Student Ticket Transfer System
by Sideout11 on Dec 7, 2009 4:53 AM PST
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PrintBumped. This post/thread is a great starting point to think about solutions to some of the issues we have been discussing re. attendance. GO BRUINS. -N
So here it is. There is one painfully simple way to make sure the student sections of Pauley are filled every game, and that is to implement a ticket transfer system. First though, a quick description of the student ticket process for those of you who aren't familiar.
Every year students who want tickets enter a lottery, because the demand for basketball tickets far exceeds the supply. The packages available are the blue package, the gold package, and for those lucky enough a full package (both blue and gold). Each package contains tickets to all home football games, all non-conference basketball games, and half of the team's Pac-10 games. For the 2 biggest games of the year, $C and whichever marquee non-conference opponent we play (i.e. Kansas), one game is a part of the blue package and the other is a part of the gold. The reason they split the games up into 2 packages is so that more students are afforded the opportunity to attend, and of course to make more money.
Now here comes the problem. The tickets that students receive aren't paper tickets. Our tickets are electronically placed onto our BruinCards, so the only person that can use them is the person whose face is on the card. This system would work beautifully if everyone showed up, but that is completely unrealistic. In fact, the university is counting on that fact that only about half of the ticket holders will show up to non-conference games, otherwise they would have to divide those between the 2 packages as well.
As of right now no system is in place that allows students to transfer or sell their electronic ticket to fellow, less fortunate students. I know for a fact that such a system exists for regular season ticket holders. If one of them can't make it or has an extra ticket, they can call CTO and let them know. CTO will then place their ticket up for sale online and at the ticket office. My opinion? CTO is completely money driven, so of course they would set up a system to transfer $80 dollar tickets while completely ignoring the $5 dollar student tickets.
Now, I am as diehard as they come, and even I have had to miss a basketball game or 2. My freshman year I did not have any tickets and was only able to see the great KL and RW twice (both times Gen Admission, both times over winter break). Last year I had the Gold package, but had to miss the U$C game because I was in the hospital earlier that week. This year I can go to every game, but missed Humboldt State (pre-season) due to work. My point is stuff like this, unexpected or not, happens.
Now I have been on both sides of the ball. I have given my ID up to someone else before, and I have also used someone else's (at great risk I might add-the ticket lady was nice enough to overlook the mis-matched picture). This proves that there is a large student market out there for basketball tickets, but currently we can't do anything about it. Every student knows there should be a transfer system, and every student has complained to Game Staff, CTO, and USAC alike about there being no such system. There may be students who only want to go to a game or 2, and that is fine. There are also students like me who would go to every game, but don't receive tickets. Not everyone can make every game, but together we can fill them all if only the university would let us.
This brings me to my final point, and that is that we students need your alumni's help. We have complained over and over, but our cries have fallen on deaf ears. We even elected student representative Thach Nguyen (email: GenRep3@gmail.com) who promised to work towards a transfer system. Of course, that is the same Thach Nguyen who organized the Bruin Bear Security Force, so I'm not holding out much hope there. I plead to you alumni, let the money speak. Our student tickets are so cheap that the CTO doesn't care what we have to say. It's clear, however, that they care about their season ticket holders, about the people paying $100/night and making exorbitant donations to fund the Pauley renovation. We need you to go to bat for us.
I know that there must be some alumni reading this site who have connections in Athletics, USAC, or CTO. If so, WE NEED YOU. We're tired of seeing Pauley half full and you're tired of seeing Pauley half full, so let's tighten the screws and turn up the pressure on the university. I honestly have no idea who would be "the" guy or girl to talk to about this, but CTO would be a good start. Just make sure you don't start yelling at the first person to answer the phone. Ask for a manager, because CTO is mostly student employed. Their contact info is below.
Website: www.tickets.ucla.edu
Phone: (310) 825-2101
Email: cto@tickets.ucla.edu
Thank you in advance for you help, and Go Bruins!
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of BruinsNation's (BN) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of BN's editors.
