Spaulding Roundup: Vindictive Bruin Hating Tradmed Hacks, QB Competition & Other UCLA Notes
by Nestor on Oct 13, 2010 5:24 AM PDT
in Football
Email
PrintLet's start the Humpday roundup by trying to close the loop on the hysteria and feeding frenzy started by two pre-emptive hit jobs by hack beat reporters from the Trojan Times and the OC Register. Chris Foster got the UCLA bashing party started by breathlessly reporting 3 starters were getting suspended in a curiously written article on Rick Neuheisel's program without any context. Then Scott Reid from the OC Register poured gasoline on Foster's fire by posting an erroneous and misinformation riddled "report" about 6 UCLA starters getting suspended for the Oregon game. That "report" of course spread all over creating a mass confusion about the program in Bruin Nation and around the country.
By the end of the day it turned out that UCLA was suspending only 2 players - Morrell Presley and Josh Smith - essentially proving those hacks' report much ado about nothing. Still those jerks kept pressing and kept looking for a story to push their predetermined narrative that Neuheisel cannot deal with off-field issues as the head coach of a football program. None of them issued an apology or retraction for their misinformation riddled reports. Instead they came out and kept pressing Rick Neuheisel during his post practice interview here:
Coach Neuheisel to his credit kept his calm dealing with these jerks even though they kept asking asinine questions. It is a good question right now in terms of how we as a community should be dealing with these clowns beyond not subscribing to their less than mediocre work products and lighting them up here and through our social media networks. If anyone has creative ideas, make sure you post them in comment threads. There has to be ways to expose these guys as bitter, mediocre, Bruin hating tradmed hacks, who are out there with a specific agenda to launch hit jobs on UCLA's athletic programs. More after the jump (including actual football notes) after the jump.
As you can see from the video above CRN mentioned during his comments that he let the team know that at UCLA when players cross line there will be consequences and that he would use these instances as teachable moment. As for the players, Presley at least in words is taking responsibility:
"As a young man, I tend to learn all my lessons the hard way," Presley said. "This comes along with it. I made a mistake, violated a rule, and I'm paying the price right now. ... I'm going to learn from mistakes. I never make the same mistake I've made before. I'm going to take this and grow as a man."
He better get it together fast. He is going to run out of chances very soon. He has had two suspensions now due to off-field issues and one due to academic reasons. I would think if he has one more off-field related issue, he shouldn't remain as part of UCLA. That is just me.
Josh Smith appeared more than contrite. He seemed emotional during his comments after practice which you can view through this video on BruinReportOnline.com (not behind a subscription firewall). It is nice to see the kid not showing any kind of victim complex and take responsibility. Let's hope he comes back from it strong.
Oh yeah, we actually have football notes to talk about. More on that after the jump. Before the frenzy over the suspension broke out, the talk was all about QB competition. Coach Neuheisel mentioned in his video above that he is looking for "consistency" from his QBs and want a healthy competition out at Spaulding. Here is how Peter Yoon from ESPNLA saw the QB "competition" play out yesterday:
- The open competition at quarterback officially began with Kevin Prince and Richard Brehaut splitting most of the reps with the first and second teams. Brehaut appeared to take the early lead after Prince had two poorly thrown passes intercepted. Neuheisel said he hoped to have a decision by early next week. "I want consistency," Neuheisel said. "I want leadership. I want management and I want consistency. I don't think any coach in the country wants anything other than that. Big plays are wonderful, but we need to hit balls that we should hit."
- Offensive coordinator Norm Chow didn't sound too thrilled about the idea of having an open competition, saying he would rather pick one and stick with him. Prince would be his choice, he said. "Right now if we had to play, I'm sure it would be Kevin Prince," Chow said. "That's my opinion."
- Prince said the competition is just part of the job, especially with an offense that has struggled to move the ball through the air. "It's football. It's a competitive sport and just that we're going to have an open competition. That's fine. Me and Rich have both been there before in competitive spots and that's what football is all about."
Hmm. Chow's comments are a little curious I hope his comments are nothing more than an effort to light a fire under Richard Brehaut. However, I am not sure if the choice is clear cut any more about Prince being the best QB in our current roster. Perhaps a healthy Prince who had been 100 percent all season and never missed any action would be clearly ahead of Brehaut, but right now the picture is not as clear as Chow's comments make it seem to be. Still, as mentioned yesterday, I think the coaches need to stick with Kevin Prince for at least one more game.
More from Jon Gold on the "status of the passing game":
Talked to a few guys about the status of the passing game, and the one good thing is that everyone is doling out and accepting blame. This really is a team-wide issue, and you get the feeling that they ALL feel the heat. I have to say, I'm impressed by the way that Kevin Prince has handled this criticism. I'll have a good interview with him up later.
