The "Wrong Kind" of Leadership
Bumped. GO BRUINS. -N
Ok, it's been 2 days. I think I'm ready to get back at it... Reading Nestor's post today inspired this, but blame me if you disagree.
Leadership is a tough thing to quantify. You can't measure it the way we can count Drago's percentage from behind the arc, or DC's assist/turnover ratio, or Timmeh's technicals/game (all of which are very impressive). So it's hard to say who is a team leader, or which player is what kind of leader, or what kind of leader helps a team most. Not being in the locker room or at practice or in the players' heads makes it all the more subjective. So here's my completely subjective impression about the leadership on this team.
I think we have the "wrong kind" of leaders for this team.
That may sound like a criticism, but it is absolutely not. To a certain degree, you cannot teach leadership. It is more a product of your personality. General Patton was just born that way. Some great players are great leaders - MJ, Kobe, Elway. Some guys with great skills are just not great team leaders, like Carmelo, Vinsanity, my boss. Some guys who are not the most talented players are still guys you would follow anywhere, such as a guy like Pat Tillman.
I love all the players on this team, and am proud of how they are doing this year. Certainly, we've all been disappointed with certain results and an apparent lack of intensity at times. We all can see that the talent and potential is there, but the thing that has been inconsistent is the drive and focus and inspiration that are needed to bring out the best of that potential. There have been times where the effort and intensity have not been maximized. And that's where I think we have the "wrong kind" of leadership.
I'll pick on the seniors first...Guys like DC and PAA and JS are inspirational for what they have accomplished, what they have overcome, and what they have sacrificed to wind up being seniors on this team. I don't think any of us would question their dedication to UCLA basketball. These 3 are clear leaders - by example. They put their heads down and they go to work. You see tons of sweat, but you don't see tons of emotion, save a few moments here and there from Josh. They are businesslike on the floor. They don't get in the refs' faces (even when they could), they don't ham it up and play to the crowd, they don't taunt the opponents' fans, they never get in opponents' faces (even that T on PAA earlier wasn't much), and - here's the key - I really don't see them getting in their teammates' faces.
Much of this is the maturity and "just play basketball" attitude that is instilled by CBH. Our players are class on the floor. No whining, no rah-rah, no look-at-me moments. No whooping up the crowd. No screaming at the SFPTR's. For those of us who've been around for a while, the overall effort and inner drive is obvious, and is inspiring. None of those 3 needs anyone in his grill, pumping them up and pushing them to step up their game and their intensity. To me, the example they have set is their type of leadership.
However, I'm not sure that those qualities are as obvious or as inspiring to some of the younger and less experienced players on the team, especially on a game-to-game basis.
Here's where I pick on the freshmen...These guys have been stars their whole lives. They have been the focus on their teams and their teammates have looked up to them. Now, they have stepped up to a level where their talents, at this point, don't clearly overshadow the other players to the degree they have before, which makes their focus and intensity that much more crucial to getting everything from themselves. I believe the effort and dedication that the seniors have invested is the switch that clicks on their own intensity. That may be something they will recognize in time, as situations force them to do the things the seniors have done to develop their career. I do think Drew Gordon gets it - his comments about the team's lack of desire suggest that he sees the intangibles. But I think that the rest of the young guys would respond better with some more vocal, demonstrative, in-your-face leadership on the floor from someone.
I'm certainly a guy who thinks he puts in a lot of effort, but is clearly better motivated by a loud coach on the bike, or a loud teammate on the volleyball court, or a loud wife with laundry that needs folding. What I think is my own best effort is never really as good as when someone else is pushing me and telling me that I have more to give - so maybe that's where I'm biased in this whole thesis.
Like I said, I'm not in the locker room or the huddles at games, so maybe this happens more than I can see. And maybe I'm wrong about this entire dynamic of the team, that the quiet lead-by-example seniors are not inspiring the best in each other or in the younger players who need a more tangible push to elevate their effort. But when I watch, it seems to me that that is why we don't always seem to have everyone out there giving 1000%. It's also seems that this decreased effort is going to manifest itself much more on the defensive side of the ball, which is where the Kenpom.com stats would suggest that our game has slipped compared to previous years, and which has been the difference between wins and losses this season.