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How about a system that other shcools used
Anyone who would like to can purchase a season basketball ticket, but you must buy them for the entire season. It is placed on your student ID and you swipe it to get in. If you get to the game and the section is already full, you swipe your card then and you are refunded the price of the ticket. You can only be refunded if you show up for the game, but it’s already full, not because you just didn’t feel like going. How would the students feel about something like that? If you buy a season ticket and you’re willing to show up (or show up early enough), you get in, no matter who you are.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 10:52 PM PST reply actions
Who cares about the refund?
I mean ya it would be great to get refunded. However, there might be more incentive to get your ass there early so you don’t lose the money you spent on buying the ticket
by lil eg not cs on Dec 6, 2009 10:53 PM PST up reply actions
I think a refund is fair
for those who showed up for the game, but the section was already full. I don’t want a refund for people who just didn’t feel like going, but if you show up, I would like you to get a refund. If 5,000 people had tickets, but there were only 1,500 seats available, I would imagine that there would be fierce competition to show up early and get your seat.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:03 PM PST up reply actions
I think there might be a time management problem with that system
If you’re someone who doesn’t feel that showing up early is worth it than yeah you don’t deserve to have tickets. But what about situations like deciding when you will have time to study of having a commitment like work just prior to every Thursday game? Making the effort to show up and then then finding out you can’t get in can be pretty disheartening and might lead to a lack of trying in the future.
This isn’t meant to criticize you because personally I wouldn’t have a problem with that system. However, I think that student’s time is often so stretched that there just wouldn’t be enough incentive to show up and hope there is room left (incentive for most that is, not me and my fellow diehards).
The key, then, seems to be
finding the right amount of tickets to sell so that the student section will always be near-capacity, but barely ever be over-capacity. The system is in place right now, it’s just not really publicly advertsed, and it never happens (i.e. the student section never fills up, so students never have to get refunds). If it happens once or twice, fine, no big deal. That wouldn’t discourage people from coming down.
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 6, 2009 11:14 PM PST up reply actions
Yes
and I actually had no idea that there was a refund system until you mentioned it. However, I still don’t think it would solve the problem of tickets being tied to a specific student, unless you sold an ton of tickets in order to ensure Pauley would be full. That would help non-conference attendance, but then for games like Kansas half of the school would need refunds
I don't see a problem with refunds
Even if it is a huge number of students. Unless you believe in Fox’s system that any student who wants to should get a ticket, students will be left out. Choosing who gets in based on a first come, first serve basis seems like the fairest way and certainly fairer than whether or not you win a lottery.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:23 PM PST up reply actions
There would be some problems
Unfortunately, there isn’t a system out there that will work for everyone. It’s just not possible, but would more people be left out because of the system I proposed or by the current system where possibly thousands (I’m not sure of the number. I’m guessing based on what I’ve read/heard) are unlucky with the lottery. Also, a system like the one I proposed would probably lead to some camping out not just for lower level tickets, but to just get in at all thanks to the increased competition for a space, so a person can camp out for a day or two and not have to worry about being there 5 hours before tip. You get your number in the morning and you just need to get there when the rest of the students do.
I think the system I proposed will serve a greater number of students, create a much fuller section and a better atmosphere because the students there will have “earned it” (poor phrase choice but I can’t think of a better one), making them prouder of their space in the Den and therefor more passionate. No system can serve everyone, but I think this can serve the vast majority. I understand that you’re just pointing out possible issues though, something that should be done with anything brought up.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:21 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah
I guess we will just end up disagreeing slightly on this one. I definitely think that your system would work, and I would have zero problem with it. I just don’t think it would be the most effective. A ticket transfer system would open up opportunities to every student to attend at least a few games, without having to front the cost of an entire season (although the loyalty aspect aka “earned it” that you described would be a huge plus – I just think we’re too apathetic for that to be realistic)
I can see some of the advantages of your plan
and it would be much better than the current one, but this is why I think my plan is a bit better.
1) I fear that such a system would lead to students who have tickets, but not much interest in the game selling the tickets to other students so who gets in can be partly determined by who can pay the most. Scalpers selling regular tickets I can deal with because the Morgan Center has set ticket prices, but for students, who pay very little for each ticket for being students, selling the tickets for profit would irk me. I don’t want people to get in because they can shell out the cash to a fellow student for a big game.