Looking forward to hearing what Prince had to say. Gold's videos are always pretty interesting to watch and add lot more context and color in our understanding of what goes on with the program.
Meanwhile, the situation at cornerback is interesting:
Andrew Abbott and Courtney Viney worked as first-team cornerbacks today, particularly of interest because only Sheldon Price is hurt, so that means Viney leapfrogged Aaron Hester. With Hester's performance, I wouldn't consider it a surprise, but I am a bit surprised that they actually made the move. Viney was great in practice last week, especially on Wednesday, and I've had many tell me they think he's the best cover corner on the team. This is a guy who started Week 2 last season before getting the one-game suspension, and he locked down Tennessee wideouts. This could be a really interesting adjustment.
Not sure if anyone has picked up on this. As much heat as we have brought on Chuck Bullough, I really appreciate the fact that our defensive coaches seem lot more aggressive in testing out different personnel and packages than our offensive counterparts. Of course it doesn't mitigate the fact that Bullough remains deficient in terms of aggressive game planning and scheming (based on what we see on gamedays). Still it is something of note.We saw this willingness to shake up personnel in their decision to give Owa and Graham starts at DEs last weekend.
Of course the latest moves at CB was brought on by injury issues.FWIW if you watched the entire CRN video posted above he mentioned that Sheldon Price's MRI came out negative and that he would "not rule him out" for the Oregon game. While I like Viney and Abbott, I still think it would be interesting to try Tony Dye out at CB. Dye started out at UCLA as a nickel back and I think could be a good option there, allowing coaches to insert Dietrich Riley at SS.
As for other personnel issues, Neuheisel mentioned Damien Thigpen will be the kick returner (replacing Josh Smith). Thigpen will also get a lot of look at F-Back and it appears that Anthony Barr (who is out with a calf strain) might be ready to get back in practice by this weekend. We will keep our fingers crossed
All of these issues and other notes will be discussed in detail later tonight when Ryan and 03rdn9 get our weekly podcast fired up at 7 pm PST. You should tune in at the time and fire away any question you might want to chat up with them. Sooner or later we will get our attention on the Ducks, once we are done cutting through all the BS flung at UCLA from the tradmed hacks posing as our beat reporters. Hopefully the podcast will be the perfect pivot point to get back to just discussion football. Tune in at 7 TONIGHT.
GO BRUINS.
69 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Chow
Quoted in Foster: “Kevin Prince is our starting quarterback right now, as far as I know.” “As far as I know…” “That’s my opinion.” It seems to me the Chow and RN need to get on the same page, not just to give a consistent message to media (that really is secondary) but this must seem disconnected to the players. Mom and Dad need to be on the same page; basic Parenting 101, and coaching is certainly a kind of parenting.
Re creative ideas
I listen to more sports talk radio than is healthy for someone my age, but I almost always enjoy interviews with sports reporters. Sometimes, their knowledge is broad, sometimes specific, but they often bring an insightful and mostly unbiased view.
Easy for me to say, but what if Ryan and 03rdn9 were to extend invitations for 10 or 15-minute phone-in interviews during their podcasts to the likes of Jon Gold and his L.A. brethren/sistren?
Interviews would be balanced, not ambushes, and would include fair and tough questions about the reporters’ work. Let’s see how they react, not to spurious charges and innuendo, but to words that they’ve written and to stories on which they have been silent.
As I say, easy for me to suggest that Ryan and 03rdn9 take on even MORE unpaid (but greatly appreciated) work.
I feel so bad for CRN
having to deal with this kind of reporting from a couple of hating hacks has to be growing tiresome.
Creative ideas – not sure how this helps but it makes feel better! i changed the signature on my personal email and my status theme on my social network page to say – CHRIS FOSTER OF THE SC TIMES IS A HACK
Go Bruins.
"Success is never final, Failure is never fatal. It's Courage that count's" - John Wooden.
We all need to understand
as I think we do, that fair and balanced reporting, which is basically neutral and informative, is not what contemporary sports journalism is about. To these guys, their need to fill space or time, to keep the attention of the general audience, is paramount .Negativism and sensationalism are ways to do this. And a story that can be used for several days, during which speculation can be piled on speculation and opinion and innuendo can replace mere factual data, is the best for their purposes .Athletes, coaches and institutions are mere grist for their mills. I do not say that all sports journalists are of this sort. But the media have insatiable needs. So we need to understand where they are coming from.
The notion that this type of job paradigm is being accepted
Is, to me, an indicator that this job should not exist. Sensationalism and falsifying data to achieve an end? Is there another industry that celebrates either of those things?
Understanding?