It is not a criticism of this, or any team, when that special dynamic does not exist. It's a very rare thing to find in a team. I agree, as Nestor wrote, that there is no Ed O'Bannon or Aaron Afflalo or Russell Westbrook on this team - guys whose actions and words would get us jumping out of our seats and beating our chests and make us run through a wall, and get their teammates to do the same thing. We were very lucky to have guys like Ed O (thanks Tark for blowing that one!) and AA, who had that natural personality to lift their game and also to lift the games of everyone around them. And it is absolutely no criticism of DC or PAA or JS that they don't have that same personality. I love those 3 and will take them every day of every week and be satisfied with however the W-L record ends up. I would also disagree a bit with Nestor's view that these guys aren't dominating enough to justify being vocal leaders. I think all of us would respond to any one of those 3 guys talking up the team, but that is just not their nature, and that's ok. But that lack of a vocal inspiring floor guy is the missing link between this team and the ones which have really excelled in our recent past.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of BruinsNation's (BN) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of BN's editors.
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30 comments
Comments
Kobe... really?
You sure that you want to use Kobe as a great player that is also a great leader? He is pretty much the opposite of that. He is a phenomenal natural talent that awes & inspires others but his selfishness & arrogance pretty much kill his natural leadership opportunities. The funny thing is that has been the knock on him his whole career so it’s not like this is my own observation. Granted he is working hard to overcome this deficiency of his the last couple of years (I think that Fisher is the one coaching him up who happens to be a fantastic natural leader).
Otherwise I agree with your post. I think the attitude that we are missing is the “refuse to lose” attitude. I don’t see anybody on this team with that. It’s more like CTS’s scared to lose attitude.
by schubert69 on Feb 23, 2009 12:57 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Yes, really
As a Laker fan I am more than ecstatic with what I have seen from Kobe last few years and I would love if we had someone in our team who had his fiery attitude. But that’s a minor point in this post.
Despite my slight disagreement with gbruin (which he noted in the end) this is a great post.
by Nestor on Feb 23, 2009 4:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah i agree with Nestor
Kobe in the early 2000s wasn’t a great leader, but Kobe now is one of the best leaders in the game. Plus he’s got the will to win that NO one else in the world has.
but yeah, I agree with you gbruin. This is good stuff
by bucknellbruin on Feb 23, 2009 6:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
No offense
But the greatest players in the world disagree with you…like all the members of 2008’s Team USA.
by Tydides on Feb 23, 2009 6:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Question for Ty
Are you saying that the members of the 2008 Olympic team would say that Kobe is a great leader (or was their leader)? Or are you saying that the greatest players in the world would disagree with Kobe as a great leader? Thanks.
by BruinsRule on Feb 23, 2009 10:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He is saying
that the greatest players in the world thought that Kobe was a great leader. There were many articles about this during that time but this is the one I found: http://articles.latimes.com/2008/aug/23/sports/sp-olyplaschke23.
by bruin8uclap on Feb 24, 2009 12:00 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not buying it.
Even if I concede that Kobe is a great leader now (which I don’t), he hasn’t always been and certainly would be one of the first 3 names that popped up when trying to prove a point. If you want to use a Laker, why not Magic Johnson? Definitely a better leader and in my opinion a better player besides.
BTW… did you guys see how the Great Leader Kobe reacted when he crashed into Bynum’s knee?
Again… like the rest of the post, just not one of the examples.
by schubert69 on Feb 24, 2009 9:00 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You don't have to buy it
You can just be wrong.
See, whether he used to be a leader or not is largely irrelevant. We’re talking about now. And I’m going to trust the opinions of the best players the NBA has to offer, guys who have actually played with and against him, over Random Internet Poster. And yes, I’m sure Kobe went out of his way to potentially sabotage his own championship chances by taking out one of his own teammates. Such a ridiculous post.
by Tydides on Feb 24, 2009 10:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
PS

Yeah, I saw the reaction on TV and I see it here. Man, what a jerk, being concerned for his teammate. Don’t let the fact that you can practically read a four letter word written all over his face fool you. He clearly doesn’t care about Bynum. From the body language and facial expressions it looks like DFish is a jerk too…oh wait, he’s regarded as a fantastic leader on and off the court and is president of the Players Association. Hmm, I guess Gasol is a jerk too. After all, his reaction is the same as Kobe’s. Oh wait, he did a great job leading Spain into a dogfight with Team USA for the gold in Beijing. Damn, proving myself wrong is really hard. Oh wait, it’s actually impossible. Because I’m right.
by Tydides on Feb 24, 2009 11:03 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
HAHAHA... awesome just awesome
Shame on Kobe for not running into the training room and retrieving Paul Pierce’s wheelchair!
