Still Ticking: Couple Of Positive Points On UCLA Basketball
by Nestor on Jan 31, 2010 10:01 AM PST
in Basketball
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PrintI am hesitant to say something nice about this year's basketball team. Seems like every time I say something nice about the team (like getting excited after the win over Arizona State or even cautiously optimistic after the win over Washington State), they immediately go on to stumble next game. As I wrote in my last post that I found last night's game mostly unwatchable. However, as pointed out in the comment threads, sometimes boring games are expected when it features two teams playing zone defense and at least one of them doesn't have blue chip athletes on its roster. Still there were couple of very important points raised in the post game comment thread that I think are worthy elaborating on (at the risk of jinxing the team, I don't care anyway right?) the home page.
Let's start with the point bluebland (who is a hardcore negative nancy!) made about the team not giving up on Ben Howland (emphasis added throughout):
The one good thing here is that the team hasn't quit. Howland didn't lose them, as we all feared.
As crappy, ugly, and infuriating as we are, that's still very important going into next season.
It's definitely something to think about. As infuriating as the game was during the first half and the early part of second half, we kept plugging away. Similarly as ugly as the meltdown was against Oregon after we went up by a dozen points in the first half, the team hung in there and fought to tie it up and send the game in the over time. Perhaps Oregon Ducks were not as bad as their preceding 5 game losing streak, given they also pulled out a victory over a decent Southern Cal team (by Pac-10 standards) this season.
Still the point is as disinterested and listless we looked during the game against Stanford and then especially against Southern Cal, this team has been fighting. It's definitely something to take note of.
Couple of big reasons why our team hasn't quit and has kept fighting are the continued emergence of Tyler Honeycutt and Reeves Nelson. That brings me to the point Tydides raised last night:
I was loving how RN stuffs the ball with attitude. RN and TH are two guys that are keeping my interest and hope alive for this season.
It's easy to see what those two guys have brought to this team: a combination of enthusiasm, passion and patience combined with athleticism, that hasn't been apparent in rest of the starting unit. Reeves effectively serves as the single motor for this basketball team with his constant activity around the rim. In past few guys he has emerged IMHO as the emotional center of this basketball team. It is going to be fun to see him grow and develop in next few seasons.
Meanwhile, the team is showing signs of life on offense because of Tyler Honeycutt. The way he moves around without the ball, finds his team-mates with beautiful passes, and the energy and athleticism he displays while bringing down rebounds is something to watch. Given the injury issues he had coming into this season, I am more than content with what he has given us this season. I hope he has an awesome and healthy off-season, positioning himself for taking his game to another level next season.
Coming back to present, the Bruins are still thinking out loud about making something out of this season:
There was Coach Ben Howland's mathematical assessment on the by-the-numbers way the Bruins (10-11 overall, 5-4 in Pacific 10 Conference) can be successful the rest of the season.
"If you're going to be really competitive, you need to win all your home games. We've already lost two, and you need to split on the road," Howland said. "We got another split on the road, which is very hard in this league, and that's big."
However you frame it, there was no way to undersell the moment from the Bruins' perspective.
UCLA could be one game out of first place if California loses to Arizona today, just two days after slipping to within one game of last place. But that's the Pac-10 this season, and a reason the Bruins have hope.
"I have never seen this conference like this, certainly not since I've been here," guard Michael Roll said. "So we can move forward."
For me "moving forward" at this point would be to come back to Pauley with a solid homestand in which the Bruins put together two complete basketball games. It will have to start with the game against Stanford, which will present an opportunity for the Bruins to redeem one of their more forgettable games of this season.
For the Bruins to be successful against Stanford, they will have to show patience, something they weren't able to do until the initial few minutes in the second half. They were bumbling around Oregon State's 1-3-1 zone most of the first half (despite building the lead) and the first few mins of second half committing a ridiculous numbers of unenforced TOs. Then they decided to settle down and focused on getting the ball inside (instead of just passing it around the perimeter). From the Daily News:
"We were just being real patient," Lee said. "That zone tries to force turnovers, so we were just picking our spots - when to attack, when to pull it out. That's why although we only shot (35) times, we had a high percentage."
While the Bruins mixed the ball around, three players scoring in double figures, led by freshman forward Reeves Nelson's 14 points, the Beavers seemed eager to let Calvin Haynes take charge.
