Nelson Channels Lavin (In Weak Attempt To Defend Rushing Of Nell & John Wooden Court)
by Nestor on Jan 22, 2010 7:56 AM PST
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PrintI can appreciate the fact that yesterday's win was uplifting. I appreciate the fact that the team came out and played hard following the embarrassment against Southern Cal. They have done it before this season only to fall flat on their faces in the following game. Still it was great to see a kid like Mustafa Abdul Hamid emerge as a hero at the end of the night.
That said there is no justification for some of UCLA students' attempt to rush the court following a win over mediocre NIT caliber team which still hasn't won a single road game in perhaps the worst Pac-10 conference in decades. Blair Angulo, who is a former reporter for the Daily Bruin posted on ESPNLA:
Perhaps rain, combined with the Bruins' historic loss to the Trojans five days prior, prompted fans to stay home. The announced attendance was a meager 6,503 (Pauley has a basketball capacity of 12,819). Freshman forward Reeves Nelson, who already has somewhat of a cult following amongst students, said he was glad to see the student section full when he walked onto the floor for pregame warm-ups. Some had spent the previous night camped out -- rain and all -- outside of Pauley.
"I’ve always had faith in our student section," Nelson said. "It was fun to see them rush the court after a huge win."
Uh Reeves before making comments like that don't forget where you play basketball. It was a nice win for the team but if Nelson and anyone else associated with UCLA thinks it merited rushing the court that has Nell and John Wooden's name on it, they need to have their collective heads examined.
I understand if some people think a UCLA student section should never rush the court at Pauley. At the same time I think in today's world, there is nothing wrong with rushing the court if it has to do with winning conference championships. We did it at least three times during the early 90s.
However, there is no justification whatsover for the (weak) attempt to rush our court at Pauley. I am glad the student section was rocking (which was appreciated by Howland). That doesn't mean that it's ok to rush the court after a win that still leaves us with a losing record and a .500 one in perhaps the worst college basketball conference in the country. Doing that makes the student section look cheaper than the Trojans who were celebrating their "Pac-10 tourney" championship t-shirts towards the end of last season.
This also has no comparison to "13-9". There was something big at stake during that game:
- UCLA's 8 game winning streak against Southern Cal
- Southern Cal's bid for the BCS championship game
So yeah no comparison whatsoever to the situation in last night's game. Justifying rushing the court following last night's game makes people sound cheaper than Steve Lavin. We used to clown Lavin for hyping up Steve-16 appearances after pathetic underachieving seasons. If anyone wants a flashback here is what the poser said after the Bruins got destroyed by Iowa State team in yet another humiliating Steve-16 season:
Iowa State 80, UCLA 56 was hardly the Bruins' worst showing of the season. It was nothing compared to Gonzaga, USC I, Arizona State II and Arizona II, or the last 60 seconds at Washington. But it was enough of a beating that it would not allow them to ease into the off-season while thinking only of gains.
They had earned the right to have the great five-week ride coast to a smooth finish, as if simply running out of gas, because just being in position to get hammered by Iowa State was an accomplishment. They had earned the chance to feel vindicated after being 13-11 and in seventh place in the Pacific 10 Conference with a looming National Invitation Tournament berth. Even Coach Steve Lavin, who had been there as an assistant for a national championship and was in charge for a trip to the Elite Eight, said this "was probably the most rewarding, satisfying season I've been involved in."
So perhaps Nelson or anyone else want to think twice before getting so giddy over last night's win over a bad team that they want to stretch it in justifying silly attempts to rush the court. It makes those people sound more pathetic and disrespectful to the legacy of UCLA basketball than Steve Lavin.
Kind of sad really of what has happened in last few years. It was just four years ago Jordan Farmar talking about only banners mattering at UCLA. Now we have Reeves Nelson losing perspective over a "huge" win in a regular season which will probably not even result in an NIT. Pathetic.
GO BRUINS.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of BruinsNation's (BN) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of BN's editors.
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While I fully agree
that last night’s win was absolutely nothing worth contemplating the possibility of rushing the court for, the sad truth is that within the context of RN’s experience at UCLA so far, this is one of the biggest wins he’s seen, since there have only been seven others. (I’m not at all suggesting this makes it worthy of rushing the court.)
Homework assignment for any Den members who even thought about rushing the court: spend an hour in the Morgan Center before you step foot in Pauley again.
