarrassed by some of the things I've seen other BYU fans post here.  Please don't mistake them for BYU students.  The BYU fan sites that I've seen are largely populated by kids and others who need to tackle basic spelling and grammar before they can move on to rational thoughts.  It looks like some of the same kids have riled up Bruin nation.  That being said, I expect the game this week to be hard fought and not far off from the odds-makers predictions.

by SomewhatRational on Sep 6, 2007 7:23 PM PDT reply actions  

Mormon Kid
What do the majority in Bruins Nation think about a Mormon kid leading their team? Hopefully it wouldn't matter if your QB was Hari Krishna, Buddist, Muslim or any other religion. I think that it's admirable that BO chose to go to UCLA the same as Havili chose USC. I also learned this week that BO is the only married player on your team; I think we have like 33 married players. Yes we will have a fairly good fan base there because LDS members support the team wherever they are playing and other than Utah, there is no other state that has more LDS members than California.

We played USC in 2003 & 2004 and lost 35-18 (National Champs) & 42-10 (not sure how they ranked) respectively and that was when Coach Mendenhall was playing the 3-3-5. We stayed with them both years for about a half and then they wore us down. But we are much better prepared now so I would be surprised if you roll over us. Some one asked us to put our money where our mouth is...most LDS members do not bet but if I did I would tzke BYU if the point spread was 7.5 or higher and UCLA if the points spread was lower than 4.5.

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 6, 2007 11:17 PM PDT reply actions  

Mormon QB
As for me, I couldn't care less what religion he is.  I want quality, talented players on the team and they can worship Homer Simpson for all I care.

Mmmm.  Rich and creamery butter.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 7, 2007 5:20 AM PDT up reply actions  

No one cares
about a player's religion here. Let me rephrase that: we care and respect it, but it doesn't make a bit of difference to us. This is UCLA, nearly every nationality and religion is represented at this school. The more interesting question would be, how would BYU fans feel about an african-american QB, for example? I would venture to guess that the BYU campus is rather homogeneous...

Anyway, we usually try to veer away from politics and religion on this site, and your question was benign enough, but please try not to relate everything to LDS and such.

by tasser10 on Sep 7, 2007 7:15 AM PDT up reply actions  

How to be a saint or a sinner
BYU fans are like any other fans: we love those that get results.  If a guy can play, makes his teammates better, has good judgment and is a good leader he'll be loved by the fans regardless of his religion, race or anything else.  After all, in football the real sins are interceptions, lack of downfield vision, unnecessary sacks and the inability to take charge in the huddle.

by Trickster on Sep 7, 2007 7:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

Who cares what his religion is?
The majority of Bruins Nation DOESN'T think about a Mormon kid leading their team. It's a non issue.

THIS IS FOOTBALL... not church ball!

by UCngLA on Sep 7, 2007 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

religion...
Let me tell you.  My personal opinion.  Religion is a persons private matter between he and his god.  That is why I don't care a lick about a stormin' mormon leading the way.  I wouldn't care if we was an atheist, or anything else.  Here in America we have a big problem where everyone must pronounce their religion and judge others by theres as well.

I just want Ben Olson to be a great quarterback at UCLA and take us to a BCS game and win it, be the Rose Bowl or NC game.

I hope all PAC-10 schools win their non-conference games this week; thanks A LOT oregon state.  Nice way to represent.  What a bunch of hacks.

