Bulldogs Destroy Bruins As Ben Howland And His Players Embarrass UCLA In Front Of Coach John Wooden
by Nestor on Dec 12, 2009 3:34 PM PST
in Basketball
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PrintCoach John Wooden is 99 years old. He took time out to watch his former program today by making the trip out to Anaheim to watch what is likely to be one of the last UCLA games he will see in person. Well Ben Howland and his basketball players in UCLA uniform rewarded the Bruin living legend by putting on the most embarrassing display of ugly basketball we have seen in Westwood in years.
Ben Howland, his staff, players, and everyone associated with his program should be ashamed of themselves today for embarrassing the four letters infront of Coach John Wooden. They went down in one of the most humiliating defeats in Bruin basketball history by getting blown out by Mississippi State Bulldogs. The final score was 72-54 (boxscore) thanks to a meaningless second half run by the Bruins which made the score respectable (if you want to call it respectable). Yet, that doesn't matter much because for most the game Ben Howland's players look like bunch of quitters, who played without any sense of purpose or passion, going through the motion like we used to see happen all too often under coaches such Steve Lavin and Karl Dorrell.
The responsibility for today's debacle really falls on Ben Howland who had his team poor prepared and failed to make any kind of adjustments during the game, when Bruins fell behind early on. We just have to look at how he stuck with Nikola Dragovic in his rotation for most of the game, even though Draogic was ineffective and worthless in every aspect of the game. Despite taking ill advised shots, not making much of an effort to play defense or rebound, Howland rewarded him with huge mins (and started him in the second half), sending the wrong signals to his entire team.
What happened today was few steps backwards for a young team effectively negating all the encouraging signs from previous loss against Kansas. Same deal took place against Long Beach State after an "encouraging" performance in a close loss against Butler. The only hope for this season is that we will have something else to think about besides Bruin basketball, thanks to Navy's win over Army this afternoon in Philadelphia. Oh yeah, congrats to our football team for making a bowl game in Washington DC. Back to hoops after the jump.
There are serious problems with our program right now I am not confident whether Howland has the answer. I have always been a huge supporter of what he has done in this program and I will continue to support him for now. However, he has some serious explaining to do about why he continues to stunt the long term future of this program by wasting mins on upperclassmen such as Dragovic and Keefe who do not have the athletic talent, and frankly haven't shown poise and effort necessary to get mins on the court.
Howland also needs to show he is capable of making adjustments to his offensive and defensive schemes to fit the talent he has available to him on the bench. Instead of going with experience, he needs to develop a new core around young players such Nelson, Lane, and Reeves. If he doesn't do it before its too late he will lose his team who will lost motivation to compete and to give 100 percent effort only to see all of their mins going to guys such as Dragovic.
Anyway, as mentioned above thanks to the Midshipmen for pulling out a big win (congrats to Army for giving a great effort). At least we have something to look forward to in our bowl game. The way it's looking for our basketball program, not sure if they will be able get to 10 wins during this regular season.
Again, truly a shameful effort by Howland, his coaches and his players. Everyone associated with UCLA basketball should be disgusted tonight.
GO BRUINS.
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That was pathetic
It’s pretty easy to defend a team that only has one player who can make a shot.
Also, its pretty obvious JA should never start. He can’t shoot, can’t setup anybody else, and can’t play defense.
UCLA '08
I hope coach keeps his health for a few more years.
I would hate for this to be his last impression of UCLA hoops.
Now I'm
goin’ to listen to Miles Davis, crawl in the fetal position and just cry for the rest of the day
mentally compromised
that’s what drago is. with his court date coming up he really cannot focus on shooting. but he never could play defense either. he is purely a shooter and nothing more.
nothing more to say
Recruiting was an absolute failure. Add this to his stubborness and you see the result…
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 3:40 PM PST reply actions
I am just wondering how you could miss so much
on a guard like JA when you have no depth in the position. Basically Howland has built a roster that rests on JAs ability to be something he isn’t.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 3:42 PM PST reply actions
JA isn't the only issue
We could be playing Chris Paul with Deron Williams as backup PG and … ok we would be pretty awesome if that were the case, but while some players show a lot of upside, at this moment our team is deficient in every single position.
Actually no one on this team can shoot the basketball.
Why would he recruit players that have no shooting ability? Honeycutt is supposed to be a player and he can’t even hit a wide open jumper…..He even airballed a wide open 3. I don’t believe in the “freshman” excuse. All these guys do is play basketball and have been since biddy ball.
by LouisianaBruins on Dec 12, 2009 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
In defense of Howland
JA was rated highly by lot of reputable scouts (including people with proven track record such as Greg Hicks). The problem I am having right now is why Howland is sticking with experience of Dragovic/Keefe and others who have shown nothing over their time at UCLA.
It is interesting that guys like DC, RW, LRMAM, AA2 were not highly regarded
coming out of high school, but they played like true warriors, improved, and put the program in the elite status. Ben was at his best when recruiting these types of players.
Perhaps, he started to rely on the recruiting services, and recently selected players based on the number of stars, rather than his gut instinct.
I know JF, AA, and KL were highly regarded.
Just wondering if his recruiting tactics has changed.
by UCLA Championships Made Here on Dec 12, 2009 3:50 PM PST up reply actions
Keefe and Dragovic
are head cases…Keefe is too tentative, and Drago is too aggressive on the offensive end.
Reputable
Howland is not paid to recruit the guys who are backed by conventional wisdom. Instead, he is accountable for recruiting guys who can play ….end of story. And in Anderson’s case, he missed badly. Missing on guys everyone else liked is not an excuse. It wasn’t an excuse for Brian Morrison (Daughtery’s call at UNC) or Ray Young and it certainly inst an excuse for Howland. A miss is a miss and Anderson is a MISS.
Ced Bozeman was a MISS too . .. until his fifth year
But forget that . . . the biggest problem that Howland has not overcome is the UNDERRATING of Russ Westbrook . . . the guy blew up as a sophomore and became a top 5 pick in the NBA. Lets face it, the kid was a 3-star who waited for JF to leave early and got a last minute free ride. Howland barely used him his sophomore year, and he looked miserable as a point guard vs WVU . . . remember that game (which we actually almost won)? Anyhoo, Howland drafted Russ as a 4-year guy . . . and God Bless the kid, he took the money and is kicking ass for Ok City . . . leaving our cupboard bare. Nuf sed.
Too much booze
Howland barely used him his FRESHMAN year . . . and once he postered Boykins at Cal he was all but gone.