2) You’re still going to have people missing out on a lot of games because they didn’t win the lottery. These could be people who are very passionate and very much want to be there, while others who win the lottery could give away/sell the ticket for most of the game and just show up for the 2 or 3 big ones a year. People will be left out, but I think rewarding the loyal and passionate students is a better plus than making sure everyone can get to a game or two a year.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:54 PM PST up reply actions
On Sideout's plan
From what I read, it seems that he is not thinking of a direct ticket transfer, but something along the lines of ticketexchange (but without the ability to sell for above-market prices), or a mechanism of releasing unwanted tickets into a pool that CTO could draw from for further student sales.
I share your concern regarding the possible scalping of student tickets. The entire idea of student tickets are to provide a below-market value way for students to attend games. If people holding such tickets do not use them, I don’t think they should be able to take the surplus value for themselves.
formerly bruinhoo
Selling student tickets
One possible way to avoid student scalpers is to have the system put all tickets back into a pool. You would not be able to sell “your” tickets directly to someone else. If you give up your seats, then the first student in the waiting line without tickets gets the next available and so on and so forth.
A variation to your plan...
I have been bouncing ideas around my head regarding the student ticket situation for a long while, and while my plan would differ from yours a bit (mine may be too complex for CTO to want to deal with), one part of it might fit well with yours.
Implement an online claiming system for basketball tickets. Sell as many student ticket plans as you like, but require students with the plan to claim their tickets for each game in advance – if ticket claims < student capacity, everyone gets in. If claims > capacity, hold a lottery. If a student claiming a ticket for a particular game does not show up for that game, don’t let them claim one for the next game (or some other deterrent to claiming tickets for a game one cannot attend).
formerly bruinhoo
by Patroclus on Dec 7, 2009 12:01 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Consequences
I like this idea a lot. You would probably have a lot of games where anyone who wants to attend can attend. During particularly good years with high demand, then everyone still has a shot as the season goes on for any particular game.
I also like the negative consequences for failing to show. I have also heard that some schools do points for attendance. The lottery could incorporate some sort of uneven probability thing where students who attend more games have better odds. This would encourage attendance early in the season to build your points to boost your chances later during Pac-10. A lottery with points would encourage and reward attendance and the most committed fans, but it would still give a chance to those fans who are casual or for whatever reason have too many commitments.
Attendance points
Virginia does this (at least when I was attending) for basketball, as do some other schools. I think it is a good place to start for the reasons that you mention, plus the possibility of throwing in some additional attendance incentives into the mix. UVa’s system also gives attendance points for attending some non-revenue games/matches, an idea that I like for two reasons: The ability to encourage student attendance for our lower-profile sports teams (if only 1-2 games/season per sport); and, in the event of a lottery draw, to give a leg up to those students that have shown the most commitment to Bruin athletics.
formerly bruinhoo
Other sports
Very cool that they use the system to encourage attendance at non-revenue games (emphasize the golden games??). Maybe Chancellor Block can dig deep into the memory banks and share this with the Morgan Center.
nobody
cares about getting their money back to be honest
At $3, I can't blame them
In terms of fairness though, I can see the existence of the policy (denied entry to a specific event that you have a ticket for).
formerly bruinhoo
I believe we have the refund system in place
At least, when I worked with Marketing from 07-08, we did have that system in place. THe only time we ever had to refund tickets was vs Stanford in 08.
slow down, look up
If you have the refund system in place
then why limit sales to the lottery? If you can refund the price of the ticket to those willing to show up, just not before the section is filled, sell a season ticket to anyone willing to buy one and the first however many that get there to fill the section get to be there.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:01 PM PST up reply actions
Completely agree
It makes economic sense for the Athletic Dept and practical sense to fill up the section
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 6, 2009 11:02 PM PST up reply actions
from the official website
6. In an effort to accommodate as many students as possible, more applications will be accepted than we have student seats in Pauley Pavilion. Approximately 4,000 men’s basketball ticket plans are allocated to UCLA students. In the event of an overflow in the student section on game day that results in you not being admitted into a men’s basketball game, if you are a Basketball Den Season Ticket holder, you may present your Bruin ID to the ticket office on game day for a refund based on the prorated amount paid for the ticket (approx $3).