Understanding, in the sense of some analysis of the current state of profession, is one thing. The reality of focused attacks is another. There is a strong argument that this group of hacks attack UCLA in ways they do not attack SUC. That is beyond simple characteritics of modern sensationalist journalism. Why don’t they attack SUC in ways to satisfy the “insatiable need?”
What is also true, however, is that all our reaction only validates what they do… does stir up a kind of attention that rewards the BS and demonstrate to their bosses their usefulness. Which is why Nestor has asked for a creative response. Simply complaining in the various digital spaces available to us (BN etc.) or contacting the paper directly does nothing, in fact probably helps them.
I think
Citizen journalism here could be a good option. If there are UCLA students out there who care about this and want to pursue this, then they should think about putting guys like Simers, Foster and Reid on the spot by badgering them with poignant questions (unlike the ridiculous and tired ones they pose day after day) with flip cams and then expose them. Expose them for what they are: bunch of hacks trying to gin up cheap hits to their websites and articles by pursuing cheap agenda driven storylines.
Another thing we need to understand
is that these guys are not writing for the Wall Street Journal or the London Times. Their brand of urinalism is more in keeping with the National Inquirer.
Student citizen journalism
sounds great. As was said earlier it could be a kind of theater of the absurd… porkpie hats with “Press” cards in the hatband. Little notebooks in thier hands scribbling notes with pencil stubs as they ask questions. Horn rimmed glasses. I can feature this.
Neuheisal needs to show who runs this program
and it isn’t Norm Chow.
If the head coach wants an honest competition to see who should be quarterback, the offensive coordinator is being insubordinate by suggesting he has already made up his mind.
Neu needs to get Chow in line and let Chow know he will be deciding the starting qb. I know folks are hoping this is Chow trying to get Brehaut fired up, but since he stopped the other qb competition before even letting Bre practice, I think it is far more likely he is committed to Prince, regardless of Prince’s game time performance. There is nothing Brehuat can do to change Chow’s mind because Chow’s mind is made up. Neu needs to step in here and exercise his authority.
The other thing to point out is this is a one game suspension. The amount of hype Bruin haters like the LAT is generating is truly comical. They aren’t suspended for the season or anything. They are sitting out one game.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 9:48 AM PDT reply actions
I see where you are coming from silver
I am going to give Chow/Prince one more game at least. Don’t want to see Brehaut starting in Oregon.
That's cool
but if Brehaut isn’t going to start, the Coaching staff shouldn’t say there is a competition for the starting job next week. Just stay the course and name Prince the starter.
Frankly, I don’t think there should be competition. Rick should name Bre the starter. Prince always gets rave reviews on how he practices, but he still cannot throw the ball accurately in a game time situation. Couple this with the fact his knees aren’t healthy and I am not sure what they think they are going to get out of him?
This wouldn’t be Brehaut’s first start, and the Oregon defense is average. Its the offense that is going to kill us. I also think the players play harder and have more confidence in Bre. They know the ball can actually get to them if they are receivers. I don’t have evidence for that, just observation, but I don’t think the players have any confidence in Prince to get it done.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 10:15 AM PDT up reply actions
I think it's not as cut and dry man
First, it appears from the reports that both QBs shared equal time with first team. So there does seem to be a “competition.” Theoretically at least that should light a fire under Prince.
As for Chow, I am leaning towards your sentiment. However, as I said I wouldn’t want Brehaut to be thrown in against Oregon in Eugene. Defensive stats notwithstanding, I just think it is bit too much to start a sophmore who has only started one game … at home … against Washington.
To me … it’s put up or shut up time for Prince. He needs to have a solid game against Oregon. He needs to come up with somewhere in the ball part of 150-200 passing yards, loosen up the Ducks defense for our running game (with minimal mistakes). If he can’t do that, Brehaut should be named starter for the following week.
I can respect that
Its just when I look and ask myself who has a better chance of getting 200 passing yards and scoring enough to keep it close with Oregon, Its just not Prince.
I haven’t seen a thing from him this year that shows me he can accurately throw the ball. His one accurate performace was so limited (4-7 for 27 yards against Texas) it just shows the guy isn’t a passer. And with both kness bothering him, he isn’t a real running threat either.
I think the risk/reward just doesn’t favor starting Prince.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions
I agree with you about Prince not living up to reasonable standard this year
What has me holding on to hope at least for one more game is that he did show his ability last year in few games. He almost had 200 yards of passing against Washington in just one half. I think the potential is there and his overall ability (in terms of mobility and capacity to read the offense and insert predictability) is better than Brehaut. At least I thought so. But the Cal game was a step back.
