Washington Humiliates UCLA, As Howland's Gutless Coaching Costs Bruins More Than A Game
We are quitting early tonight because Ben Howland quit on this team in the first half of this game. The 97-68 DEMOLITION on tWWL score is now not final but it really does not matter. The box score if you care to look will available here.
Howland just coached what was arguably his worst game in his career at UCLA. After feeling good from what was perhaps the best win of the season, Howland's UCLA basketball team embarrassed the entire Bruin Nation by getting demolished and destroyed on national TV. There are still about 4 minutes left in this game but it is nothing more than a formality. The damage has been done.
The only person responsible for tonight's humiliation is Howland who put together a clinic in terms of how to mismanage a game and destroy his team's confidence. Heading into this game the key for the Bruins were pretty much the same: patience on offense and play with 40 minutes of focus and intensity on defense. Well Howland let his favorite player Nikola Dragovic set the tone right from the get go with an impatient two point shot to start the first offensive set. From there on the Huskies took a 14-4 lead and never really looked back.
Bruins grabbed a silver of momentum Howland put in Brendan Lane and Bobo Morgan 10 minutes into the first half. When Lane sank a 3 point shot to close the gap within 16-22, Howland immediately rewarded him by putting him on the bench and bringing back Ragovic. From there on the Huskies blasted off to a 14-0 run and the team just quit on Ben Howland. Again the only way to describe it was, a Howland clinic on how to mismanage a game and ruin a team's confidence. Just plain disgusting.
While Rago gets the topline for being the obvious culprit and the poster boy for Howland's mismanagement, every member of this team was flat out pathetic. After the Huskies went on that 14-0 run, the team pretty much gave up trying. They were repeatedly called out by Jay Bilas and Bobby Knight for not trying on defense or showing any kind of effort. Jay Bilas flatly called out Ragovic for just not showing any kind of effort to muck it up inside. I
The Bruin guards were pitiful as they folded under the Huskies ball pressure. While Malcolm Lee and Jerime Anderson deserve a lot of heat, it ultimately goes back to the head coach. I am sure we can point to all kinds of ghastly statistics from the box score. However, remember Ben Howland is the one who has anointed Ragovic as one of the "leaders" of this team, and yet he repeatedly has allowed this guy to rack up minutes without showing any kind of effort or respect for the four letters in front of his jersey.
We are trying very hard to give Ben Howland the benefit of the doubt for his incredible Final-4 runs and Pac-10 championships. Again because of the political capital Howland built up all those years, his job is not going to be in any kind of immediate danger. However, at the same time he needs to be mindful these are the kind of performances that were ultimately Steve Lavin's undoing at UCLA. This is not the first time the team has flat out quit on Howland this season. It has happened multiple times this year and also happened number of times last season (including meltdowns against Arizona, Southern Cal, and Villanova).
If Ben Howland wants to have any sort of momentum and install confidence in his young team heading into this off-season, the reasonable direction for him would be to go with his young and more talented players on the bench. He should be playing kids like Lane, Morgan and Moser lot more along with a mix of Michael Roll and rest of the underclassmen in his starting rotation. He has no excuse at this point not to bench Ragovic for rest of the season and limit him to less than 20 minutes per game. If Howland continues to waste the minutes next year's guys can be getting on Ragovic, he will continue to waste away the trust and respect he has built up all these years.
While Howland's utter mismanagement humiliated the four letters on national TV, he lost lot more than a game tonight. He lost respect of lot more UCLA alums and students who love this basketball program. We will see what Howland does to get it back.
With that I will let you take the post game thread.
GO BRUINS.
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Baseball goes up 8-2
Amaral with a nice line drive single the other way drives one in.
For everything UCLA baseball, visit my UCLA baseball twitter.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Feb 20, 2010 7:59 PM PST reply actions
can we keep this thread focused on hoops?
Thanks.
by Nestor on Feb 20, 2010 8:01 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Nothing really left to say.
GO BRUINS!!!
by moutekicksboute on Feb 20, 2010 8:02 PM PST up reply actions
Then ... let's not
Just want to keep this thread focused on hoops.
by Nestor on Feb 20, 2010 8:04 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm going to go take a shower
I feel like I have had dung flung all over me watching this shit
Louisville, KY for UCLA class of '87
“The one good thing about this game..? It’s going to end.”
-Bobby Knight
Quit making the theiving Wall Street Fat-Cat Bankers even richer.
moveyourmoney.info
I would say that you don' t have to watch,
But I know you do. Just like me. Why do we torture ourselves this way? We love our Bruins, good or bad.
+/- stat
I’d be nice if college basketball had that +/- stat that the NBA keeps for each player on yahoo sports. I’d love to see the +/- on Drago.