You must have slept through Westbrook's sophomore year
In the rush to condemn Howland’s recruiting, you showed amnesia regarding Westbrook’s sophomore year. He wasn’t heavily recruited out of high school, but got a chance to play as a fresman. As a sophomore he was a starter, averaging over 12 points per game while averaging 33 minutes per game BH deserves credit for bringing him in and having him show NBA potential as a sophomorre. I do agree that BH should write off all the seniors except Roll and give the kids a chance to mature and improve. BH is hardly the first coach to mis-judge a high school kid. His recruiting had a lot to do with our making the final four three years in a row.
uclatl
that's certainly a problem
but not having any depth at guard is a huge problem as well. I look at JA and that makes you have to pay Lee at the point, and then Roll at the 2, with a huge dropoff when those guys go the bench.
Hicks loved Anderson, but his only other offer besides UCLA was Kal.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 3:54 PM PST up reply actions
I would also argue
that if this team had guards who could create their own shots, the offense would be markedly improved. It opens everything up. Roll is a good role player, but he can’t create, and having only Lee be able to create his own shot (albeit with poor execution) is killing this team.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 4:00 PM PST up reply actions
you are absolutely correct nestor...it was shameful
BUT CONGRATS TO NAVY…and to the bowl-bound BRUIN FOOTBALL TEAM…and who said we were just a basketball school?…
by bruincheerleader on Dec 12, 2009 3:45 PM PST reply actions
Play the young guys?
Folks, who do you want Howland to play? Lane? Nelson? Moser? These are not Pac-10 players so why play them? It might help them as they market themselves as transfers but these guys are not going to be part of the solution. These guys aren’t even bodies that will supplement the re-birth. Instead, they are complications. Howland needs to spend the next four months convincing 2-3 guys to come play for a 6-19 team.
Why the heck are you attacking Nelson, Moser and Lane?
Lane has been great and you haven’t seen much of Lane and Moser. If you are going to just put up nothing but petty attacks without offering any kind of evidence to back it up, take those petty cheap shots somewhere else.
While attacking Lane/Moser is unproductive
it must surely worry you, N, that they are not doing enough in practice to get themselves some more playing time?
RN is clearly working his tail off and is getting playing time despite not having the most… refined?…game. We know CBH can’t be looking at the game tape and being pleased with what he sees from ND, but he must think that, currently, the other options are worse.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 5:39 PM PST up reply actions
That's a good point
However, I think we still have to w/hold from offering criticisms on those guys and make conclusory statements without seeing them enough with our own eyes.
totally agree re criticising those guys
No value in attacking people we know little or nothing about (at least, any attacks are likely to be ill-informed and unproductive).
My only reason for commenting at all is that there seems to be a vocal contingent calling for those unknown guys to replace ND/JK et al; an opinion that is based almost purely on ND and JK, not on whether or not those unknown guys are actually better players or more deserving.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 9:03 PM PST up reply actions
Lane has been great?
To see Lane is to know Brendan Lane will NEVER be part of the solution. The 2009 recruiting class was a complete abortion and to ignore that FACT does nobody any good. The only way to build is to break this al down and you can’t do that until you accept the truth.
The 2009 class
has played all of 7 games at UCLA. How can you possibly call them abortions (which doesn’t even make any sense by the way)?
The truth
Just accept the truth. We should start over and forfeit the season. Recruit whatever high school wins the California state basketball championship. Take them all as a group. Ha!
um, embarrassing is an understatement
youth is not an excuse. not sure what is wrong with them team, but i’ll start with:
1. free throws…pathetic
2. lack of box-out skills (if you can call that a skill…more of an effort/energy deal)
3. lack of activity/movement on the offensive end
4. getting to loose balls. we never seem to come up with these…where is the effort?
Well, now that I look at my list, I realize that all of that can be fixed by having guys that work hard and put in 100% on every play. So, what gives? Never thought I’d say this, but Howland’s team is full of lazy underachievers. Ugh, it kills me to write that.
Problem is:
Areas 2 thru 4 should all reflect the coach.
We were horrible at boxing out and fighting for loose balls under Lavin.
Not sure what to make of Howland right now.
The best thing you can do for your children is to love their mother. John Wooden
Agree with 1, 2, and 4
I usually would agree with 3, but suprisingly the offense looked the best it has in a long time. The problem was, no one could make the open shots they were getting. There really weren’t too many forced shots and the usually frustrating swinging the ball around the perimeter was largely absent today. The problem is that you could have the best working offense in the world, but if the shots aren’t going in the basket at the end of it, you aren’t going to be very effective.
Is that Howland's fault?
This is speculative but we have heard Howland preach defense, defense, and defense to recruits. It seems like he recruits players that are defensively strong, but not necessarily polished offensively. Roll and Dragovic are good but not great.
The problem is, really good shooting is not really teachable. You can teach somebody to be a decent shooter with enough practice (and whether those hours are available in college are questionable), but not to be a great shooter.
On some occasions we have been lucky to get someone who is very talented from the perimeter (e.g. Collison) but the problem of not having a reliable shooter hurt us in the final four game against memphis too.
Its tough to say
I dragged my dad down to Anaheim today to watch the game with me and during a timeout toward the end of the first half he leaned over to me and said: “It must be tough for Howland because there is nothing he can really say that is going to help them make open shots.”
That really is the truth of the matter. Normally we blame CBH’s offensive scheme for the struggles, but today it seemed to actually be clicking but the shots just weren’t going in. I thought after the Fullerton game “there is no way this team will shoot 35% or below very often this season.” Turns out I may have been wrong and this team just has no ability to shoot the ball. I think this is why ND, for all of his faults and shooting woes, still gets significant time, because he still has the possibility of getting on a streak and knock some shots down.
As for recruiting really really good shooters, if we are talking about shooters the caliber of Kapono or J.J. Reddick, those are few and far between.
CBH is defense first...
so regardless of offense, as long as other teams are scoring more than 55 points, than this team will not win a lot of games. like you guys say, shooting is hit or miss. but defense is a constant. that said, i would like to see more full court man pressure and go deep in the bench. and not pull players after 1 minute if they make a mistake.
Shooting is hit or miss...
but if you have players that either miss or miss you’re also not going to win any basketball games.
Do we really think
that the young players are outhustling ND, JK et al in practice, playing better offense and defense, and then not getting on the court??