I will never understand the nit-picking nature of Kobe-haters. The Lakers have been winning at +900 clip since Bynum went down, but I guess Kobe has had nothing to do with that?
I agree with Tydides… absolutely ridiculous.
by ishXdavid on Feb 24, 2009 11:55 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Kobe should have pushed Gary Vitti out of the way
Kobe obviously knows how to fix torn MCLs and is holding out on the training staff. For shame.
Okay I should stop now, the absurdity is hurting my brain.
by Tydides on Feb 24, 2009 2:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That is later after he thought about it a bit more...
… check out the video right as it happened.
About the 0:46 mark. Tell me he isn’t thinking “Damn… there goes my chances at a championship” rather than concern for Andrew’s injury and obvious pain.
by schubert69 on Feb 24, 2009 3:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
So I'm supposed to take your interpretation of a video clip
Over the words of the best players in the game, his own teammates, his famously mercurial coach, and hours and hours of actually watching the games as proof that he can’t lead. Wow that is a tough choice.
This is not how an exchange works. You do not get to throw out baseless unsubstantiated arguments, fueled only by your own biases and interpretations and then either disregard or not respond to arguments and evidence to the contrary. If you’re drinking the haterade, which I can only assume you are at this point, then at least say so and be honest. If you just don’t like the guy or whatever the reason, that’s fine, no one has to like anyone else. But don’t pretend like your biased and flimsy interpretation of someone else’s actions is a counter to the mountain of evidence presented to you that show your argument to be a flawed one.
You could say you don’t like him as a player, the way he plays or whatever, and no one could say anything because that’s just your opinion. However, if you make the assertion that he isn’t something that evidence shows that he is, you are going to get called out. Label your opinions as such and don’t try and attach them to dubious subjective measures in an attempt to justify them.
If you actually have something to show here that hasn’t already been refuted and debunked, then let’s hear it. If not, then you’re already deep in the hole. No, your interpretation of a clip doesn’t count because I could easily interpret it the opposite way or in a completely different way altogether. I give you quotes and testimony that say you’re wrong from anybody who’s anybody in basketball, and you come back with “I don’t like the way he’s acting in this clip”. Please. My suggestion is to quit digging because you’re getting buried.
by Tydides on Feb 24, 2009 3:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you've missed your calling
You’re obviously wasting your video-interpretation/mind-reading skills on sports. I think the CIA could really use your talent for something more beneficial to the world.
by ishXdavid on Feb 24, 2009 4:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
LOL
This is from today’s LA Times
“Kobe’s plying as well [or] better than he did last year. Most of that is simply because he’s been our leader,” Jackson said. “He’s more determined in that aspect.”
How so?
“Most of it’s the push, it’s the drive. Every game he comes out and there’s a purpose that these guys have to play for,” Jackson said. "There’s a reason to go out there and win, there’s a motivation that he provides by always pressing the team forward.
“A lot of times it overrides guys. They get upset that they’re not getting as many shots or something, but he says, ‘OK, come get the ball. If you want to take it from me, you’ve got to show you’re as hungry to score, as hungry and aggressive as I am.’ That’s the leadership that he provides.”
That’s Phil Jackson talking. PJ says whatever he wants to say whether it’s popular with his players or not (see Shaq-Kobe years). Now it’s just getting downright comical.
by Tydides on Feb 24, 2009 11:16 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ty...
is my hero for the day. For those of us that watch the Lakers religiously whether it be at Staples or on television… we can all see the sort of leadership in Kobe that gbruin says is missing in our own team. After every play, whether it’s a turnover or a made 3, Kobe is on the floor coaching, admonishing, encouraging, whatever… his team. It would be nice to have that kind of presence on our floor, even though I feel like a lot of that comes from CBH. I’m sure in some way it’s different being led on the floor as opposed to on the side of it, but at any rate: Ty, thank you for coming to Kobe’s defense; there’s not enough kobe-lovers anymore as there should be for how amazing he still is at 30. Fisher is every bit a leader as Kobe but in a different way… hence why people view them as more or less co-captains this year.
by legallybruinette on Feb 24, 2009 4:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks for the link
It’s a good read and changes my perception of Kobe.
by BruinsRule on Feb 24, 2009 11:07 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Time to step up...