It will be interesting to see how Howland distributes his mins in the backcourt yesterday. Anderson had 3 assists and 3 points in 16 mins, while Hamid had 3 points and 3 boards in 8 mins. Even when Anderson was in the game, Howland had either Roll or Lee bring up the ball which was a little telling. Meanwhile, speaking of minute distribution Brendan Lane came in during the last two minutes of first half and the world didn't collapse on the Bruins. Hope that is something Coach Howland will take note of heading into this week when we are going to need our guys to be as fresh as possible heading into crunchtime against the teams for the Bay Area.
Anyway, I still have no idea where the team is heading. I personally at this point will be ok with a winning season and perhaps an NIT appearance (can't believe I am even typing that). However, most importantly I want this team to keep fighting game by game, and I want Ben Howland also to do everything he can to have all the components of this program improved (not just the key ones in Honeycutt and Nelson) and as prepared as possible for next season.
GO BRUINS.
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I think it's okay to say a few positive things about the Bruins
After all, being a .500 teams that you balance every loss with a win. Unfortunately, that is what this team seems to be, a .500 team. And given the illustrious history of our Program, this is an enormous disappointment. It appears we currently have two players around whom we can build. I suppose that’s something, given that a few weeks ago I wasn’t sure we had anybody usable. As far as CBH goes, I will let others opine about whether he is a good keeper of the torch. I have my doubts, but I honestly don’t know if we could do much better, given the budget constraints of being a public institution. I will always love my Bruins, but I don’t have much hope for a return to greatness anytime soon, at least with respect to the basketball program. Now football, that’s another matter. Go CRN!!
We're missing the Floor General
I remember AA and DC used to be an extension of Coach Howland on the floor. They knew what Ben Ball was and how to win with it. Howland already had their hearts and minds and he trusted them and they trusted him. No one has really stepped up to hold that title this year. I think it was essential that Gordon left despite his hustle and intensity. Howland is the unquestionable leader with the plan. If you want to run this team on the floor, get with the program. Unfortunately Jrue didn’t trust Howland enough to remain and learn how to play solid Ben Ball. In the NBA, it clearly shows he could use some help.
NIT is fine
I’d like to look at it like how Neuheisel saw the Eaglebank Bowl. It’s a chance to practice, play as a team longer, and gain experience in tourneys. The more games we play, the better we’ll be next year. Only exception is that I can’t wait for next year to come fast when Rago is gone.
After UCLA's one NIT title,
I thought the school decided it was the NCAA tournament or nothing.
by Gen2Bruin1987 on Jan 31, 2010 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
Walt Hazzard and the NIT
The coach who took the team to the NIT and won, commented afterwards… “There are the banners ending in 1975 on the walls, and we just added another with this team” or words to that effect. I believe that may have cooked his goose with the administration.
Bill
Mensgym
It could be worst ...
At least, our student manager is not costing us games as seen with the other “team” in LA.
good to see that someone on sc's bench hasn't yet forgotten Pinky's shining example of in-game conduct.
formerly bruinhoo
Poor kid
He was probably screaming obscenities out of his mind before realizing he was the only one screaming. Probably not a good idea to be yelling bad words at an official when your coach isn’t already drowning you out.
Oh UCLA you sweet bitch, you've BRUINed me for anything else.
kinda lame
the fans at mac court yell all sorts of garbage and very audibly since we can hear it on the telecasts. but the student manager gets t’d up? i love seeing sc embarrassed anytime, but this was faulty and highly hypocritical of the refs
Across The Face
Not Lame At All
Unlike the fans, a manager is a member of the team and is on the bench. I find this hysterical since the $c culture seems to admire cursing so much (see Coop, Timmeh, and anyone associated with FB.)
F the NIT...
…I’m not a fan and it’s beneath the dignity of our program. It’s not the same as accepting a bid to a low-tier bowl game. (and yes I remember our NIT “title” run.) OK, deep breath. Now that I’ve vented, it might be worthwhile because the frosh + ML would get more practice time and the faux post-season experience would be valuable for TH and RN.
Triple F the NIT
For what?
To CONFIRM we’re the #65th Team In The Nation?
That’s all the NIT Champ is!