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 6, 2009 11:04 PM PST up reply actions
It still doesn't make sense to me
Accept all applications and that’s the end of it. No half-season tickets or anything like that. Season tickets or no season tickets for anyone who buys them and be one of the first 1,500 there or however many seats there are and you get in.
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:10 PM PST up reply actions
One aspect where Virginia gets it right
Although UVa differs in that student tickets are covered by a part of student activity fees (=“free” tickets). For football, show up at the stadium, swipe your student ID, and as long as capacity is not exceeded, you are in. For Men’s Basketball, submit a ticket claim online within a set time period. If student capacity is not exceeded, everybody gets a ticket; if capacity is exceeded by claims, run a ticket lottery for that game.
UCLA’s use of an off-campus stadium negates the practicality of the above for football, but something along the basketball plan, especially if the season ticket pool is expanded, could work.
formerly bruinhoo
by Patroclus on Dec 7, 2009 12:34 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I think the refund system is in place
Just in case more than the allowed students show up for a game, especially non-conference. Personally I think that the juggling act CTo pulls with regards to how many students they think will show up is absurd
wait
i worked in marketing from 07-08 too lol… is ths jeff?
Haha
To be fair, I worked with Ticket Sales under Jana, I wasn’t one of the Marketing Interns. I’m Chris, although I do think I know the Jeff you’re talking about…
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 7, 2009 1:06 AM PST up reply actions
Does anyone remember what attendance was like pre-05?
My first year at UCLA, 2004-05, was the last year that they gave out paper tickets for basketball games. You had to actually go to CTO in October to pick up your sheet of tickets for the entire game. But these tickets were not matched up to anyone in particular. I remember my first year in the dorms, we used to pass tickets around constantly.
My question is, does anyone remember what student attendance was like back then? I remember being able to show up 30 minutes before a Pac 10 game to sit down low. I remember going to Pauley at 6 am and still getting a priority pass around 200 or 300. But I don’t remember how full the upper sections are.
slow down, look up
I was there just before you (fall '02-spring '04)
Keep in mind that this was the very end of the Lavin experiment, and the beginning of the CBH era, and the excitement for baskeball on campus was relatively low (particularly in ‘02-’03). My memories are similar to yours; I rarely if ever camped out, because for most games, I didn’t have to. In the first year, I could show up when the student gates opened and get on the floor without issue for most games. In the second year (CBH’s first year), things got a bit tougher, but I could still go to Pauley in the morning and get a priority number.
formerly bruinhoo
Haha the funny thing is
I COMPLETELY forgot that Lavin had been there before I was a student. Clearly I’ve blocked out a few certain seasons from my memory…
I wonder if the switch from paper to electronic tickets was strictly a money/convenience issue, or if they specifically didn’t want students to transfer tickets.
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 7, 2009 12:00 AM PST up reply actions
Forgot to mention something
There are a lot of other options to consider, I just think that a transfer system would be the easiest and most effective solution. It would require no change to the current lottery process, and the cost of setting up an online transfer system would be minimal.
It also strikes at the heart of the “Well I can’t go because…” problem, because if you can’t then I guarantee there is someone on campus who can. That person can buy your ticket from CTO, and CTO can then use that money to refund you. Everyone wins, and CTO can even charge a small service fee should they be so inclined, so they would be happy also.
Two things
both related to being the easiest solution.
1) I’m not sure I want the system easiest for the CTO/athletic department because IMO, they go the easy way far too often instead of the best way and it’s bugs the heck out of me when they do.
2) The easiest way may be best because the athletic department has a history of easy over best and the easiest way might be the only way to get change.
As for whether that is the most effective solution, I think my system would be better, but I think that’s to be expected :-)
Formerly ryebreadraz
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Dec 6, 2009 11:26 PM PST up reply actions
Totally agree
when I say easiest I mean what are they most likely to do. We could build a a beautiful new system, but it would require a complete overhaul.
If the Athletics department had shown even the slightest amount of effort towards problems like this in the past then a new system would definitely be in the conversation, but then again if they did then we wouldn’t need to bug them about fixing this. They would have done it themselves. This school bureaucracy is such a catch-22.