We will see how he does next Saturday. If he can’t then I think Neuheisel will need to take charge of the offense. I think Neuheisel is doing everything he can to show deference to Chow. I respect that in him. I’d do the same given Chow’s track record. However, I think everyone is reaching their limit in terms of patience. Chow/Prince will have to get it going in Eugene.
When Prince is Healthy and Has Practiced
he is a better QB.
During the WSU game, Brehaut did not run the pistol well. And, it appeared that we dumbed down the playbook for him.
If Prince is not healthy, it’s a no brainer for me. You start Brehaut.
sjh
what do you think about
platooning the QBs then sticking with who has the hot hand? Maybe KP would be more effective coming off the bench in games? just a thought.
"Success is never final, Failure is never fatal. It's Courage that count's" - John Wooden.
I love it
give them each a quarter and go with the hot hand in the second.
I usually hate qb by committee, but I would prefer that over an ineffective prince until there is 4 minutes left in the 4th quarter.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions
2 things
1st – Chow seems like there is no other person around except Prince for QB. Prince has a lot of heart but he has not be able to get the job done due to injuries. Why is Chow so set on Prince? Could it be other factors entering in to cloud Chow’s vision?
2nd – I e-mailed Foster yesterday about his unequal reporting and why didn’t he do anything when his dear friend Pete Carroll looked the other way when things were happening at $c. I asked him if he didn’t like UCLA because he got rejected when he applied? His reply was, “Thanks for reading”. I sent him another e-mail asking him to answer my questions. I am waiting for a reply.
by Forever a Bruin on Oct 13, 2010 9:51 AM PDT reply actions
Why did you email Foster?
What did you think that was going to accomplish other than giving him the satisfaction that he was being read?
I ask the questions above not to be confrontational at all. I just don’t get why people send angry emails to sports writers. That was so 2005 and 2006. Doesn’t really work any more and as discussed plenty of other ways to blast them online. Even then we have to think of new ways to shame and ridicule them. No need to spend the energy emailing him.
I wanted to see
if he was man enough to answer my questions and hopefully make him think twice about his ugly reporting. I know he doesn’t think at all, see his columns, but I guess i just wanted to rattle his cage. Sorry, I won’t e-mail him again. I see what you mean. You do a great job, Nestor.
by Forever a Bruin on Oct 13, 2010 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
No worries
He (along with Simers of the world) wants those angry emails because they provide them with perfect fodder to caricature UCLA fans. So not worth falling into that trap (but no apologies needed at all).
Did he say when he was going to print a retraction?
or why he feels he can print sources saying the players were suspended for drug use, even after these same sources were wrong yesterday about the story he printed?
Guy is a H-A-C-K
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions
Thigpen!!!!!
I really want to see him in open field!
I imagine these hacks
check in on BN and other brother(sister) sites to gage reactions to their dribble. Curious if you have any IPs logged that belong to the latimes.com domain and/or its parent company domains. If so, they’re reeeeeading…rip’em here guys and gals, as Nestor suggests, rather than emailing them
Coments from the father of a sports writer.......
My son is a graduate of the U of Wisconsin school of journalism. He has covered the Badgers and the Packers as well as being the prep sports editor of the Oakland Tribune and currently works for the Las Vegas newspaper and is a columnist for MaxPrepsports.com. Not bragging (just a little) but to let you know where I’m coming from.
I have had many conversations with my son about the nature of sports reporting and the sorry state of affairs with the local fish wrap. My son grew up reading Jim Murray and the other great reporters that worked for the local rag.
Things have change dramatically in sports reporting in the last 15 years. The acendency of TWWL and the internet have made access to news, trades and scores instantaniously. We no longer have to wait until the morning paper to know how our local teams fared. I can get scores anytime on my cell phone if desired.
Newspaper sports sections have downsized their staffs. Today a beat reporter has to search for an angle to a story. It’s no longer about what happened and what the score was. The reporter needs a hook or gimmick. It might be sarcasm ala Page2 or just being a jerk like most of the fish wraps staff.
Sports reporting has also become all about the technique of the sports. We are constantly bombarded with the X’s and O’s of the game. Remember when Monday night Football was fun. When Howard and Don would clown around in the booth and the game was secondary? New we are constantly accosted with X’s and O’s and telestrators after every play as if we were all football coaches. Do we really need to know on every play that that was a Cover 2?
The L.A. area is unique for a major metropolitan area. We have no pro football team. The local sports writers treat UCLA and U$C as if they were our two NFL teams. One has had sucess so they get treated with kid gloves and we get treated like the ugly red head step child because we haven’t been as successful. Never mind that one team cheats and the other plays by the rules.
The cheaters win so who cares. In our society it is ok to cheat as long as you are successful and don’t get caught. Have we prosecuted any Wall Street cheaters? Bankers?