by FullertonBruin on Sep 7, 2007 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Black QB
We would welcome a black/african/american or any other country QB at BYU. We only have about 6-7 black football athletes but on campus we have students from as many or more countries as UCLA. The Church is in almost every country so members and non-members alike are welcome. We are homogeneous (the correct spelling of the word) which is to say, we are, "of the same or a similar kind or nature" or "of uniform structure or composition throughout". In other words we try to live by our religion (find one of our missionaries to find out what that means. For your information, Tom Holmoe, our AD, and past 49er, and Cal, Niner, & Stanford coach came as a non-member and as did Ty Detmer to name just a few. Anyone is welcome but they have to live by the honor code which means no drinking, smoking or pre-marital sexual relations, or to sum it up, living by the "Golden Rule" and as you said have good judgment.
To wrap this up, "Your fences need to be horse-high, pig-tight and bull-strong. * Keep skunks and bankers and lawyers at a distance. * Life is simpler when you plow around the stump. * A bumble bee is considerably faster than a John Deere tractor. * Words that soak into your ears are whispered ... not yelled. * Meanness don't jes' happen overnight. * Forgive your enemies.  It messes up their heads. * Do not corner something that you know is meaner than you.
  • It don't take a very big person to carry a grudge. * You cannot unsay a cruel word.
  • Every path has a few puddles. * When you wallow with pigs, expect to get dirty. * The best sermons are lived, not preached. * Most of the stuff people worry about ain't never gonna happen anyway. * Don't judge folks by their relatives.
  • Remember that silence is sometimes the best answer. * Live a good, honorable life. Then when you get older and think back, you'll enjoy it a second time. * Don't interfere with somethin' that ain't botherin' you none. * Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance. * If you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is stop diggin'. * Sometimes you get, and sometimes you get got. * The biggest troublemaker you'll probably ever have to deal with, watches you from the mirror every mornin'. * Always drink upstream from the herd. * Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. * Lettin' the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier than puttin' it back  in.
  • If you get to thinkin' you're a person of some influence, try orderin' somebody else's dog around. * Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest to fate!"

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 7, 2007 9:23 AM PDT reply actions  

Just a guess
But, you're the guy whose second from the right.  Am I correct?

<

And, yes, I kid.  So don't bother wasting any righteous indignation on me.

by EricBruin on Sep 7, 2007 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

No offense, but...
have you lost it Man?

First of all, I did spell homogeneous correctly. Read again. And you make my point exactly when you talk about your "Golden Rule".

Second of all, I am a banker, and many on this site are lawyers. If you want to keep us at a distance, please go away.

The rest of your post...I don't even know where to start...but STOP PREACHING. Your little sayings are so cliche they are ridiculous. Did you get them off this month's Daily Affirmations Calendar?

End your comment at "judgment" and it is good. The rest..wow...you're not helping yourself my friend...

by tasser10 on Sep 7, 2007 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm sorry, but...
all 49 sub-sections/amendments of the "Golden Rule" will be broken by midway through the second quarter of the UCLA-BYU game this weekend, and not just by UCLA fans.

Wow, and this "Golden Rule" is supposed to simplify your life?? Sounds like I would need to carry a quick reference book around just to keep track of things.

Please don't take offense to my comments. Just seems you're getting a bit preachy...

by norcalbruin95 on Sep 7, 2007 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

SoCalLDSConvert
Thanks for stopping by, but this is a place for sports, not proselytizing.  I deleted your post because it had nothing to do with sport.  While I respect your beliefs, that is not an appropriate way to share them.  If you have anything to say about BYU football team, however, go for it.

by Menelaus on Sep 7, 2007 11:38 AM PDT reply actions  

I like the quote and the sayings and
I really intend no offense whatsoever because you are saying nice things, but I guess most people visit and post on this site to discuss UCLA sports.  Your postings are venturing, more and more, to subjects completely unrelated to sports.

Again, no offense, but this is a sports site.  Many of us do attend church, or celebrate spirituality in other ways, but we just do not do it here.

I think that is probably where the confusion lies.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 7, 2007 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

M
Looks like you beat me to it.  I intended to post under LDS's (now deleted) post.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 7, 2007 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

Figured
And I agree with you post.  There is a time and a place for everything, and this isn't it for LDS's probably well-intentioned words.  

Of course, if we wanted to discuss the do-nothing Democratic congress, this would be the place....

I keed, I keed....

by Menelaus on Sep 7, 2007 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

What the . . . ?
I don't know SoCalLDSConvert, but I'm pretty sure he was espousing some down home farmer wisdom, not any religious insight.  

Back to the topic of football, an honest question to the Bruin faithful: how is UCLA's D-line and run defense in general this year?  BYU is not a running powerhouse, but our RBs are a bit bigger and stronger than in years past, so I'm wondering what they're up against tomorrow.  I didn't watch the UCLA-Stanford game: how did your D-line and 'backers look, and where do you rank your run defense in terms of team strengths and weaknesses?  The BYU coaches keep talking about how this year's o-line is very good (I wish we could have kept our o-line coach from last season who took a job this year on the U of Colorado staff), but I think our pass protection was been better against Arizona than our run blocking.  We got stonewalled on a couple of goal line plays where I thought our line had no up front surge.  I'm hoping the O-line remedies this tomorrow.