Hmm
I can already tell just form me, Ryan, and PG 08 that this issue is going to result in a lot of debating and hashing out. But that’s what these threads and this site are for. Can’t wait :)
We definitely need a united front
If we can come to some sort of agreement and present that as one proposal to the Athletic Department , we could have a better chance of actually getting things done. Healthy debate is good.
slow down, look up
by Point Guard 08 on Dec 6, 2009 11:55 PM PST up reply actions
Hey!
Don’t leave me out of the well-intentioned bickering!
I have been meaning to flesh out the draft fanpost that I had started on this issue for a while, but given my new-fangled status here, I might start over and write up my thoughts on student tickets during one of the upcoming slow weeks for UCLA sports. If anyone is interested.
formerly bruinhoo
Haha didn't mean to
your comments came as I was typing that. When it refreshed I saw your stuff, but it was too late
This is a good start
I think it would be prudent for you do to another followup post (after finals week … lol) taking in the suggestions coming in this thread … and synthesizing into something overwhelming majority here can get behind.
However, this is a good start. I am glad my initial post started this. lol
from what i hear
the reason that student tickets were moved to this more immobile form of being put on your bruincard was because there was effectively a black market growing for the tickets where students knew that if they were not going to make it to a game, and if demand was there, they would resell the tickets at higher than face value. Another thing was that as in the previous system where you got your entire season tickets at once, inevitably people would lose their tickets and it became a burden on CTO to go and look up the info and reprint the ticket. Lastly, it is a lot cheaper for CTO to simply electronically put the ticket on your card instead of waste money on the printing of thousands of tickets.
By adding the tickets on your bruincard and making them non-transferable, CTO was effectively able to lower their costs and keep students from reselling tickets.
One possible way to curb this “blackmarket” reselling of tickets while still not printing the paper tickets, and allowing transfer of tickets IMO would be to implement a program where if I wanted to give my ticket to someone like idk Nestor for example, I go with him to CTO we each show our bruincards, and they simply transfer the ticket from my bruincard to his. Though it doesn’t curb the reselling problem, it does allow for transferability without incurring any cost on CTO of printing tickets.
Electronic transfer should be easy
Every ticket holder should have an electronic account. You just log into your ticket account and “assign” your ticket to Nestor. N shows up at the ticket office with a photo ID and gets the ticket. If you want to prevent scalping, then N pays for his ticket at the window and your account is credited. And the ticket office can add a dollar for a service fee, to make it worth its while. This way, you don’t both have to coordinate showing up. That’s how we transfer Avalanche tickets, and it is cake.
Adopting this system is cheap and easy. It’s just software. Trying to change antiquated policies and closed/lazy minds is the hard part.
greg in denver - UCLA guy for life
Doesn't eliminate the possibility of scalping, though
While the transferee pays the face value of the ticket to CTO, there is nothing preventing the transferring student from taking additional money for initiating the transfer. If the transfer model were to be used, I think it would need to involve transferring unused tickets into a pool of surplus student tickets, from which ticketless students can purchase tickets for a game.
formerly bruinhoo
Is there really a need for season tickets?
How about something really simple: let the first 1500 students in, have them swipe/show their bruin card, and then charge them via URSA or something.
I’m not wedded to this idea, but it seems to simplify the issue of transferring or selling tickets. It’s pretty similar to rye’s plan in how it might actually work, but it would seem to both be simpler and might enable students who for some reason couldn’t get season tickets (too much money, too little time for lots of games, blew it missing a deadline). It does allow a bit more of a bandwagon approach and takes away maybe a bit of the passion, but those showing up still have to be one of the first people there. CTO could probably even charge a little more for big games if they wanted and make a little more money.