INSTANT TERMINATION if Howland accepts an NIT Bid.
There is NO REASON for UCLA to ever accept an NIT Bid.
Want practice?
Hold the IM Open as in Intramural Open in Pauley Pavillion!
Let our own students kick some Varsity azz!
(And I do mean PHYSICALLY, to get in the heads of our players!)
Cal State Fullerton, Portland, Long Beach State, Mississippi State were all losses. If you want your dignity back, play against those schools in the NIT and get a W from them to make up for the early this season.
Why is it “If we’re not playing for the biggest prize, we’d rather not play at all”? I’d rather have UCLA be the 65th Team in the Nation than have a team that doesn’t want think it should play because it’s “beneath our dignity” to play UCLA basketball in a lesser tournament.
Bruins78,
please READ Nestor’s front PAGE post regarding what IS expected on BN diaries AND posts. Standard GRAMMAR is one of his points. With all DUE respect, I have a HARD time finding the POINTS you make in your COMMENTS while digging through all the CAPS throughout EACH sentence.
by KSBruin on Jan 31, 2010 7:33 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
That would be strange
INSTANT TERMINATION if Howland accepts an NIT Bid.
Since the decision comes down to Guerrero, it probably wouldn’t be fair for him to fire Howland.
</understatement
by SuperBruinMan on Feb 1, 2010 1:24 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Since the PAC-10 is pathetic...
We should honestly set our sights on finishing strong in the PAC.
Winning the PAC 10 FINALS GAME (c’mon, all 10 teams suck).
Then do our damnest to make it outta the first weekend if we make the Dance.
(That Saturday/Sunday game IS our DREAM GAME!)
A Sweet 16 Birth this year IS a Title considering where we came from.
How many Sweet 16’s does Steve Lavin have? Go Bruins.
getting to the big dance could be historic
we could be the worst seeded UCLA team to play in the tourney if we win the Pac-10 tournament…
Problem with NIT
The problem is if you accept the NIT bid, the opponents the first two rounds are low level teams, like Fullerton, Long Beach, Portland. Get my point. I’ll never forget our first round NIT loss to Irvine at Pauley. That had to be the darkest day in UCLA bball history. We do NOT want to take a chance and repeat that. If you lose in the first round of the NCAA, well then at least it was the NCAA.
Besides, if we do not make the NCAA, then that would mean an early round loss in the Pac-10 tourney, which will likely mean that we end the regular season with a losing record. We won’t even get invited to the NIT with that.
Louisville, KY for UCLA class of '87
a sweep at home would be huge
might actually be the turning point we’ve all anticipated. the fact that we’re still in the pac 10 hunt is ridonkulous given the season we’ve had, yikes. these are gonna be some tough ones though, especially cal because we can assume that their zone busting shooting will appear unlike the game at haas
Across The Face
Should accept NIT Bid
If nothing else, MR deserves a chance to keep playing. More practice for the younger guys a major plus and more Bruin games for me to watch. Go Bruins.
I say no to the NIT.
Can you name any of the NIT winners in the last ten years, or ever for that matter? (I do in fact know one – CCNY won it once, and I believe Wyoming won it once.) Did I read somewnere on here that UCLA one it once? If that’s so, then I just don’t remember it. The NIT is an afterthought at this point. It’s like winning a local three on three tournament.
If we get in the ncaa playoffs, then great. Our guys will do their best and maybe we’ll get a break here or there. If we don’t get in the tournament, let our seniors end their careers with a little dignity.
NIT tourneys could be terrific growing experiences for a young team
Jim Calhoun’s UConn team went to the NIT in 97 and in 01. Both times the followed up with Elite Eight runs in the following seasons.
Similarly Jim Boeheim’s Cuse teams went to the NIT three times in last decade. Every time his young team followed up those experiences with tourney runs the following season.
If we have to go to the NIT, I will get behind in it a big way just like I got behind the Eagle Bank Bowl. It will be great experiences for our young guys and I sure hope our players are not influenced by king of entitlement syndrome from the people who still think immediate Post Wooden era mindset is in play.
Times have changed. I see going to NIT as a positive for the development of this program given the start we had this season.