The argument that CBH is demoralizing the team by playing ND depends on the assumption that he is sticking with ND for reasons not related to playing merit. I don’t buy that this is in CBH’s coaching DNA.
My concern is not that CBH is (for reasons known only to himself) stubbornly sticking to playing ND. My concern is that no-one is standing up and earning the spot ahead of him.
...
… which augurs poorly for next year.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 3:53 PM PST up reply actions
i think CBH feels like he owes his players...
like in the CSUF debacle, he played his “upperclassmen” way too much when the stats showed the reeves was more effective. he did that last year overplaying JS, DC, AA when he should have been grooming ML, JA, and JM for this year. i wish CBH would develop a good 9 man rotation with solid minutes for everyone and when the game is on the line, play those that have delivered that game.
JA and ND should not start
Id give Honeycutt the starting position and get him more experience. unless the doctor has advised otherwise. more time for MM and less for JK, ND, JA. I dont think Bobo or Moser can fill the front court if we sit JK and ND though.
I was looking at available PGs and there are three still highly rated (not including Mccallum). However, none of them have interest in UCLA or vise versa. Hope Mccallum and Zeigler sign up. they would get tremendous minutes. Unless CBH uses JA like ND this season.
Will someone please post information regarding practice. does anyone have a source watching practices?
who said that BN sources are members of the public?
.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 5:34 PM PST up reply actions
i heard from another coach
that CBH has a tight fist, is very controlling, and throws a lot of F bombs. maybe that’s why if you’ve been there 4 years, CBH feels you deserve to play 30 mins+ a game (ie drago) and why others take if for a while and leave while the leaving is good…
yay! 3 more weeks of football!
something to keep my mind off of basketball…
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 4:01 PM PST up reply actions
Get used to more of this ... This season.
I understand the disgust and embarrassment. But this team is just not capable of any more than what you’re looking at. And right now Howland is hamstrung by a few of his promising freshmen being out of condition to due injuries that they are still recovering from. So, it’s not as simple as benching Drago and Keefe. Particularly with players who have been injured early in the season before they’ve had a chance to truly get into condition, you have to bring them along slowly and also ensure their recovery from injury goes smoothly.
This sophomore class we’ve debated ad nauseum so I’ll save the speech. They are what they are: a bust. To know if Howland’s lost it or not we’re going to have to see how this year’s freshmen develop and how next year’s freshmen play. I’ve been critical of Howland plenty (as long as I thought it was warranted.) I’m not mad today because I knew this was coming based on how we’ve played so far this year. But more than that, he’s now stuck with the team as it is and it’s not going to change overnight. The frosh have to develop and we need another recruiting class, particularly one with a solid point guard that gives this team the floor leadership it needs.
Today’s loss has nothing to do with Howland’s supposed stubbornness or decision to leave Drago in the game. And bringing previously injured freshmen (or any player of any class) along too quickly is unwise. This team is just not that good. Howland can’t coax talent out of them. All he can do is develop this year’s freshmen, and bring in better players. On the latter he has a track record, other than last year’s freshman class,. On the former, he also has a record, other than last year’s freshman class. Let’s hope he gets back up to form. But to freak out over this game means you haven’t really paid attention to our team’s performance on the court this year.
Why are they quitting though?
That has nothing to do with talent or injuries. Play hard dammit!!! Have some pride, like we all do about the 4 letters. I guess that’s asking to much, and we should give them time to learn how to do all that….
Bruin-4-Life!!!
Very good points, Die Hard.
Thank you for posting with clarity. A bust is a bust. I’m not even sure Jrue would be making too much of a difference.
33 Wins. Yeah, I said it.
Why not bench the upperclassmen with less talent and attitudes
In the 1964 Championship game on of the starters, Jack Hirsch, found himself on the end of the bench, having been supplanted by a better player. It happened with John Wooden, and it can happen with the current coach as well.
Bill
Mensgym
How bad is it?
Easily as bad as Howland’s first year when a dry cupboard was the reason.
This year? It’s shocking. It’s safe to say we will not be dancing in March, and the question arises if we can even beat USC this year.
DID YOU HEAR WHAT i SAID?!
The best thing you can do for your children is to love their mother. John Wooden
"But you ain't go no legs Lt. Dan."....
And you ain’t got no players Ben Howland. Classic picture, MexiBruin.
Seriously, this was like watching my Pepperdine Waves play Gonzaga. I’d say that, but it’s an insult to my Waves.
I may work with the Waves, but I'm still a Bruin!
Hey hey hey
You can’t use Lt. Dan anymore. I stretched that analogy as far as it could go with CRN… :)
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
Why is
Dragovic getting so many minutes? At this point, he doesn’t deserve to wear those four precious letters. 0-for-9 from the floor, no defense, no rebounding.
The team’s performance was disgraceful today, especially in front of the great Mr. John Wooden. I can’t believe this team couldn’t show some heart and try to fight for a win in front of the greatest coach of all time. Just pathetic.
Well we looked bad
because we were bad. However, Mississippi came in at 6-2 with one 1-point loss, so they could easily have been 7-1. Compare that with our record and remember that, at one point in this game, Johnson was 10 for 11 in 3’s while Varnado had rejected everything close-in that we threw up, and the score is not so surprising. But ND’s minutes trouble even me. What was he, 0-9, or worse? He did make sporadic contributions, but seemed completely unfocused. Of course, I understand that we really, really need another outside shooter, and, except for Lee, I don’t see one. It can’t hurt to bring TH in and begin to build something new; One thing — giving the younger players more minutes isn’t going to transform this team. At present, only RN can really hold his own in a college game. You may like MM, BL and JMM all you want and scorn the efforts of ND and JK, but development is a slow process, and almost all young players show a lot of inconsistency. Personally, if any one of them can make free throws, I’d almost settle for that. And give up this stubborn, no-adjustments theme. If any group ever needed a system to rely on and bring it together, it is this one.
Another sobering fact
We are 2-6, and haven’t played any games outside of LA/Orange County. Yikes.
It’s going to be a looooong year.
"I don't forget very much" Rick Neuheisel, 11/28/09
lol
unlucky popnfried, try trolling again
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 5:32 PM PST up reply actions
Too soon
to be asking that question, IMO. He was definitely our guy as recent as March of 2008 when we were playing in our 3rd straight FF. In just 21 months, we are already asking if he is not?
I think Howland deserves most of the criticism being laid out in this thread and others. I believe we are in the midst of a serious rebuilding period with this progam. He has already shown he can rebuild a program that had been decimated under other coaches watches, now he has to show that he can rebuild a program that has been decimated under his watch.