A sad aside for us at-least-kind-of-old-timers: I went to the official athletic site to confirm the HOF is still in the Morgan Center. While there I saw that Pete Dalis was admitted into the HOF in 2008. Huh?? Did I miss something?
Good point
It means Reeves need to brush up on his UCLA basketball history lessons. He doesn’t even have to look back to the Wooden years or Ed O’Bannon/Toby Bailey years. He can just take a look at what happened during last 5 seasons.
I think they were celebrating the moment
more than the win if that makes sense. I know it doesn’t justify the move, but viewed out of the context of this abysmal season, a walk-on hitting a game winner from deep is pretty awesome. I mean for goodness sakes, “Rudy” only made a single takle in that movie.
exactly
why should these kids be sitting there in the student section remembering 50 plus years of UCLA basketball?? It was in the moment, celebrating a game winning shot by a walk on player. I think we can cut them some slack. I mean they didn’t even successfully rush the court because of the douche canoe UCPD.
by inhowlandwetrust on Jan 22, 2010 8:33 AM PST up reply actions
Uh they can celebrate all they want
Jumping up and down in the mosh pit. Doesn’t mean they rush the court.
I tried to say this last night
we own Pauley, we can do that, it’s the only place we can. The one chance I had to do it, I got excessively punished because we don’t own the Rose Bowl and they were worried about the new turf coming. We’re not going to agree obviously, I just cringe when you say they’re pathetic. If I was at the game, I definitely would have rushed the court. I’ve always wanted to, after seeing how fun it looks on Sportscenter.
by inhowlandwetrust on Jan 22, 2010 8:38 AM PST up reply actions
I agree with you re. 13-9
However, I am not going to let people justify rushing the court over a win in last night’s game. It does sound just as pathetic as Lavin glorifying Steve-16s and Dorrell lovers glorifying his meaningless 10 win season.
Good point but...
I agree with you that UCLA has a rich tradition and we shouldn’t just rush because we beat a mediocre team, nevertheless it was an “exciting” win and people just got carried away… the students didn’t mean to “disgrace” the court and for what UCLA stands for… it just happened in the heat of the moment.
Go Bruins!
Yes and No
I can’t argue the point about only rushing the court after high stakes game. However, seeing how lousy we’ve played this season I can’t say I wouldn’t let my emotions get the best of me if I were sitting in the student section.
When I was 18 I was a HUGE basketball fan
I mean HUGE, and I never once considered the implications of storming the court. Not once. The thoughts that went through my mind the two times we stormed the court my freshman year – “woohooo.” The amount of time I contemplated the meaning of that court storming in the following days/weeks = 0.
Yet by 21-22 students should have more perspective
I am hoping none of the guys who “attempted” to rush the court were upperclassmen who have a little idea on what constitutes “huge win” for UCLA hoops.
I agree with N on this
Really no justification to rush the court for a win like this.
I understand people getting caught up in it, given the double swing; I’m guessing that if there had been a timeout called after Overton made his shot, that would have calmed people down a bit, and MA-H’s shot would have been exciting but wouldn’t have had people losing their minds in quite the same way.
And for anyone who wants to argue that we should be happy that the students were more ‘into it’ today – it’s easy to be excited when something like last night happens. What’s hard is to get people to show up to a game to support their team after a loss – and last night’s turnout at Pauley was PATHETIC.
“I wanted to rush the court, it looks fun” just goes to show that rushing the court is all about YOU, and not about supporting your team and celebrating their achievements. This devalues any other time we might rush the court, and makes it look like UCLA beating an unranked Washington team at home as a 1.5 point underdog is the equivalent of College of Charleston knocking off UNC.
I understand the emotion of it, and also recognize that the identity of the hero made it all the sweeter. But this is UCLA, this win is not a big deal in the middle of a poor season, and I don’t want to see a half-assed attempt to rush the court by a half-empty Pauley on Sportscenter.
Ive always wanted to rush the court
and I’m a student so I’m giving you a younger perspective on this
BUT
it has to be warranted. I dont think this win warrants rushing the court. K-State didnt rush after they beat #1 Texas. Bottom line, the win was hardly an upset let alone one worthy of rushing.
If there was ever a game with intensity and passion to rush the court it would be the Stanford game, (the one where DC got fouled at the end) Cal game (JS over the backboard shot) and Oregon (RW “lets goo”)
I would nominate any of those games over this
where I don't agree with N
is in having a poll that is somewhat slanted with one side of the story (which I share with him), if the goal is actually to take the pulse of Bruins Nation. The points that both of us agree show that the court should NOT have been stormed are included in the question, while the points others make in the opposite direction are not.