The nature of the media has changed over the past 15 years. No longer is TradMedia fair and balanced. Everybody is pushing an agenda. Sports not withstanding.
Congrats on your kid's success
You have every reason to be proud!
don't feel sorry for the LA Slimes
the once self-proclaimed “One of the World’s Great Newspapers”, the Slimes does not dictate the future of the LA area. Like that urban college fortress a short drive down Figueroa, they desperately want pedigrees long after the general population has moved on.
Video has become a new required component of communication specialists. IMO the Slimes hacks do not possess strong video reporting skills. Meanwhile, far better journalists such as Jon Gold has some.
Since there is little to report about the urban college’s football team other than probation, players and staff leaving, a weak OOC schedule, declining fan base, and a two game losing streak that might become three, depending how inconsistent Cal is this week. So we get their writers trying to shift attention and launching attacks on the Bruins and their fans instead.
Things went to s...t
when the Tribune Company bought the fish wrap from the Chandler family. The Times was always playing favorites to SUC as long as I can remember. UCLA got decent press but always played second fiddle to SUC. Once the Trib bought the paper their sports dept turned to shit.
Bob Marley
Josh needs to ditch that tiresome Bob Marley look and develop a new role model. Try emulating say, the Mike Singletary (49er head coach and NFL hall of fame linebacker) look. Right now Josh and Mike hare having essentially the same professional success but Josh needs to start looking the part of a successful football player.
Personally...
… and with all due respect, I don’t really think it’s any of our business how Josh Smith decides to style his hair, or if he chooses to like Bob Marley. And how do we even know that he sports his hair a certain way because he likes Marley? I think you’re drawing some dangerously close-minded conclusions here.
Personally,
I think Bob Marley is a great role model…
but that’s just me..
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions
Josh
Perhaps is going for this look!
And I hope he busts out (or is allowed to bust out like that) sometime soon. Come on Chow. Please make it happen coach.
+1 -- I agree with Silver
Marley is a great role model.
Listen to his songs. Learn about his life.
sjh
Chow's comments are fine if made in private.
But to make them public in the face of his Head Coach’s statement that there is an open competition at quarterback and that we need improvement in the passing game is disrespectful and insubordinate to Rick and insulting to Brehaut since it tells him nothing he can do will change Chow’s mind even when the head coach says the position is open. Nor is Chow’s comment helpful to the overall team that sees his dissension and wonders who is going to win out in this sideshow drama.
It’s very disappointing to see a grown man with such experience act this way when he is supposed to be leading by example. There can only be one Head Coach, but not in the mind of Mr. Chow, who apparently feels he can diss his coach with impunity. If Rick does finally “overrule” his OC, you get the feeling Norm just may exit the program. One surmises his failure to land a HC job of his own has left him bitter and/or Rick promised him absolute control over the offense, but is now “infringing” out of necessity, and Norm is trying to hold him to the deal.
We really don’t know, of course, but something is wrong with this picture. The reality is that Rick is the Head Coach and the responsibility is all his and his alone when it comes to judgement time on the renewal of his contract. So he had best act accordingly and tell Norm to be quiet from henceforth for the good of the program.
GO BRUINS!
Yup
There’s a passive aggressive arrogance embedded in his “as far as I am concerned…” affect. He’s a great coach with a great history. I respect him. But he needs to say “It’s Rick’s call.”
by harry bruin on Oct 13, 2010 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm not so sure.
I mean, after Brehaut’s not-so-stellar start vs WSU and the whole can’t-score-from-8-yards-out, there isn’t much question in my mind that Prince can do just as well, if not better than Brehaut. Brehaut just doesn’t command the pistol as well, and I truly believe most of the issues with the passing game lie with the OL and receivers. Who’s to say Chow isn’t thinking the same?
by b d on Oct 13, 2010 12:32 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
i think everyone is being wayy to harsh on Chow
You don’t create heisman caliber qbs by “opening competition” in the middle of a season. I get everyone is frustrated with Princes game but Prince has the ability to become great and Chow sees that. While the Pistol was suggested by Coach Neu, Chow is running the offense. And I think that it will take a little stubbornness to get Prince to be stable in this slightly adjusted offense.
Other than that Chow has shown he knows when a qb can be successful and I think if he’s coming up with these game plans he should have the ability to at least voice his opinion on who he believes will be most successful. And he knows his job is on the line, he has stated so multiple times. I thick Rick Neuheisel wants to see Prince in too. But has plenty of frustrated outsiders who he is at least playing the politics game of telling people that he is “reviewing” the situation.
by UCLABRU1 on Oct 13, 2010 12:38 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
let me also add
This is also entirely contingent on Princes health. If he can remain healthy I believe Chow’s endorsement of Prince is completely legitimate.
by UCLABRU1 on Oct 13, 2010 12:41 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Two sides to the coin:
1. Is it a true competition for the job, or is it just for Prince to feel the heat and play better?
2. Chow probably doesn’t believe in that sort of competition, and he said it so that Prince would know that his job was actually safe.