We lose some credibility as fans by pivoting so fast on our positions with our coaches. By UCLA standards, we had a subpar year last year. It seems inevitable that we will have a subpar year this year. I think we have to wait and see what happens next year before we even consider bringing that question to the table.
"I don't forget very much" Rick Neuheisel, 11/28/09
don't waste your breath BM
on another thread he posted “Fire Howland – I’ll justify this when I get back from…” something. Don’t rise to it.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 5:40 PM PST up reply actions
Not a waste at all
I think we can pretty much expect this question to pop up here and there throughout this season as the losses mount up.
"I don't forget very much" Rick Neuheisel, 11/28/09
ok
just cut and paste your response each time it comes up then, to save the rest of us the bother :-)
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 6:13 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed
But I just wanted to point something else out about the comment. I personally don’t know PopnFried, but his account says he’s on True Blue LA, the Dodger SBN site. During the season, “_ is not our guy” became a recurring (sarcastic) joke people would use on there for someone who maybe didn’t do too well, but we obviously should support. There’re posts that Broxton, Loney, Billingsley, Torre, Troncoso, and probably everyone else on the team “is not our guy.” So the original post could be something of a joke.
I think that's a fair question
Has Coach Howland somehow lost his touch seven games into the season? Is he no longer the guy who rebuilt three different programs? Has he had some horrible brain injury that no one knows about that has made him forget everything he once knew about basketball?
If the answer to any of these or to other similar questions is in the affirmative, then we should fire Coach Howland instantly and hire …, well, let’s see. Who should we hire? I suppose we should hire a guy who rebuilt three different programs. Oh, wait. That would be Coach Howland.
I think the answer to the question is that Coach Howland has not forgotten all he knew overnight. I would like this team to put it all together, but if it doesn’t, that doesn’t change my perspective of Coach Howland by one millimeter. He is our guy. He is the proper caretaker for the program.
That said, I don’t have an answer to things, but to borrow from a tirade from Bobby Knight a few years ago, Coach Howland has forgotten more about the game of basketball than his critics on the BN will ever know. The sniping should end, and the support should be redoubled. I guess I have thoroughly swallowed the Kool Aid Coach Howland is offering, but it seems to me to be pretty tasty.
I would trust Einstein in physics ...
… except that even after his many incredible studies (many people say 5 Nobel Prizes worth), he was dead wrong in denying quantum mechanics for many, many years. I would trust Greenspan in economics … except his beliefs were challenged by the recent financial crisis (e.g. questionable repealing of the Glass-Steagal law). You can’t be successful like Einstein, Greenspan, or Howland without being correct most of the time, and believing in yourself 100% of the time. However, things change and even extraordinarily intelligent people can be slow to adapt.
Fox, you’re probably much more well-versed in debate than me, but you’re appealing to authority and reverse ad-homineming. I agree that CBH deserves patience from us (for instance if an unknown coach took over right before last season we would undoubtedly be calling for his head), but I vehemently disagree that his strategy should not be questioned. Anytime results are not in line with expectations, the approach should be questioned.
Basketball changes. Can CBH go from in-tune to out-of-tune in just a few years? Yes, because he has not yet dealt with or had to recruit this many AAU-type players before, but with this one-year rule in place, he needs to learn how in order to have a strong chance at winning the NC.
In terms of getting a new coach—completely unnecessary, I agree, but Dixon from Pitt comes to mind.
Dissapointing
Coach Howland is definitely not coaching too well this year. He never makes adjustments (not even really at halftime) and he wastes timeouts in the first half. He still refuses to go to a zone defense (although I heard he was thinking of playing one). He seems to be a good practice coach but not a good in-game coach. Our free-throws are horrible, they remind me of Lavin’s last few teams at the foul line. As many of you all have stated above, I hope he puts in more youngsters and focuses on improving for the next few upcoming seasons.
And Blue Me, you make a very good point.
I said it before and I'll say it again...
In over 40 years of listening and watching UCLA basketball this is the worst team I have ever seen. It is beyond embarrassing. The problem is obviously more than just one missing player or point guard or injury. It is systemic. Profound miscalculations of recruiting and coaching are at play here.
It is not just the lack of wins or the amount of losses. As Coach Wooden taught us so well over the years, success is based on simply trying your best, not the outcome. And that is what is so disappointing about this “team.” With few exceptions the effort is simply not there.
The cancer wasn’t just with DG apparently. It’s broader. Unfortunately, the responsibility for this lies on CBH’s shoulders. Given the dismal talent we have I really could care less about our overall record at this point. I will be happy if CBH can just find a group of players who leave it all out on the floor every game win or lose. I think there are 5 to 7 guys on this team who are willing to do that. I think we can tell who they are when they’re in the game.
Just play those guys and let the rest sit on the bench, regardless of their seniority. They won’t stink so much there if they never work up a sweat. Either wear those four letters proud or just go home, baby. At least that’s a start.
I don’t see how you can really coach a team with quitters, head problems or just bad attitudes. DON’T PLAY THEM. Once CBH finds those core guys then we can talk about strategy and all the other BS. The rest is meaningless until then.
This is a crisis season now. CBH is coaching for his life. As long as he benches the babies and goes with the hustlers I will support him no matter what the record. It is a season for cleansing. Let’s do it and be done with it.
GO BRUINS!
10 wins?
Not at this point. CBH is so damn stubborn that I can see him riding this ND thing to the end. I’ve been to all but one home game this year, but I don’t think I can drag my a** to Pauley on Tuesday. This is sick…… How can I cheer these guys on after watching then quit like that in front of the Wizard?
Bruin-4-Life!!!
CBH is clueless on lineups and rotations
Let’s be honest, we were beat by a better team today. However, the biggest problem for me is that CBH continues to disappoint as an in-game coach.
The biggest problem is that his lineup and rotations make no sense. As soon as I saw JA in the starting lineup with MR at small forward, I knew this was a loss. JA is not a starting point guard, period. MR is not a small forward. We have lots of big guys and only three guards, go with a bigger lineup.
ML and MR should each be playing 30 minutes a game with JA playing 10 minutes backing up ML and MM playing 10 minutes backing up MR. JA and ML should never be on the floor at the same time. Ever. Their games are too similar in that there only offense is driving and neither can shoot. Used appropriately and in conjunction with a shooter like MR, this can be effective. But you cant have both JA and ML out there together when JA’s game is just an inferior version of ML.