Stop living in the past
I don’t get the demagoguery of current students by some of you guys. Its not like this was a preplanned thought out event like the UA kids against Oregon football game (where they were lining up to storm for five minutes before Oregon tied it up). It was one of the best atmospheres in the last five years at Pauley. I say this because when we were the final 4 teams, we were the favorites and all we harped on was not winning by more. Now we are the underdogs, the Gutty Little Bruins if you will. Combine all of these things with 7 seconds of pure madness and student celebration might spill out onto the court.
Maybe some of these things don’t show up on tv to people who aren’t at Pauley but I have absolutely no problem with some of the students actions. If they had time to think about it, yeah maybe it was an overreaction. But it was a spur of the moment thing where these freshman (who might be at one of their first pac 10 games) or seniors (who may be attending their last UCLA win) didn’t have time to think, “Well 40 years ago, John Wooden won ten titles when he had far superior talent to everyone else, so I should hold back on my emotion and simply give a boring ass golf clap so I can be like the season ticket holders who cant be bothered to even stand up.”
BTW, the reason the students were kept from storming the court was because the refs had to review the shot, not because of any policy against storming the court. The players were loving it and high fiving the students off the court as the students lined up along the exit after the rush was stopped.
Uh no
If we forgot our traditions at UCLA and what they stand for, we wouldn’t be blogging here on BN. We would be high fiving over Dorrell’s 10 win seasons and tell others not to live in the past. We have no problem living in the present and maintaining perspective but at the same time if we see current Bruin fans losing perspective of what true accomplishments mean at UCLA, we are not going to be quiet. So please don’t lecture us on not living in the past. Thanks.
Ok bad heading
I’m not lecturing you on the past, I’m just saying in the spur of the moment, you cant expect kids who have been cheering their lungs out all game for a team who was showing heart for the first time this season to be reflective and thinking out their actions before hand.
Fair enough
Hopefully the points raised above will make them think twice if they think about rushing the court again should Dragovic nail a buzzer beater on senior day to get our 12th win of the season.
LMAO
That means you have us winning another 3?!? So optimistic!!!
by bruinponcho on Jan 22, 2010 10:08 AM PST up reply actions
Maybe it could be a Keefe block as their shot clock expires
leading to a full court pass from MR to ND to pull up and nail the 3? Could senior day be more ‘exciting’ than that?
by britishbruin on Jan 22, 2010 10:17 AM PST up reply actions
I don't blame them under the circumstances
It’s been a trying year for Bruins fans of all ages, and especially for students. Then in this game, they get a lead, only to have it lost and then get it back in the last 3.2 seconds. That’s a pretty exciting moment, so I give them a pass on it.
(As long as they use proper grammar and syntax, and listen to the games with the volume down, of course.)
one more thing
I’m sure a lot of us were at our game against UW in the 2004-5 season, where we were down 21 points to a 13-1 UW team that were then ranked 12th or 14th in the country, for our first win against a ranked opponent since Lavin had beaten Cal in 2003
We came back to win with a barrage of points from Dijon Thompson and Brian Morrison, chiefly. If anyone else recalls, that game was still in the balance until freshman backup and cult hero Lorenzo Mata scored on a put-back to give us a 5 point lead.
That was a far more significant win for the program- CBH’s first big win – but no-one thought storming the court was the way to act.
And the reason to not storm the court today is not only because of Coach Wooden setting a standard (and his name being on the court), but because Ben Howland has set a standard over his time in Westwood that is not being met by his current team. This isn’t ancient history; this is the history of 2 years ago.
5 point win vs. last second shot
Again, I’m not saying storming the court was the right thing to do, but it was a spur of the moment reaction. If we had simply won by MR’s freethrows and Overton missed the layup, there would not have been any of this discussion. But instead, MAH made a buzzer beater. That is a much different situation than a 5 point win when the outcome is clear at the buzzer.
Yeah, I hear ya.
Just think that the buzzer beater is why I was jumping around in my apartment in DC, and isn’t a reason for rushing a court.