Competition doesn’t always work. Sometimes it shatters confidence instead of motivating. Some players respond better when they know that they have to be out there to play. The end goal isn’t just to get to play, but to play well.
Furthermore, if I am not mistaken, when CRN hired Chow, the condition was that CNC would make the calls on offense, and to me that means he decides who should play.
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
I think there's too much focus on the QB
What do they expect either Prince or Brehaut to do with an OL that doesn’t protect and receivers that don’t catch? I think they’re putting the wrong guys on the hot seat. If they’re going to just accept the fact that whoever the QB ends up being is going to get roughly 5 seconds to get rid of the ball (to a receiver that may or may not drop it) or run, I don’t see the point of the whole QB controversy, because the Wazzu game taught us all that Brehaut can’t sell the run. The question of who is the better pocket passer is wholly contingent on the existence of a pocket.
Totally disagree...
… I know there are issues with the OL, but Prince doesn’t seem to have any poise in the pocket. I know we act as if we have the worst OL on earth, but I have a hard time believing this guys are much worse than the guys @ Nevada.
I think our receivers aren’t making plays, but they aren’t as a whole making a ton of drops (Harkey aside, who is in there for blocking). Let’s face it, without a real viable threat for our QB to run, we’re not terribly difficult to gameplan against. In watching the Cal game, there were several instances where Prince/Brehaut had time to throw and still made the wrong decision (i.e., interception on a ball that would have probably gone for 7 if he made the right read — I believe the reports were that it was Prince who made the mistake on that one, not Carroll).
They may not be worse
than the guys at Nevada, but they have far less collective experience. They are obviously strong enough, but pass blocking is a different skill.
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
CONFIDENCE
Sorry tasser, I’ve never been one for the competition shattering confidence argument. If one’s self-esteem is so low that competition will shatter their confidence, we probably don’t want that person leading our program. That argument never seems to come up with competition at any other position. In fact it may help somebody move to a higher level of performance.
Not really what I mean chiro
I agree with you and I was going to write that as well, but my point had more to do with the comment made right before yours. If you’re playing to the best of your ability, but are still not doing well because of elements out of your control, what good does it do to have a competition when it has already been made clear several times that you’’re the starter. The QBs can’t do very well because our OL isn’t quite what it should be yet and receivers drop a lot of passes. I believe the coaches know this, particularly Chow, and so there isn’t much they can change to make things better.
On another note, I wonder if our defense isn’t helping our offense develop because they offer little challenge at practice…
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
Distinction
… I am not challenging the judgment (that Prince should remain the starter) but rather the comment made in public that, on the surface, seems to contradict the Head Coach. If asked “who’s starting QB” the answer should be “that’s Rick’s call.” A program under durress needs to speak with one, coherent voice.
Chow is very straightforward
while CRN may be trying to put out a few fires by having this “competition”. I still think that CRN also believes Prince will remain the starter, but is just doing this to light a fire and go through the motions to put some the natives at ease…
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
i agree with tasser.
Our OL has been terrible at pass protection. What is point of having WRs stretching the field if the qb doesn’t have enough time to go through his options. I would really like to see Prince utilize more pump fakes as I believe qbs that sell pumps well usually get a few milli seconds. And without a good OL our WRs aren’t getting enough time to create seperation from the DBs.
But regardless the coaches made a decision during camp. And if they keep flip flopping they create an atmosphere of indecisiveness and insecurity in this team. And that does NOT win games. What kind of message are they endorsing if they don’t work together in correcting these problems. This team knows they are better than the losses to stanford and cal. But they need that fire. That hunger to prove themselves to the Bruin Nation. And that falls on the coaches. Well guess what, there is no chance for that fire to burn if you pull out the gasoline keeping it lit. Its this indecisiveness that tells the team to second guess itself.
Either way you see it, this competition should really be utilized to reinforce to the team that they should trust their team captain to run this offense. But that won’t ever happen if this OL doesn’t give him enough time to pass.
by UCLABRU1 on Oct 13, 2010 3:04 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
i don't get that logic either
Regarding the QB position where have they flip flopped at all this season? Its been Prince as the Starter no matter what. Regardless of performance or health, it seems that Brehaut hasn’t been given any serious considerations for the QB spot. I know that when playing football the QB position is looked upon as the leadership spot on the team. When the starting QB isn’t cutting it on the field you feel disheartened as team, that can be lead to even worse feelings withing the players.
i agree the OL is where everything starts. We can all agree that the OL isn’t great, probably avg at best. I’m not going to blame Prince for the problems especially with the passing game, its a team effort and the whole team deserves blame.