Hopefully TH’s development will force CBH to start him at small forward and move JA to the bench. TH really was the lone brightspot today.
Thankfully JK only played 5 minutes and that was still probably 5 more than he deserved. Its amazing to watch JK make 20 jumpers in a row before the game starts and then appear like he has never played basketball before when he plays in the game.
The reason that JK and others seems so tentative out there is that there is never any flow to the game under CBH. CBH’s use of timeouts is a topic for another day, but the bigger issue is that there is no plan as do his substitution pattern. Someone makes a turnover and gets beat on defense and CBH just looks to the bench and puts someone else in. This causes players to play scared because they don’t want to make mistakes and leads to talented players becoming scared shells like JK is. RN has already started to play a little more timid and I fear it is just a matter of time until CBH causes TH to be more concerned about getting yanked than making a play.
Besides for creating scared players, the fact that CBH has no pattern at all to his substitution pattern leads to know chemistry on the court. No lineup is ever in for more than four or five plays together causing them to never get into a flow. I would like to think that CBH will get things figured out as the season goes on, but as long as he continues to haphazardly substitute and play JA way more minutes than he is capable of handling, CBH and his team will continue to disappoint.
And that is the frustrating thing
If you and I can see that this is a problem, how come CBH or no one on his staff can. I have to think that his staff aren’t idiots, but maybe they are just “yes men” who are too afraid to tell CBH to consider something else.
don't buy 'playing scared'
I think this claim is way overblown (that CBH pulling players for lapses in concentration somehow makes them into terrified children).
You don’t see him yank players for excusable mistakes, like missing a free throw or something. He yanks players who have a let down in concentration.
If ‘tentative’ means ‘passing up on bad shots early in the shot clock’, that’s part of the offensive philosophy. If you think ‘tentative’ means not crashing the boards aggressively or something, overaggression on the boards is rarely something that gets a player yanked, so that doesn’t fit. If ‘tentative’ means giving an offensive opponent space in front and refusing to be beaten easily off the dribble, that is part of the defensive scheme. If ‘tentative’ means not overdribbling into traffic and being stripped, then that’s also part of the defensive scheme.
I think this ‘playing scared’ thing is something that has been repeated over and over until people accept that it is true, without actually being something that is true.
He benches players for mental lapses, not for making mistakes. If you are a player, the answer should be to concentrate for the full shot clock every possession. I don’t fault CBH for that. If the reaction of players is to ‘play tentatively’, then I fault them for their mental weakness and suggest CBH recruits players of greater mental fortitude.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 6:00 PM PST up reply actions
So I guess that expains Drago...
Howland would rather have a player who makes mistakes after mistakes and doesn’t execute, as long he is not making mental lapses Takes controlling to a whole new level. That is scary.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 7:12 PM PST up reply actions
well...
I’m guessing that complete inability to execute would mean that you wouldn’t get on to the court in the first place (e.g. I will never be as much as a walk-on at UCLA, on account of my suspect jump shot…. And my 5’9’’ 190lbs stature…)
Howland must think ND’s shots are going to fall more often than they do.
And if you want to get a team to play intensely for whole series, it makes sense to pull people who don’t concentrate for the full 35 seconds, and doesn’t make sense to pull people who take the right shot in the flow of the offense and happen not to make it. [not making this an argument about ND; just about the difference between ‘mental lapses’ and ‘not making shots’]
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 9:08 PM PST up reply actions
agree with everything..
.. but I would add JK and ND on the court at the same time as our 2 bigs makes me vomitous as well. That should never happen. I would like to see us umm say not stick to man on man when we can’t guard anyone on the court. I too believe JK is a shell of a player. But maybe lets try something different with him like stop trying to make an interior player and rebounder out of someone with no legs and try him instead off the bench as a 3. If he makes 20 straight jumpers in warmups I do believe with him the contact and banging take it out of him. Get him away from contact and play a zone so he then doesn’t have to guard a 3. Put our 2 biggest bodies like JM and RN out there with him and I am pretty sure he will make maybe 1 more FG than dragovic today.
I still can’t believe I watched that entire game and we stayed in a man-2-man. I would like to believe it is something he is doing for the long term, but then I see ND in there the whole time. I also am wondering if he thought we had any chance to compete even for a second. I think we sort of kind of pressed at the 2 minute mark. Which is to say we merely picked up our man-2-man full court in CBH terms.
As for JA I have said enough about my displeasure with him, but will add he sadly probably played his best game of the season today. And that unfortunately might be his ceiling. He just does not deliver a crisp pass ever. I am pretty sure he has never seen a cutter. He does not work to get through screens on defense ever. And like many Bruins who cut through the lane he is never looking to receive a pass.
Except for a couple players almost everyone out there does not expect to receive the ball. I would like to play point for them for a day just to fire basketballs off our players noggins cutting through the lane. In fact that would be a good drill for this team to throw the basketball as hard as I can to every player as they move toward the basket or when they post up or when they come around a screen. Whoever can figure out how to catch the basketball will start.
I know people have also given up on Morgan, but he is big and gets in the win. He can’t however play defense on the perimeter on that hedge. But he does make himself available to catch a basketball inside and that alone is a reason to get him in the game and play a zone. Only RN has shown a propensity to do that as well, so I can’t figure out how we can ever have a lineup without one of them on the court since we can’t shoot. Going small usually indicates you are either pressing and playing up tempo or you can really shoot the basketball. We don’t try one and we can’t do the other, so going big to me is our 1st best choice. Which leads back to the original point that MR, JA and ML should never be on the court together.
The bottom line...
…is that for every stud CBH has brought to Westwood, he’s brought in at least two scrubs. Now it’s caught up to us, because all of our legitimate guys have left for the NBA or graduated. Let’s take a look at past CBH recruiting efforts:
2004:
Jordan Farmer: Warrior
Arron Afflalo: Warrior
Josh Shipp: Warrior
Lorenzo Mata-Real: Warrior
DeAndre Robinson: Scrub
2005:
Alfred Aboya: Warrior
Luc Richard Mbah a Moute: Warrior
Mike Roll: Role Player
Darren Collision: Warrior
Ryan Wright: Scrub – Transfer
2006:
Russell Westbrook: Warrior
Nikola Dragovic: Super Scrub
James Keefe: Overrated Scrub
2007:
Kevin Love: Warrior, but one-and-done
Chace Stanback: Scrub – Transfer
2008:
J’mison Morgan: Scrub
Malcolm Lee: Possible Warrior
Jrue Holiday: Overrated Scrub and one-and-done
Jerime Anderson: Clueless Scrub
Drew Gordon: Psycho Scrub – Transfer
2009:
Tyler Honeycutt
Mike Moser
Reeves Nelson
Brendan Lane
Anthony Stover
Seeing that our 2009 recruits are freshman, I think it’s a bit early to post any judgment on them yet, especially since we’ve seen either very little or none of Honeycutt, Moser, Lane, or Stover.