It was definitely an emotional moment, for many reasons.
by britishbruin on Jan 22, 2010 10:11 AM PST up reply actions
Well, at least the students are showing some passion for their team
Not too long ago, the students were being criticized for being apathetic about Bruin sports.
by Gen2Bruin1987 on Jan 22, 2010 9:36 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Nothing wrong with passion
But a little understanding and perspective on the program they are rooting for would be helpful as well.
I'm glad the students tried to rush the court last night.
About the one stipulation I’ll concede to Nestor and others is that beating a 3-3 UW team is probably not the venue for court rushing.
That being said, it would be nice to see some excitement in Pauley along these lines. The ongoing sentiment seems to be that we are UCLA and we only honor championships. Well, that reeks of SC style hubris. As Coach Parcells once said, “we are what our record says we are.” Newsflash everyone, we haven’t won National Championship in close to 15 years. At this rate, when will we ever rush the court?
Along these lines I would like to offer up the following suggestions for appropriate situations for rushing the court.
1) Beating USC, regardless of the record. And especially at the Costco center.
2) Upsets of Top 10 teams when we are either unranked or in the bottom half of the top 25
3) Nationally televised games against Top 10 teams when we are either unranked or in the bottom half of the top 25
4) Wins against UNC, or Duke. Just because.
Wow, even as I wrote that, I realized how hard it is to quantify the how, when and where to rush the court. On that note, I’ll offer the following opinions of games I would have rushed the field.
1) Gonzaga hoops game
2) Cincinatti hoops game
3) 13-9 gridiron game
4) Maryland hoops game
5) Alabama gridiron game (they were top 5 team)
6) Texas gridiron game (we scored 60 or something on ’em)
etc, etc. feel free to add your own instances or blast me for my opinions, but let’s definitely discuss.
The best thing you can do for your children is to love their mother. John Wooden
your suggestions
are when Wassu should consider rushing the court. Not UCLA.
by britishbruin on Jan 22, 2010 10:15 AM PST up reply actions
I never cared when students rushed the court
After we beat a number 1 Kansas team at Pauley. It made us look pathetic against Kansas. It was also telling about Lavin’s tenure at UCLA. Then again during Lavins’ tenure the Daily Bruin was busy licking his boots and the student section would serenade him with “we love Lavin” chants.
We love Lavin?
I was an unfortunate student attending UCLA during the Lavin era. No way did we ever chanted that!!
May be you misheard it… “we hate Lavin” or “we love Baron”?
I concur. I was there during the Lavin era.
I don’t remember that chant ever going up. Also, don’t remember any storming of the court in that time either. As a matter of fact, I can’t recall when we have rushed the court or the field. Ever. I know I’m wrong, but there you go. can’t put a finger on any instance.
The best thing you can do for your children is to love their mother. John Wooden
Definitely no rush in Rose Bowl
The RB security guards won’t never allow that. As for Pauley, I don’t recall any court rushes either but I do remember many people talking about the possibility of rushing if we were to beat #1 Stanford (the same season we beat them earlier at Maples when they were also ranked #1).
Go ahead and feel free to root for some Mid Major hoops team
First, bringinging up tourney games is moot. We don’t play those games at Pauley.
You must be joking about “rushing the court” after beating Just$C. That is absurd.
Your point number 2 and 3 is applicable to a mid-major student section
Duke, UNC … their students and alums will ROFL at the idea of rushing the court after beating UCLA.
Those arguments are more appropriate at some mid major college team’s blog where people get all giddy about making the tourney as a “Cinderalla” team.
You might like that tWWL inspired MTVized idea of college hoops. We are not going to embrace that kind of low balling of UCLA basketball here on BN. We cherish our program a little more not to cheapen as if it should be in the WAC or WCC.
Rose Bowl isn't ours, so we can't rush the field...
… and I don’t like getting pepper sprayed and arrested, so I opted not to rush the field during the Alabama game (and the Michigan game that season – both teams were ranked #3 in the nation at the time we played them). Ditto on 13-9. That game would have been great regardless of the final outcome. We scored 66 on Texas, but that was the year before I started, so I don’t know how the emotion was that game.
With hoops, I wonder sometimes. Because it’s our only venue where we can “rush the field”, sometimes I think we should be a little less exclusive about it – because it adds to the fun and excitement of the season. I remember rushing the court after beating #1 Arizona (couldn’t get tix for the game, but was hanging outside Pauley and the ushers were like – “people are gonna rush the court, wanna get in on this?”).