With the Pistol offense being new, that means Prince and Brehaut should have the same amount of time learning the offense. I guess i’m saying why not give Brehaut the shot against Oregon. The team has 2 weeks to prepare Brehaut for the game. This can be a good chance at giving Brehaut a fair shot at seeing what he can do, even against Oregon.
But he is cutting it on the field
when he is fully healthy. He showed that against Houston and Texas. That’s the whole dilemma.
Healthy Prince > Healthy Brehaut > Injured Prince
When injured, he does not perform well on the field. That’s what the coaches need to realize and be more stringent about.
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
No offense, but where do you see Prince's greatness?
He was a 3 star recruit coming out of high school.
he is statistically last in D1 football at the quarterback position. That is the bottom 1% in performance.
He was statistically 8th out of 10 last year in pac 10 qbs. I couldn’t find his overall ranking, but I would guess somewhere in the bottom 10 to 20 % based on the pac 10 ranking.
He doesn’t have a strong arm. . His accuracy is very poor, he often throws above, behind, in front of, below, or around receivers, and he can’t complete anything 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage.
He is a good runner when healthy, and has good mobility, but he was out his senior year in high school with knee problems, and hasn’t been consistently healthy since.
I think Prince is what he was projected to be coming out of high school: someone who, with time in a program could be an average D1 quarterback. I expect to see that from him around his 4th or 5th year in the program.
But the guy is not particularly gifted throwing the ball nor particularly sturdy. He does work hard, and I don’t question his commitment or work ethic, I just don’t see much upside him beyond being servicable with a ton of time invested.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions
So your telling me that Neuheisel and Chow
should scrap Prince from playing because YOU believe he will be an average D1 quarterback over our Offensive Coordinator who has coached 3 Heisman winners, not including Steve Young, or Philip Rivers???
Now I’m not advocating for Prince to keep playing the ENTIRE season if he keeps throwing for less than 50% but considering the game plans we used for over half of our games this year (other than Cal and Washington), Running was what our Offensive Line could do best. So is Brehaut the savior for our Pistol offense if he isn’t making as good of reads as Kevin Prince? If not Brehaut are we seriously even contemplating throwing in a QB that has zero starts at the D1 level in Bell, who may I add, has a novice understanding of our playbook, and isn’t even our number 2? Regardless of our QBs, you completely omitted the fact that it doesn’t matter who is in there, if we don’t have consistently good Pass protection for the starter he is going to be running every down.
What I am saying is the coaches are the ones who have been following these players the closest. They made their decision during training camp because they obviously saw that Prince had an edge. Now if that’s not translating in games, I think there are A LOT of other factors at play in regards to our performance against these teams which have been mentioned by several other people in posts and comments. One of them being our defense not preparing our Offense well enough in practice, etc.
also, I may not have been clear about Steve Young and Philip Rivers
Neither of them were Heisman winners.
The season is half over
When is this going to translate into games?
Game 11? Game 12?
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Its not just that I believe he is average at best
its his performance in high school, evaluation by high school rating agencies, performance in his first season, performance to date in his second season, and his history of constantly being injured the past 4 consecutive seasons that point to that more than likely being the case.
If you have any actual evidence or performance of greatness that isn’t practice related, I would love to see it because it hasn’t shown up in any games to date.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 8:04 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd say if we clearly don't have a chance at making it to a bowl game
then the Kevin Prince experiment may have to be discussed over again and we should focus on the future. But the coaches made their decision already, so why not go with their initial commitment to support this qb as the starter. And if they do waiver in their commitment why should any of the other players maintain their dedication to this program? I view it on a level of trust. It’s not like Kevin Prince didn’t make any passes last year. He was better than Brehaut last year and he ran the offense better this year otherwise Chow and Neuheisel wouldn’t have given him the starting position. Obviously it hasn’t been pretty and I’m pissed off about it too. I just think its important to include every factor before we jump into another qb controversy.
at what point do you think you replace him?
he has been playing injured all season, has not been an effective thrower,and Brehaut has equal or better stats for the games he has played. At what point do you make a change?
And what does it say to a team when you can be injured, and the worst performing qb in division 1, and your coaches won’t make a change. Is that fair to the rest of the team? I don’t think it is.
by silverlakebruin on Oct 13, 2010 8:21 PM PDT up reply actions
I must be coming down with a fever
I find that I agree with Silver (again.) I usually felt very secure taking the opposition position Silver took, but apparently he’s getting smarter. But I digress.