Looking forward to an exciting game tomorrow.  

by Trickster on Sep 7, 2007 11:52 AM PDT reply actions  

Our defense
Here's a great synopsis put together by Nestor. Very good stuff

by tasser10 on Sep 7, 2007 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

The D
is probably our strongest asset, although I keep reading that we cannot tackle well, which is a disturbing report.  

For some reason, the poor tackling issue seems to be a persistent (systemic?) problem at UCLA.   I have been hearing this knock for years and years and I don't understand what the problem is.

But I think our D line is very solid.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 7, 2007 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't get it either
Why has UCLA been a bad tackling team so often? Is it because there are so many good offensive players in the Pac-10? I haven't really heard that knock about the other teams though, we play the same teams. I mean, we've had so many turnstile D's it's surprising. And yet, at the same time, we've produced some great defensive players. LBs and safeties mostly though, not so much on the D-line...interesting...

by tasser10 on Sep 7, 2007 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions  

Keys to a Team's Success
OK, I'm back after being reprimanded, for good cause. This will be my final post until the end of the game, so I come back to the subject at hand. Here is what our Coach Mendenhall said last Monday at his weekly press conference: "Speed is not the only indicator of how good a football team is." "I acknowledge UCLA is well-coached, they are fast and they are athletic," said Mendenhall. "But I believe in: 1) position mastery, 2) execution, 3) team spirit and 4) competitiveness...these are part of a team's greatness as well."

There you have it and if we win on Saturday, I said "if", it will be because of these things and these things only.  Good luck and may the best team on Saturday win.

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 7, 2007 2:04 PM PDT reply actions  

Mendenhall
really said that UCLA was well-coached?. Wow, he's either being really kind, or really doesn't know what he's talking about.
"if I don't do my job, I'm going to get fired" -Karl Dorrell

by godblesstyus95 on Sep 7, 2007 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

There's more to UCLA than speed
If Bronco Mendenhall really believes what this quote implies, BYU will be in trouble tomorrow afternoon.

by SuperBruinMan on Sep 7, 2007 4:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

Congratulations
Bruin Nation-

You won fair & square; congratulations. And, Coach Mendenhall was correct, you are well-coached and it showed today. You have better athletes and we just couldn't get it done when we had to and you did. I am proud of our team for the way they fought back and our fans who showed up in great force.  I am also thankful that we have Max Hall and you have Ben Hall.

Good luck for the rest of the season. Beat SC!

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 8, 2007 9:52 PM PDT reply actions  

Thanks
but with all due respect, we are not a well-coached team, and in fact we were thoroughly outcoached today and damn lucky to win. Look at the boxscore and tell me which team played better today.

With any luck, the next time we meet again we will have our leadership issues properly "dealt with".

And I'm sure you meant Ben Olson

"if I don't do my job, I'm going to get fired" -Karl Dorrell

by godblesstyus95 on Sep 8, 2007 10:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thank you
for returning to BN with some very nice and humble words.

I thought BYU thoroughly out-played and out-coached UCLA.  I thought BYU got some bad breaks with turnovers and a very untimely unsportsmanlike penalty near the end.

I thought BYU deserved to win.  I liked BYU's playcalling and Max Hall played lights-out.

In my opinion, you guys deserved to win.  I also thought BYU's (many, many) fans at the Rose Bowl were very classy.

Best of luck the rest of the way.

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 9, 2007 7:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed
Barnes pretty well says it, but I'd also like to chime in to say how impressed I was with most of the BYU fans visiting the Rose Bowl.  Very classy, and good fans.

by Menelaus on Sep 9, 2007 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

Thank you
I just have to say one more thing: I have run into many fans who came to the game and have been listening to sports radio up here and they all said they were treated like royalty, invited to join your tailgate parties and over all it was one of the best esperiences they've had. Now that is the way college football (after all it is only a game) should be, fans enjoying each other's company and the overall experience. At the other end of the spectrum I know of some places where as a visiting fan you fear for your life.

Thanks BN. you are the NCAA FBCS Champions (Fans Bowl Championship Series).

by SoCalLDSConvert on Sep 10, 2007 3:00 PM PDT reply actions  

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