On the other hand, rushing the court with UCLA b-ball should be something we do rarely. We are, by anybody’s definition, one of the most storied programs in the nation. Rushing the court typically indicates sheer and utter joy at winning a game we upset a huge giant, of a David v Goliath proportion. Shouldn’t we be Goliath? How often do you see UNC and Duke rushing the court?
Go Bruins!
We should rush the Mosoleum
and hang on the goalposts after beating Lane’s Trojies (on probation) at the Colosseum.
God that place is horrid.
I remember the 1999 ‘SC game. The freakin’ metal stands they had in the endzone were full of SC people jumping up and down making a ridic amount of noise. And after the win (ending our streak) they streamed onto the field. (Side note – I still blame my roommate for that loss.)
Wonder how they’d reflect on storming the field after beating us now. Can’t wait until they’re at a point when storming the field against UCLA is the only thing they can hope for.
Go Bruins!
Yep, I was specifically was thinking of the 99 game
When writing my comment. It will be epic if UCLA students can rush that place in two years.
yup
We are rarely going to be in the position of being a massive underdog.
As an example, playing against UW last night, we were a 1.5 point underdog.
If we are not a big underdog, then the game should be really important to justify it. Something like a senior day victory for some heroic seniors in a close game to win the Pac-10 title outright, beating the next best team to take the title. Or beating an unbeaten #1 team in the country when we are unranked.
Question for people: if permitted, would people be in favor of storming the court at Staples if we win the Pac-10 tourney to earn a spot in the Big Dance?
by britishbruin on Jan 22, 2010 10:32 AM PST up reply actions
One more thought to add -
How about the students rushing Pauley, so as to be in a position to decide whether to rush the Court. There seemed to be plenty of empty seats in the student section. How about if each person in the Den did a little personal evangelizing, and brought one person who wouldn’t otherwise go?
Student section actually filled up pretty nicely by tipoff
and honestly they were into it the whole game and more so than any other game this season. So for those who are saying that we only got excited when we won, they are dead wrong (not directed at you Fox, just wanted to throw that out there)
The Gonzaga game
was incredible. I came thisclose to missing a flight while watching in an airport, waiting for it to finish – I wasn’t going to miss it! That being said, I don’t think any tournament win is rush-worthy unless there’s a trophy involved: otherwise, there’s still work to do.
not sure I really want to further this discussion
but there may also be something about football vs basketball. In football, people typically know the result before the last seconds of the game, so storming the field is nearly always in response to the magnitude of the game.
In basketball, you get moments – like the Gonzaga game – where an amazing series of events can happen and the game is still in the balance until the whistle blows (and obviously in the tourney, every game could be the last for that particular group of players, which adds some poignancy). So, you get some spontaneous moments of hysteria in basketball that you don’t get in football to the same degree.
Problem with the poll question
The way the question is asked completely skews the way it will be answered. If you wrote: “Did an exuberant student section, suffering through a dismal season with little to cheer about, have the right to rush the court after a thriling victory?” the results might show far more yes answers.
Among those who post here
even semi-regularly, I don’t think the phrasing would make much of a difference. Lurkers, I don’t know.
Why does that matter?
Shouldn’t we be able to parse out our opinions despite the way a question was worded? Does the wording change YOUR opinion?
Go Bruins!
well
every day you can see poll results where wording of questions dramatically changes responses. In general, you can expect it not to affect the people with strongest opinions, but you expect it to affect people who have more weakly held opinions or who are less well informed.
Typically, biased questions are used to get answers that can then be used to provide evidence of an opinion – “60% of Americans now against Health Care reform” or whatever. While I am not saying that N is trying to gather evidence to further some agenda, it is difficult to interpret the results if you think that some number of people with less strong opinions / less knowledge are being swayed by the question. At time of me writing this comment, it is basically tied up, but I have no idea how many people in the “No” camp are being swayed by the question into agreeing with the position I happen to agree with.
Not that this is a random sample to begin with; I just don’t know how to interpret answers to polls when the question is phrased in non-neutral terms or includes extraneous information that might support one side of an argument but not the other.
by britishbruin on Jan 22, 2010 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
Perhaps it's my bias.
I’m used to stripping out opinion of everything I hear and looking for the facts. I assume others (esp in this community) are/should be capable of that.
Incidentally, my prior response was in no means meant to be condescending or otherwise. Re-reading it now makes it seem a lot more hostile than intended.
Go Bruins!
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