Ironically, if Stanback stayed, he’d be playing major minutes. Dude couldn’t be patient and man up and play defense. Sucks for him.
Look at the guys we’ve brought in. Since 2006, the only two players who came in with legitimate talent were KL and RW. They’re both in the NBA now. Since 2006, CBH has failed to bring in any quality players who would form a foundation for this next generation. There have been no players like JS, DC, AA2, or LRMAM brought in since 2006. That’s four recruiting classes and I’m seeing a lot of hype, but no results. The perfect example of that is Jrue Holiday.
I love the defense and toughness CBH brought to our program and there’s no denying what’s he’s done in the past. But in the past he did it with guys with the mental toughness to accompany the physical tools. The guys he’s brought in since 2006 are all soft. And I still have no idea why we brought Dragovic in. Forget his off-the-court issues: on the court, he sucks. Period. His defense sucks. His offense sucks. He’s too soft to play power forward and he’s too slow to play small forward. What the f**k is he good for? And what’s more disconcerting is that no one is able to steal his starting spot from him.
Howland needs to pick it up on the recruiting trail. He needs to stay away from the super-hyped AAU prima donna assholes like Gordon and Holiday and get back to going for tough-nosed guys who will work their ass off like LMR, LRMAM, and AA2. You find those guys and bring them in. You then bring in a couple stars, but not a whole class of AAU prima donnas. That’s why our teams worked before: JF and AA were the stars and their supporting cast did a hell of a job with tough, blue collar work. There’s no way UCLA smells a Final Four without AA2, LRMAM, and LMR. Period.
That’s what we’re missing and our recruiting shows it. It’s on CBH. He needs to turn it around and bring the guys we need who can turn this around.
by Bellerophon on Dec 12, 2009 5:43 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
IMHO
LRMAM was the key to our success for 3 years.
He had a great nose for the ball on the offensive glass (making our offensive possessions much more productive on average), but was our most important defensive player. That isn’t to denigrate the other players who played some great defense on those great teams, but LRMAM was absolutely key to the scheme because of his speed and length, for his double-teams in the post and weak-side help. If someone got beat, he was there; when other players had their men will defended he had quick hands for a deflection or a steal.
He WAS a tough-nosed hard-working kid. But I think he shouldn’t be classed as ‘only’ a tough-nosed hard-working kid; throwing him in with AA2 and LMR (two of my favorite players, but basically one-dimensional hustle and energy guys, with great character) underrates how talented LRMAM is, and, most importantly, how much he was the perfect fit for a role in CBH’s defensive schemes. No-one on the current roster can play that role in the same way.
by britishbruin on Dec 12, 2009 6:12 PM PST up reply actions
Bellerophon
Your rating of scrubs made me LOL. We need to go to Cameroon and get some true Ben Ball Warriors ala Luc Richard & AA2.
by UCLA Championships Made Here on Dec 12, 2009 8:19 PM PST up reply actions
Something's Wrong Here
To paraprhase from Dr. Henry Lee during distinguished Trojan alum O.J. Simpson’s murder case, there is something really wrong with this team. I don’t think it is just the lack of talent – most of these players were highly recruited coming out of high school. I also don’t think it is just lack of experience. There is a lack of chemistry on this team. It seems to me that there is often a lack of effort and teamwork. I think I saw the beginning of this around the middle of last season with the dreadful losses at home to ASU and WSU, the Pac-10 tourney debacle against $C and the drubbing at the hands of Villanova. Now, I am witnessing the worst UCLA basketball team that I have seen in over 40 years of watching UCLA baskeball – worse than the Lizard’s last team, worse than anything Hazzard or Farmer put out there and worse than Howland’s first team. A friend of mine who is a very distinguished former athlete saw the team in the Tucson airport after their horrible loss there last year and noted the lack of camaraderie on the team. That Drew Gordon left indicates some problems and I’m not sure that’s the end of it. I hope Howland can get the team back on track, but I have my doubts I’m sorry to say.
Nestor, you took the words right out of my finger tips
I was there today and it was pretty pathetic. I will try and give a little analysis of what I saw, but you said a lot of it.
I cannot believe this was a Ben Howland-coached team. They weren’t boxing out, they were taking any and every shot, there was no discipline, no effort-except for 10 minutes in the second half-and they don’t play good basketball. I said to my friend that it looked like MSU was playing a JV team. It was embarrassing. I couldn’t believe that was a UCLA product out there.
Mike Roll, get this, Mike Roll is our best player. Not the most potential and talent, but he is the best player out there. He plays aggressively and with a lot of energy. He has matured to a good player for Ben, but he shouldn’t be our most effective guard. Drago and Keefe are ineffective and wastes of scholarships. As long as Ben brings in guys like this, he’s wasting opportunities when someone better could help the program win. Those two along with Ryan Wright, Chace Stanback, Drew Gordon, Bobo Morgan, Anthony Stover and Brendan Lane have me concerned about Howland.
Which leads me to this. Why are those three-Lane, Stover and Morgan-including Moser, on the bench so much? That’s another 4 scholies right there. If they’re not ready, then play them and get them ready. Otherwise we’re wasting time and scholarships. I just don’t get the feeling Ben knows what the hell he’s doing with this team, this year. He seems like he doesn’t yet know how they’re going to gel and what is the best combination.
Another thing is his timeouts and substituting. Why is he calling timeouts with a tv one coming in 7 seconds on the game clock? And he’s never going to get continuity and confidence instilled in his players with all the constant substituting. I have to believe he knows what he’s doing, because he won a lot of games. It could just be that he lost a lot to the NBA and this is a young team that will take time to develop.
Here are the good things. Anderson is going to be a strong point guard for us. He can penetrate and is a good athlete. He needs some touch on his shot, but he can get the ball into the paint and dish and can get the ball to the basket quickly. He did it a couple of times today. Lee showed some moments of passion, but seemed frustrated. He can turn into a good player. Nice shot and nice move to the basket. Moser needs to play more. He seems underdeveloped physically, but could be a serviceable and effective guy for us. Seems better than Drago for sure.