Anyway, how can you argue with the numbers? Maybe Prince is the best QB we have, based on practice. But based on games, he doesn’t seem to be very productive. So maybe, despite what the coaches see in practice that we don’t, we should give a shot to someone else. Coach Neuheisel wasn’t perceived to be a good quarterback, but someone gave him a chance and we know what happened. I wouldn’t mind seeing someone else running the team.
I guess I just feel confident enough in the coaches decision
that I don’t really care who they pick at this point so long as they fix all the other problems plaguing this UCLA team. Our Defense is too plain and easy to scheme against, our Offense has several other issues besides QB play.
In any case, here are the numbers between Prince and Brehaut for this year: from uclabruins.com:
Brehaut has 19cmp/ 38 att and 0 tds
Prince has 42cmp/94 att and 3 tds.
Prince’s longest pass was 35 yds.
Brehaut’s longest pass was 19 yds.
Kevin Prince averages 76.8 yds/G
Brehaut has averaged 63.0 yds/G
Brehaut has a higher passing efficiency but KP also has 3 tds rushing while Brehaut has 1 TD overall (rushing).
Sorry, I’m just personally confident in Chow’s decision, but I respect your point of view and I I think we’re just going to have to agree to disagree. Either way, I just hope UCLA puts together a solid attack against Oregon and hopefully builds enough momentum to get us to a bowl game.
GO BRUINS!!
I don't get
why the coaches would be playing someone who is “clearly” not good, as silver believes. It just doesn’t make sense…so obviously it is just not that clear. It is a tough decision.
That being said, I remember two things:
- KP was a CTS recruit, kept by CRN (who honored all scholarships offered)
- RB was a CRN/CNC recruit
If RB was truly a clear cut better choice, you’d better believe he’d be playing now.
But hey, what do I know. I’m just the 800 lbs bruin in the room.
QB cocompetition is vital
I’m a ‘niners fan (insert joke here) and the single biggest mistake that team made this year (among many) might just be anointing Alex Smith the starter without a bonafide camp competition. It’s one thiing for a guy to get his job back next season if he’s really proven he’s “the man”, but if he hasn’t – and I think we could debate whether or not Prince “proved” it last year – he can’t really own the job and lead if there’s even a hint of uncertainty among those he needs to lead. If you believe in this logic as I do, it HELPS the QB to outright win the job in camp – and in the process earn the respect of his teammates. Alex Smith was handed the job this year for a lot of reasons I won’t go into here, and as some of you may know, it’s a little… ugly …up in SF right now. It’s not an apples to apples comparison, but I believe Prince can only benefit from being pushed by a real competition. If he emerges the better QB, he will have that much more respect from his teammates and be better able to push them to be their best on game day. If he consistently underachieves on the field, however, and the coaches don’t acknowlege it by challenging him in practice, it’s entirely possilbe some of the team might question his ability to lead them – in which case in makes perfect sense for CRN to give him the opportunity to prove it to all of them in pracitce, and put the whispers to bed. My two cents, I think he’s the guy – and therefore, should welcome the challenge.
We are losing games as a team
we are losing at almost all of our positions on both sides of the ball.
To blame Prince or Chow is foolish.
sjh
If you look at it that way
then we can’t change anything, because everything is interrelated.
I am not “blaming” Prince for losing. I am saying Chow’s unwavering devotion to him is hurting the team because he is not our best option at this point. A hurt Prince with limited running ability is a disaster for this team, because his throwing ability is substandard. To continue running him out there demoralizes the team and reduces our chances of winning.
So, will win if we make a switch? Don’t know. Do I think we have a better shot and will see better qb play from a healthy qb with better physical tools and a higher upside? Yes!
by silverlakebruin on Oct 14, 2010 7:09 AM PDT up reply actions
Prince
Look at this logically. Sometimes, success means two steps forward, and another back.
Prince earned respect and praise after his display of heart at Tennessee, last year.
It was gutsy, and he acted like a leader. He was certainly an improvement over his predecessor.
Now, we’ve seen reality, and we’re searching for something better. Is that a gut reaction?
Short-sighted?
I think the kid just needs to get healthy. No, he is not a great quarterback, but I think he can be a good and effective one. Unfortunately, he’s playing behind a cobbled and weak offensive front .
I watched Prince on the sideline, last week. He appears to have the respect of the team.
Frankly, I would rather see my leader chuckling a little with Brehaut than looking dour when the chips are down. That’s how ‘the incident’ it looked to me. He was keeping it loose.
That said, I am in favor of an open competition. It will become even more interesting, next year, when the blue-chipper arrives.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bruins Nation
Related FanShots on Bruins Nation
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