I was thinking the same thing
Simple is definitely better. How about this, at the start of the year you have an option of purchasing season tickets to the basketball games. It would be an all or nothing decision. If you decide yes, then your tickets are electronically added to your student card. Getting into the games then becomes a first come first served basis. I know there will be some arguments that this may cause some camping out for the games, and you are correct this may cause that, but camping out for things is a part of college life. I’ve done it for movie premiers, concert tickets, etc. If some student flunks out because they spend all their time camping out for games, well, that’s their own damn fault. Anyway, if the student section fills out, or even if you decide to not go to the game, your account automatically get’s credited for that games ticket , $3 – 5$ from what I’m hearing above. That way there’s no “refund process” that either the student or CTO has to initiate. No swipe for the game = refund of that game. If you don’t go to a game the entire year (shame on you!!!) you eventually get refunded the entire season ticket amount.
Now what about those students who didn’t pre-purchase their season tickets? They can go to the game, but they stand in a seperate line waiting to see if the student season ticket holder section doesn’t fill up. If it doesn’t fill up, they get let in, swiping their student card and get charged the $3-$5 charge for the game as Jaffa mentioned above.
To me this seems to be the simplest way. You can purchase or not, refunds happen automatically, there are no paper tickets to purchase, those without tickets can still get in the game albeit in worse seats, so there is an benefit to prepurchasing, it prevents the scalping of tickets as they are still linked to your individual student id. You can even have it setup so if someone didn’t pre-purchase and changes their mind, they can go into CTO and purchase a pro-rated season ticket for the rest of the games, but you must purchase for ALL remaining games.
Simple is good
Good ideas! No transfer system! First come first served! Camping is still encouraged/required!
from the perspective of CTO
there is no reason to do this process of charging those who only come to the game. As long as people are paying upfront before the games, they have your money locked in. Its a guaranteed source of revenue for them as people buy their den tickets every year. However by doing this sort of only pay if you swipe your card idea from their perspective they dont know how much revenue they will bring in each game.
Furthermore for games that take place over winter break, they fully know that while they charge everyone for those tickets, few local students will be able to attend, whereas many students who have paid for the tickets but live far away (northern california, out of state, shoot even some parts of southern california are pretty far to drive) will not be able to attend.
Their solution to these empty student tickets…they actuall RESELL the upper student section seats as their “holiday plan” or “mini game pack” (the exact name eludes me). Basically they are selling the same seats twice knowing that many students will not come. I don’t have a real problem with that because the student section will never be totally filled during winter break so if it fills seats, great.
So what is my point in all this? CTO is a revenue driven entity, and as long as they (like any business) can guarantee revenue by charging up front instead of on game day, they will. Whether or not the purpose of CTO is to maximize revenue or whether its purpose is to maximize the student experience at sporting events is a valid debate
I really like this idea
It’s convenient and simple. Some students don’t even understand how their ticket plans work.
The benefit to this is that it allows students to decide spontaneously decide to attend a game, show up early and still get good seats. I’m not sure, but I think students who currently don’t have season tickets must wait until the game starts to buy tickets because CTO wants to make sure that there are still seats available.
A problem with 'transfer' plans
is that they currently oversell student season tickets.
With ticketexchange (etc) for professional sports, every seat has a ticket. There is no issue with buying a ticket through ticketexchange and then showing up and not being allowed in. Getting a refund for the price is not adequate compensation for the time/inconvenience/disappointment; but CTO isn’t about to start giving refunds at greater than face value for secondary purchasers of tickets. So, if you want a ticketexchange model you have to further reduce the number of season tickets available for students.
Re: the various systems that rely on a first-come, first-served basis – this seems fine for people who live on or very close to campus, but would suck for people who don’t, and for people who have jobs/classes close to game time. Distributionally, this means you probably get the most committed fans going to games, but it also favors people with a lot of time on their hands (low course load and no job commitments). Whether that is better or worse than just allowing students to scalp tickets to each other (with the old paper ticket system and showing student ID) isn’t obvious to me. It seems that the same people (those with less disposable income / those who by necessity have less free time) get screwed either way. And by screwed, I mean get a smaller share of the economic surplus being handed out by the school when they price tickets below market value…
On a separate point, I do wonder how far the student section being full and generating atmosphere adds value to the other tickets – I’m guessing alumni would rather come to a packed, jumping Pauley than to a half-full gymnasium. In which case, there may be real economic incentives to them maximizing student turnout.
20 years ago
When I was there from ‘83-’87, the student section extended from the floor all the way up, and essentially included an entire half of Pauley. Most games were full, except some preseason games during school breaks. We were on the lottery system, and paper tickets, but we got tickets to every game if we got picked in the lottery.