One thing about Bobo. At one point he was playing interior defense and I watched his footwork and technique. It looked weak and imbalanced.. He looked out of position and now I know why Howland hasn’t played him. He’s not very athletic and he’s awkward. He can be ok inside on offense, but maybe it’ll take time for him to develop more.
And lastly, Honeycutt looks very promising. He moves fluidly around the court. This is a UCLA athlete right here. Needs work on his shot, but can be a good one.
Altogether, it was just an undisciplined and lazy looking team today. Maybe there will be improvements in increments, but this was a perfect opportunity today to play well against an ok team. Just think if it were Georgetown. They would have had their starters out by midway through the second half. The team needs to understand that Final Fours and success aren’t automatic at UCLA. It takes commitment and discipline.
I completely agree with Bellerophon's comment!
“Howland needs to pick it up on the recruiting trail. He needs to stay away from the super-hyped AAU prima donna assholes like Gordon and Holiday and get back to going for tough-nosed guys who will work their ass off like LMR, LRMAM, and AA2. You find those guys and bring them in. You then bring in a couple stars, but not a whole class of AAU prima donnas. That’s why our teams worked before: JF and AA were the stars and their supporting cast did a hell of a job with tough, blue collar work. There’s no way UCLA smells a Final Four without AA2, LRMAM, and LMR. Period.
That’s what we’re missing and our recruiting shows it. It’s on CBH. He needs to turn it around and bring the guys we need who can turn this around."
You should make this a separate post, I couldn’t agree more. These players have issues and think they are better than they actually are. They need to man up and start playing some basketball or all transfer out.
Tough, hard-working, blue collar players are fine
we can also use players that can put the ball in the basket. Period. Shooting 32% won’t get it done, I don’t care how tough you are. Shooting 46% from the foul line will add up to a lot of losses as well.
It would be nice if we could get both.
"I don't forget very much" Rick Neuheisel, 11/28/09
A counter view
I can’t think of an NCAA champion in the past decade that did not a heavy dose of AAU talent on the roster. If you want to win, you have to take the most talented players and learn how to run a system that develops them and maximizes their talent.
I love the movie Hoosiers, but the world doesn’t work that way, unfortunately. You either have to learn to fit those type of AAU players in, or you have to accept that you may never get to the top of the hill playing with the blue collar guys. And I don’t think that is necessarily a bad thing, but you can’t hold a coach to National Championship standards and expect him not to recruit the most talented guys available. The key is can he make the transition personality wise and scheme wise to play with different types of players. That’s where the verdict is out on BH this season.
We had a great run at the final four, but we got blown out twice by Florida and once by Memphis, getting torched by teams with more talented and deeper rosters. You can argue Memphis was because of poor coaching on the defensive matchups, but regardless, we weren’t in that game.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 12, 2009 7:22 PM PST up reply actions
We're on the same page actually
The most “talented” guys, or your perception of talent, in many ways is controlled by the Scout/Rivals/AAU hype machine. That’s the problem. Who was the most talented guy in the 2006 recruiting class? James Keefe, the McD’s All-American, ND, the supposed Serbian sniper, or the 3 star kid who only snuck into UCLA because JF left early?
That’s my point: these kids were all part of the AAU hype machine. I think CBH has shown, during our Final Four runs, that you can make it to the big time with a blend of hard-working guys and elite talent. JF and AA were superstars in high school. But CBH built around them and gave them the right blend of hard-working blue collar guys to help them succeed. Moreover, when you bring in the high-hype AAU type guys, you need to bring in guys with the AA attitude, not the JH attitude. It makes a huge difference.
Why did we lose to Florida and Memphis? We were missing one piece. If you look at CBH’s recruiting classes, his Final Four teams were perfect, except for one piece: a 6’6" or 6’7" small forward. Someone athletic but long. Because that’s who killed us: Chris Douglas-Roberts and Corey Brewer. Tyler Honeycutt fits that mold and I’m glad CBH is finally waking up to that, but obviously, it’s a little late now and the jury is still out on the freshman.
Why do teams like George Mason, Butler, and Siena sneak into the Big Dance? How does a team like George Mason, with no AAU talent, make the Final Four? Experienced, hard-working seniors. You can’t bring in five superstar AAU hype machine headcases every year. You bring in one or two guys, the cornerstones, the faces of the program. But you build around those guys with somewhat less talented, hard-working, bangers. Guys who will get the nasty rebounds and play tough defense. Guys who will be in the program for 3 or 4 years. Combine that experience with young, elite talent and you’re golden. In other words, surround your Kevin Love with a LRMAM, a JS, and a DC. Give him a LMR to spell him off the bench. You’ll find yourself in the Final Four.
by Bellerophon on Dec 12, 2009 10:33 PM PST up reply actions
You can't make a strategy out of exceptions
George Mason was an exception. Butler was an exception. Siena was an exception. None of them won the NC. Russell Westbrook was an exception. There are AAU and hyped players that are overhyped (and it is the job of the coach to determine which those are). There are also three star players that should be one star (and it is also the job of the coach to determine which those are).
You’re comparing Russell Westbrook (who was probably the only three star player that had his potential) to James Keefe (who was probably the most questionable McD appointment that year). This is a false comparison: to answer your question, you’re right: the top player of the 2006 class wasn’t James Keefe, it was Kevin Durant.
agreed
its great to find the undervalued players, and it stinks to get stuck with an overvalued players, but by and large hyped players deserve the hype, and those considered to be the best coming out of high school are the best coming out of high school. Again, by and large.
You can’t just say you only want to avoid the overhyped ones. I think every fan, coach, and booster in the country agrees with that. The question is can you recruit the hyped ones, can you do so in a balanced way (enough guards in our case) and can you develop a program that keeps them properly motivated and performing at the highest level? Blue collars great, hungry is great, but neither of those things cut down the nets without a lot of all world talent.
"when you've seen how big the world is, how can you make due with this?"
by silverlakebruin on Dec 13, 2009 9:58 AM PST up reply actions
I don't think those programs are exceptions
Every year, and I mean every damn year, some mid-major makes major waves. Sometimes it’s George Mason, sometimes it’s Davidson, sometimes Siena, and sometimes Butler, etc.
There is one thing every one of those teams had it common: senior leadership. They had a core of players that provided a solid foundation. Those teams all were lacking something: star power.