I didn't communicate effectively
I think the NIT is a big zero, and am not and will not be excited in the slightest about it, unless we are in it. If we are in it, then I’m excited for all the reasons you say. Here’s one to ponder – if we go to the NIT and win it, do we post the banner in Pauley? I think not. And that’s one of the reasons I’m just not excited about it as a tournament. (Again, unless we’re in it.)
Pot calling the kettle black?
Nestor, I got a good laugh at you calling bluebland a negative Nancy. You can’t exactly claim to be a shining beacon of optimism!
by KSBruin on Jan 31, 2010 7:37 PM PST via mobile reply actions
haha
Actually bland and I had an exchange about this. No doubt I lean towards the NN side (new acronym?). However, bluebland is often extra bitter!
A few factors
1. At Pauley, you can’t change the channel. You can pretend to aim a sling-shot at Chris Roberts’s bald spot, but it’s just not the same. So…the pain accumulates on years like this and causes a certain form of Internet Tourette’s.
2. Dorrelavin. Nestor experienced that combo from a distance of 3,000 miles. I experienced it from a distance in which it was possible to adjust your nose-hairs from the reflection in the gel. The year I spent as a ball boy I was even closer. (Though it was fun trying keep JR’s attention on his free-throw practice while the cheerleaders were warming up.)
It’s one thing to know you have two freaky uncles living far away. It’s another thing to have to face them in your very own sanctuary every thursday and saturday while trying to negotiate puberty and adolescence (Lav), and then craft a decent college experience (Karl).
freaky uncles
are your actual aunts’ crazy husbands…not really related :)
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
A few things
I’d say the main thing to note is that the team is different, and much better, since they started playing the zone. They’re now a good defensive team again, organized and hustling, and they seem like they know what they want to do and how to regroup.
Not getting the win at Oregon was disappointing, especially after Roll hit a big shot to send it to OT. ND is still so deeply problematic it’s scary, and it’s excruciating to be a Bruin fan and watch him, and his defense on the two 3 point shots in overtime, not to mention free throw woes, cost them the game, so there’s that. And that being said, I’d still rather see ND getting minutes than JA, not to mention the crazy guy that they really needed, who left the team with good riddance. So it’s a big hill to climb. Now Arizona edged Cal and there’s still a little light, which is amazing.
I made the point that watching dueling zones was bad basketball, in part to show some sympathy to the suffering Nestor. There’s an important follow-up point to be made about zone defenses, especially since the Bruin improvement is based on their excellent use of the zone. With a zone it becomes easier to neutralize guards with strong offensive skills, turning them into jump shooters from distance, and the Bruins have shown how this works against some of their recent opponents. The thing to remember is that when other teams, like the Oregon schools, play a zone against the Bruins, the same thing is true. The guy who is struggling is Malcolm Lee. Malcolm Lee is a good point guard for the Bruins, certainly much better than JA. A lot of us have been saying for a long time that the Bruins are infinitely better with ML and MR in the backcourt, MR playing his natural position at SG (with Honeycutt at SF), JA’s minutes reduced or rescinded.
But the degree of difficulty changes for ML when the opponent plays a zone. It takes away a lot of his effectiveness. The offensive game he played against Notre Dame doesn’t exist. It’s very tricky stuff, kind of an advanced or specialized type of PG play. The key for him is not to turn the ball over, keep it moving side-to-side as quickly as possible, learn to penetrate into the seams, find a way to be confident with his shot. Energy on defense will turn into some open opportunities on offense. It’s going to take some time for him to figure it out. But Lee is still a solid and improving PG, a strong option rather than a poor one. Perhaps next year the Bruins will have a better PG and ML will be a great, best SG option, but I wouldn’t want to see people here give up on him (or see JA ever get his starting job back—let him work his way into being a competent backup). The Westbrook example is an important one for ML. RW is an NBA PG. Jrue Holiday is an NBA PG. If ML is going to play in the NBA, it’ll be as a PG. So he might as well work hard at it and learn and get the experience. RW’s PG minutes at UCLA were very problematic to start, and they were limited.
I could add some notes about wanting to see Reeves Nelson face the basket, move outside a little, and expand his game, but the Bruins obviously need him to do what he’s doing, and I’ll leave that alone for the moment. Nelson is already a classic Bruin, and how great would it be to see him start hitting Wooden’s bank shot?
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