But what may be important for the history of how things developed is an understanding of some of the problems that were developing then. The most formative problem was that alumni that sat on the other side of Pauley started a campaign to reduce the student section, because they felt that the chanting, and cheering that the students did was too loud and detracting from the game. During games there often would be reminders to quite down. This led to top shelf recruits coming into Pauley for visits, and making statements like it was visiting a cemetery. They, of course, went to Duke instead.
It is my opinion that the political and economic powers that be there at UCLA care very little about the students’ interests in games.
Louisville, KY for UCLA class of '87
by kingslook on Dec 7, 2009 9:47 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
When you limit the amount of students
that can get season tickets, you’re going to have less students show up.
by inhowlandwetrust on Dec 7, 2009 10:26 AM PST reply actions
I'm kind of shocked to read that student tix are non-transferable
Whoever came up with the idea to change the prior system to this one is an idiot. Although I’d like to completely blame the students for not showing up, now I partially blame CTO.
The ticket exchange works fine for alum season ticket holders. That would be the easiest solution, but it’s run by ticketmaster, and they won’t be able to make any money off of student tickets compared to regular tickets. Do you know they charge us like 20% to sell our tickets to someone else?! Such a rip off! It is free to forward though, and I use it whenever I have to miss a game. I don’t really see the problem with a black market for student tickets, but I guess some people do. At least if you want a ticket you can get one that way.
Why don’t they just allow you to return your ticket electronically to CTO before the game, for a refund, and then sell the unused tickets to any student who wants to wait in line? Someone said that they track each student’s attendance? Just penalize the people who let their tickets go unused (and unreturned) by not giving them tickets to the following season.
Whatever solution you guys can come up with, I’ll be happy to take it up with the Wooden Fund people when they call me next year.
Things people need to know about the CTO...
-The CTO simply does whatever the Athletic Dept wants them to do. The Athletic Dept makes the final decision on all things.
-The online software that people are used to transfer tickets to other people comes through Ticketmaster…which is why other sports teams have the same technology.
-Student tickets on Bruincards aren’t on ticketmaster…they go through the Bruincard office. In order to have ticket transfering taking place WITH using a Bruincard it would take incredible collaboration with Ticketmaster/CTO/Bruincard Office.
-Student tickets were originally put on Bruincards to prevent people who have already graduated from getting student tickets ultra cheap and then just showing their old Bruincard at the Gate. Having tickets on the Bruincard also makes sure the are a current student.
Guilty as charged.
I went to a couple of games with student tickets from friends after I had graduated. Not because it was cheap, but because I wanted to be in the student section for the games.
Bruincard only changes every 7 years, so this policy does prevent young alumni from attending as students… Not sure how much revenue was really gained through this though, particularly if the whole stadium is less full and enjoyable than previously.
by britishbruin on Dec 7, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
How about this for a crazy liberal idea?
All paper tickets, requiring student ID to get into the games, but completely transferable.
Lottery for season tickets, only open to people on Financial Aid as part of their Financial Aid.
Kids on Financial Aid who get tickets can go to the games or sell the tickets to whichever student wants them. No-one ends up unable to go due to insufficient money for tickets, some people do get surplus from the tickets being priced under market value but the surplus goes to kids we think are deserving, etc.
Also: free universal health care for all.
by britishbruin on Dec 7, 2009 12:45 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
The basic premise is that the demand for tickets exceeds the supply, but was that true for Kansas?
From what I could see, the student section was not filled for the game against Kansas. I think it’s reasonably likely that there were enough kids present and wanting to go to the game, but who were prevented from attending by some artificially created policy. I hope that’s true. Proceeding on the assumption that it’s true, I have a major, significant problem with an Athletic Department who seems determined to make it difficult for kids to enjoy part (a big part, in my opinion) of the university experience. The Athletic Department seems to have the same single-mindedness as the ncaa enforcement committee when it comes to just$c*. Both have their priorities absolutely backwards. Shame on UCLA for this.