Our Bruins have plenty of “stars” (especially if you listen to the fools at Scout and Rivals), but no senior leadership. That’s the point I’m trying to make. You need the right blend, like our Final Four teams had of superstar-type guys (JF, AA, KL) and 3 or 4 year type guys (LMRAM, AA2, and LMR).
by Bellerophon on Dec 13, 2009 11:15 AM PST up reply actions
Also, you're misreading my comment
I said:
Who was the most talented guy in the 2006 recruiting class? James Keefe, the McD’s All-American, ND, the supposed Serbian sniper, or the 3 star kid who only snuck into UCLA because JF left early?
And you responded:
You’re comparing Russell Westbrook (who was probably the only three star player that had his potential) to James Keefe (who was probably the most questionable McD appointment that year). This is a false comparison: to answer your question, you’re right: the top player of the 2006 class wasn’t James Keefe, it was Kevin Durant.
Technically, yes you’re right, but I’m comparing RW, JK, and ND because that was our 2006 recruiting class. What I’m saying, is when you look at our 2006 recruits, who was the best of that group? It was RW, who came in with very little fanfare, not JK, who was a McD’s All-American.
Same story for DC. He didn’t have any of the hype associated with being an AAU superstar like JH. He was a four-star guy, but rated only the #11 PG in his class. Maybe that’s accurate, but that understates how key he was to our success.
The bottom line remains: CBH has failed to bring in quality recruits. Whether that’s due to the hype, or not, it doesn’t matter. His job is to bring in guys who can win, who will compete, who will play tough defense, and since 2006, with the exception of KL and RW, he has failed.
by Bellerophon on Dec 13, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions
At the same time, almost all of those mid majors lost decisively in the final four.
What’s the difference? At some point there is a ceiling of potential determined by your talent — your effort can get you there, and it’s high, but it can’t get you past, it’s not infinite.
I didn’t really misread your post, my point is that the mistake that year is recruiting James Keefe, not recruiting an AAU hyped player.
And every damn year a mid-major makes the final four, maybe—but not the same mid-major.
I think your way may be doable, and I’m really no expert, but I also feel that we would get more consistent shots at the NC if we can identify and manage top talent (a lot of which happens to be in the AAU).
Again
I’m not saying we should not bring in AAU guys. I’m saying we need AAU guys like JF and AA, with the right attitude, not AAU guys like JH. We need to surround those guys with talented, hard-working blue collar type players like AA2 and LMRAM.
The perfect Bruin squad, in my opinion, would have been KL, LRMAM, JS, RW, and DC, but with the missing piece that cost us against Memphis and Florida: the 6’6" or 6’7" athletic swingman. We have that kid, in TH, but he’s young.
Next year I’d like to see ML, Tyler Lamb, TH, RN, and Josh Smith start. They’ll be young, but if we keep that core, I like our chances, especially if ML can put it together this year.
I have a feeling we're saying very similar things
in a different way. I think we’re arguing for slightly different proportions of AAU players if at all, but that’s academic considering my level of basketball knowledge (very low).
I agree that KL, LRMAM, RW, DC + an athletic swingman 3 pt would be great, but I just feel that RW and the swingman would typically be AAU players (RW was extremely late in his physical development). Also LRMAM was a huge exception not having played basketball until relatively late in life and then exploded his first year, so on average I think a player like him in the US would also be AAU.
Klay Thompson..
How can so many people misjudge Mychal’s kid?
I wish...
BH could only be involved with the program during the tournament.
Very yung team
We just need to be patient with this team. They will get better later in the season. We Just need to be Patient. Bruin Fans
Just wondering if having some of CBH's top assistants
Ernie Zeigler and Kerry Keating leave the program left a huge hole in recruiting and game planning.
We’ve mentioned how Chetey Petey’s program lost many top assistants and how they are paying for it now.
We can’t underestimate the work of assistant coaches.
by UCLA Championships Made Here on Dec 12, 2009 8:36 PM PST reply actions
Head Coaches
Head coaches and wins are probably related like US presidents and the economy. They get far more credit during good times than they deserve and far more blame during bad times than they deserve.
You are probably on to something with this…
UnbelievableH
I’m a 22 year old girl surrounded by only peoe that hate the bruins in other words I spend 95% of my time defending them. To do so I watch almost every single team to be able to compare and argue where my bruins are stronger
I’m sick of this freshmen excuse, I really am. All over the country there a freshmen that are coming in ready to play and helping their team progress where it seems ours “aren’t ready and need to benched” to give minutes to seniors that wouldn’t even take off their warm ups at other schools.
I realize the sophomores were a highly rated class and yes I sometimes see some flashes but u don’t want flashes from ur starting players… You want a solid 35 min. I’ve always been frustrated with walking it up the court and wasting the time clock but at least DC could make an offense if he needed to.
Today my mom got mad at me ( I go home almost every game for the big screen and having to have it on fox sports) because I was compaining every possesion. It was painful. There wasn’t much defense and the fact that I’m shocked when we make a shot is beyond me. When they showed our fg % to be 27 I almost puked. The sad thing is I cringe when someone finally makes a 3 bc I feel like drago will feel the need to throw more bombs
i don’t know what’s going on with the recent recruits but I can only hope it’s not a lack of talent but can someone explain to me simple things
1. How is it a possible to be at a caliber d1 basketball team, be a starting guard, and be horrible at free throws?
2. How is it possible that on any turnover I can’t even get excted bc we won’t score? I love how hard RN plays I really do but I cringed when he got the break away and just softly laid it up against one of the top players of all time
3. Is it too much to ask for players that can contribute immediately to a team?
4. Why oh
by millikinbruin on Dec 12, 2009 9:18 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Stupid iPhone posted that too early
4. Why oh why can’t we seem to get a team that can play together? I feel like it’s a rotating door and the next second the same players never leave
all in all Im gunna be taking a lot of beatings this year but no matter I’ll keep asking them when Illinois is finally going to win their first title
by millikinbruin on Dec 12, 2009 9:21 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
The problem isn't the freshmen
it’s the crappy seniors they play with…
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
Yes, Mike Roll is our best player.
And, while I mean no disrespect, because I hold MR in high regard, that is our problem in a nutshell. Also, I think all of your comments were highly perceptive, bruin95. And millikinbruin knows what she saw, too. But hey, isn’t New Mexico State next? And didn’t they lose to Cal State Fullerton worse than we did? Fans can’t give up.
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