Don’t post too often, especially since my work computer won’t let me, but it looks like most of you are voicing the same opinion I have about this Bruins squad, now that I’ve gotten to see them play almost a complete season. Corresponding w/ an old coworker (he goes back to the Wooden years) we’ve both seen what a difference having a leadership tandem like Ed O’ & Edny, Farmar & Afflalo, or Westbrook & Love can mean to a team. All those times these guys willed the Bruins to wins because of that never say die attitude. In the next couple of games leading up to the big dance, I hope this group of Bruins can find that fight in them and bring it every game. The only thing I can say to this group is, “you just got punched in the mouth, so what are you going to do about it?”
GO BRUINS
by RScal on Feb 23, 2009 7:51 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I'm imagining
your wife barking “C’mon, gbruin. You fold laundry like you’re making baloney sandwiches…, on white bread…, with mayo! Put some SOUL into it, for cryin’ out loud!”
Good stuff, your post. Thoughtful, articulate, and fair.
by Bruinut on Feb 23, 2009 8:42 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Don't know that we can judge
I say that because we don’t have a window into what goes on with this team. On some teams, it’s obvious who the leader is. In 1995, it was Ed without question. Ed led with his actions on the court, off the court and his teammates acknowledged his leadership. But Ed was not necessarily typical.
It appears to me that the leader of this team is DC. Howland seems to suggest that in his interviews. On the court, he leads by example, and he leads by taking the ball to the rack when the game is on the line. He leads by making good decisions with the ball.
Does he lead by getting in the face of teammates who are not performing well? I don’t know. I don’t recall examples of it during the course of a game, but that doesn’t mean that he doesn’t get in the face of his teammates or get them inspired to victory before the game or at half time.
If Collison is indeed the leader, he shold be able to look in the mirror and not like what he has been seeing on the defensive end these past several games. He should lead by example and pick up his own effort and demand the same of his teammates. He should ask “Why did I come back to UCLA for a 4th season if not to give 100% effort and attempt to get the most effort out of my teammates so that we can win a championship?”
Now is the time for a leader. If we don’t have one, we’ll know soon enough.
by BruinsRule on Feb 23, 2009 10:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Great post!
gbruin definitely offers a different perspective and as a somewhat passive guy myself, I can relate to the quiet, business-like work ethic of our seniors. At the same time, I’ve often criticized myself for the very same thing. Sometimes, being vocal and can add some much needed motivation.
We have a leader the screams and hollers in CBH, but it’s different to have someone to provide the emotion on the floor. I miss RW who would let out a roar, akin to a war-cry, that seemed to invigorate our guys. Sometimes I wish I could just jump on the court and yell, “LET’S GO!”
This isn’t to say that our seniors should be the ones to fill that role. If it’s not in their composition, they shouldn’t force it.
You know what could be just as effective, or at least close? A bunch of wild, crazed, out-of-their-minds and absolutely possessed fan base. Our fans can provide that spark. Everytime we’re down more than 9 points, we need fans that will jump to their feet and just scream like mad. Everytime we’re up 10 points we need to make sure they keep up the intensity.
by UCLAbruin920 on Feb 23, 2009 11:06 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
but it is criticism, just not unfair faultfinding and nitpicking(#2 below).
Let us not hesitate to point out areas of opportunity. Especially attitude/mental aspects of the game that can conceivably improve or change.
–noun
1. the act of passing judgment as to the merits of anything.
2. the act of passing severe judgment; censure; faultfinding.
3. the act or art of analyzing and evaluating or judging the quality of a literary or artistic work, musical performance, art exhibit, dramatic production, etc.
by Mon Bruin on Feb 24, 2009 12:28 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
How Can You Tell a Leader in Advance?
During this basketball season, my thoughts keep reverting to Cade McNown. He is the clearest example of a player who simply refused to lose, and was not going to let his teammates even acknowledge the possibility of defeat until the final gun.
With Ed O’Bannon, his leadership skills had an extra season to blossom after he tore up his knee in practice. His determination to come back from what could have been a career ending injury presumably carried over to the mental and emotional side.
AA and RW were both perceived as less than all-world players when they came to UCLA. Maybe their leadership stemmed from a desire to prove all the experts wrong who do not rank them higher to begin with.
On this year’s team, DG had a very short senior season at Mitty thanks to an injury. Perhaps this has increased his drive relative to the rest of the team.