I still like my idea. You’re a student, and you want to go to a game? OK, you’re in. That’s it. You get in with a reg card. What’s the capacity of the student section? What’s the capacity of the general admission section? If you’re a student and you want to go to a game, you get in. If the student section gets filled, then the students start filling up the general admission seats. You show up to buy a general admission seat but it’s filled with a student seat? Then you start paying a premium to get in.
I saw some posts that say kids can’t find the time to sit in a line to get a seat. If you’re working, hire someone to save your place in line. (Or as was the case with me when I was pledging a frat, have pledges save actives’ places in line.) Or if you’re cash strapped, hire yourself out as a place holder.
Bottom line to me is that every student should get to watch games. And students should figure out their priorities. If you’re going to commit to going to games, then rearrange your other stuff.
My idea would quickly determine whether demand for seats exceeds supply, and would do away with the cumbersome and plainly silly lottery system, which basically does nothing but insure that seats are left empty which would otherwise be filled. It really sounds like the present system was created by very gifted students in a graduate seminar on “Advanced Bureaucratic Mind-Numbing Stupidity.”
System courtesy of our brilliant marketing department
First, the person in charge of this and the person to contact is Scott Mitchell who is the director of the “wonderful” UCLA Athletics marketing department. We can complain about attendance as much as we want, but with the current staff we will not get any substantial changes. I’ve even offered to build the ticketing transfer system that they need for a discounted rate. Not interested.
I was as big of a UCLA fan as you can find, but I am and always will be embarrassed by the incompetence of the marketing department. Their inability to use rudimentary marketing techniques makes me wonder if they went to UCLA to study marketing (we don’t have a marketing major).
This system this year is definitely better than the system that was implemented the year before (100% random lottery with the biggest fans getting no preference over a freshmen who just had to check a box). In fact, the marketing department wanted to implement the same exact system this year (one that had their voicemails filled with belligerent die hard fans). The DEN leaders had numerous meetings with CTO, Marketing and Athletics (occasionally organized by CBH spur of the moment) and it looked like a decent system was going to be implemented (after MANY compromises by the DEN).
Sure enough, the last week of the year we were informed by Mr. Mitchell that they were going back to their original plan because they did some “number-crunching.” I called Mr. Mitchell out and asked for him to present his data because I “frankly think you are bullshitting us.” A week later, we were informed that they were going to implement one of our ideas (students who attended over ~70% of games would get their choice of package).
Any fan who has worked closely with the marketing department knows that they are flat out incompetent. I guarantee you that a talented marketing consultancy could replace all of the expensive salaries of their staff for less and drive attendance at UCLA athletic events up at least 200%.
Good luck guys, it’s going to be a tough ride.
Also, let's face it
With the increased academic standards at UCLA the amount of people who are die hard sports fans at UCLA is quite small. That combined with the number of things to do in Los Angeles and it is an uphill battle.
There is one thing that fills up the seats better than any other method – HAVE A GOOD TEAM. We didn’t need to have this conversation between 2005 and 2008 because our basketball team was fire. Now we are going through a rough patch on their court, a lot of borderline fans are going to study instead of watching our team get worked.
This isn’t just UCLA, this happens at colleges all over the nation and almost every pro team.
I don't get that and I don't agree
Standards at Duke are plenty high and those students are die hard basketball fans. Would they be as die-hard if their team wasn’t good? Hard to say…
The one difference I see is that UCLA is far more diverse, possibly admitting a lot of students who are recent immigrants and thus did not grow up with the college sports tradition ingrained in them.
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
Another option
I know this was a while ago, but I had finals when the post went up and then went out of the country.
But there is another option: Texas A&M has a system for both football and basketball that goes as follows (from my understanding): everyone who wants it can purchase a very cheap sports package. But for sports that don’t have enough seats: basketball (and even football for them) students have to pull their tickets—they have to go get a physical ticket even if they have a sports package. For example: for a Saturday game, seniors would get to pull starting the preceding Monday, juniors on Tuesday, sophomores on Wednesday, and freshman on Friday. While this system seems like only seniors would get to go, a certain number of tickets is reserved for each class, so the competition is limited.
In our case, if we had seniors and juniors pull two days till and sophomore and freshman the day before, this system could work.
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