In any event, I do agree with N, gbruin, and others that leadership and other intangibles are so crucial to success. My question is can you find the leaders in advance during the recruiting process (like how they respond to adversity during CIF playoffs or some such), or is this basically a blind draw until practice starts and you see the players for the first time at the college level.
Insights would be very welcome. Thanks.
by islandbruin on Feb 24, 2009 6:08 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I'm Not Sure the Qualities That We Call "Leadership" Can Be Generalized
My life’s experience makes me believe that one can only draw a “leader’s” job description in the context of the group to be lead.
Not all groups are the same and not all teams are the same. Some will be inspired and follow emotion and some will be inspired and follow examples.
Yell in the ear of someone who wants examples and you will lose that person. Fail to “fire up” the person who needs emotional leadership and you may not get the best out of him.
I think it a mistake to assume that we need more of the “emotional” type of leadership. I don’t think we are in a position to know that.
This leads me to where I almost always end up on questions surrounding our basketball team — I trust CBH. He knows what this team needs and the type of leadership that will get it — and I’m sure he is working on it.
I find it very interesting that he continually supports DC as “the” leader, encourages JH to step up more and more, and then tolerates DG’s passionate statements. This seems to be a very complex group that finds motivation in different places and I trust that CBH is working hard to push every button.
sjh
by Class of 66 on Feb 24, 2009 8:16 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
It's hard to qualify or quantify...
.. just how much their leadership affects our team, since none of us are in the locker room and on the team. I certainly understand your point, and I also understand how these concerns might be. I’ve certainly read over the years that the funniest guys on the team are Aboya, Collison and Shipp and they’ve certainly been known as the relaxed group of players on the team. That doesn’t mean their leadership style is the same, but the idea that they are more of a friend figure than an “in-your-face” Afflalo kind of player is certainly possible. And that’s no knock on the character of these players – their character on and off the court speaks for itself.
Again though, how much that affecs the team regardless of style is something we can’t really know for certain without being in the shoes of the rest of the team
by blinkshot on Feb 24, 2009 8:49 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you, blink,
mostly because I said that, almost exactly, in my post. I also agree with ‘66 (the more I agree with him, the more often I’ll be right) that some people just do not respond well to a more aggressive, vocal leadership style – though I would bet that most players who shy away from that style are less likely to fit in with CBH’s system. I also said I wasn’t criticizing but was just analyzing what I saw (def #3 above). For me, I don’t want anyone different on this team – I go where they go. I agree with your comment on their character 100%.
Nevertheless, I wasn’t necessarily insisting that we absolutely have to have someone loud. It just occurred to me that that is a dynamic which clearly existed with the ‘95 championship team and the last 3 FF teams which doesn’t appear to exist (that we can see) right now.
And though fans can’t (and shouldn’t) change what goes on in the huddle or locker room, the fans can help provide more enthusiasm and energy by standing and yelling and going nuts and making Pauley absolutely rocking for these guys – which is a positive change we should all support.
greg in denver - UCLA guy for life
by gbruin on Feb 24, 2009 10:26 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Totally Agree With Those Who Are Calling On the Home Crowd to Step Up
Whatever the dynamic of internal team leadership, there is no down side to a crowd that supports the team from the first tip off to the final horn.
The yell leaders, the Den — they have to get Pauley rocking.
And, if they can’t get the Geezers going, we need someone who can — like Geoff does at the football games where the alumni section is the loudest in the stadium.
We can’t build team leadership. All we can do is talk about it.
But, those of us with tickets to the games can lead a change in the way the fans approach their role in creating a home court advantage.
sjh
by Class of 66 on Feb 24, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It's been getting better...
steadily. Being at the last 10 or so home games, I can report that the Den has begun to yell “Stand Up!” to the donors and other fans to get them more into it throughout the game. Unfortunately it only lasts til the next timeout. The best, and probably most memorable, part of the Washington game was when the band started playing Sons of Westwood and the crowd and Den finished singing it a cappella because the band had stopped playing. You can feel the spirit growing, ‘66, it’s just taking a little longer than most of us would like.
It’s also been the subject here a couple times that we have to find a way to get the season ticket holders to routinely come to the games. Gosh I wish we could just call or email them all and convey to them how important their attendance is since they sit so close to the actual court. Ugh… so much to do and not a whole lot of ways to get it done.
by legallybruinette on Feb 24, 2009 4:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

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