I've got it for part of this season
The crazy thing is that Drago’s +/- hasn’t been nearly as bad as I would have expected, though I don’t have if for the non-conf stretch (where Drago was epically bad), or the recent few games in which he is sucking to a greater extent.
formerly bruinhoo
he plays too many minutes for them to be relevent
when you are in for 80% of the game on average, plus minus doesn’t really say anything
by silverlakebruin on Feb 21, 2010 12:13 AM PST up reply actions
He did
In explaining what it was like to be a black MLB player in the 50’s.
Let’s keep this thread on basketball though as per N’s wishes.
For everything UCLA baseball, visit my UCLA baseball twitter.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Feb 20, 2010 8:10 PM PST up reply actions
If there are few innings to go in the baseball game
You should really throw up a quick short fanpost or fanshot, and throw a link in here.
It's alright
It’s the 6th inning now, but not such a competitive game anymore. I was just providing updates, but if anyone wants them they can tune in or check my twitter.
For everything UCLA baseball, visit my UCLA baseball twitter.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Feb 20, 2010 8:13 PM PST up reply actions
There is losing and there is losing
I don’t believe in “moral victory” losses but humiliating losses this late in the year are unacceptable. I knew we were going to lose this game, just like i thought we would beat WSU, but this was terrible.
Dragovic was irrelevant
The Bruins were crushed because they lack the ability to penetrate off the dribble. The point guard gets pressured, and the entire defense overplays. Even when the pass is made 20 feet from the basket, the player receiving the pass can’t break down his man off the dribble, who is in that player’s face. The Bruins ended up taking horrible shots, with tight defense because no one can break anyone down. On top of that, Washington shot the ball very well from the outside, punishing our slow defense. Its not just Dragovic, its the entire team that is too slow. You can’t win in Division I without a point guard. We don’t have one. When we get pressured, a la USC or Washington, we get crushed. Drago was a non factor. Replacing him with Lane all game would not have made a bit of difference. The result would have been the same.
Lane for ND
would have probably changed the score but not the result.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:10 PM PST up reply actions
CBH preparation vs in-game management
Can’t argue with the assessment above. Looked like Lane deserved additional minutes ahead of ND, and that Bobo may have deserved a little more time in place of RN (who seemed to give up on defense early).
Have to say that in addition to the surprising in-game decisions the lack of preparation for this game was scary. We didn’t have any idea how to attack them or any idea how to defend them. Mismatches all over the place, somehow always against us.
MR tried hard to step up on offense when it became clear the point guards weren’t getting it done, but was torched defensively and had a bad shooting night. ML’s best contributions were when he wasn’t playing point, but was pretty bad all night. JA had some good moments in garbage time. TH wasn’t terrible but was below his usual standards.
Reeves Nelson
I am having this feeling that Nelson is destined to be another Ragovic. Not as bad but close. The kid plays really hard but he also quits a lot on D and just plays really dumb. Next year at 4 it is going to be interesting how Howland divies up the mins b/w him and Lane at 4.
post up players?
is it not in our team’s plan to have post up players? we don’t have any post up presence and I still don’t see any on the bench or in recruits? what’s the deal?
Reeves has been main post presence
He’s begun to get doubled and has shown trouble with that. Bobo is just now starting to get minutes.
GO BRUINS!!!
by moutekicksboute on Feb 20, 2010 8:15 PM PST up reply actions
RN just doesn't seem to have it...hope Bobo develops
RN is scrappy but he doesn’t have that turn around, fade away, baby hook type post skill…i know it’s college, but developing one post up arsenal is not a bad idea.
I think RN has good one-on-one moves
and also can catch on the move and finish.
If we can run sets that isolate him, he is a totally serviceable post presence. If we allow him to get double teamed, he is going to struggle.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:20 PM PST up reply actions
I have to disagree
He is crafty around the basket and gets some good shots off, but he does that out of necessity to get shots off over longer and more athletic players. Luckily the pac 10 has no real centers this year, but if teams ever get any size, RN is going to have a very difficult time ever scoring.
With JMM, Smith, and AS on the roster next year, I don’t want a 6’6 guy playing center and dominating the low block.
I agree with you
I also don’t want him playing center. But he can be a post presence as a PF going against other PFs and using his crafty moves…
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:29 PM PST up reply actions
As hard as RN plays on Offense
He seemed not to play on defense. It was obvious he gave up on D tonight. It is also obvious he has been bad on D in the past. Some excuses for being an undersized 5 but not for effort.
It is a big concern going forward and it is scary that it is not one of the biggest.
right
also, his emotions are a plus and a minus.
As I said on a previous thread, I’m curious how we will use him if he is the 4. He seems to want a lot of shots close in, but if we have a genuine big center wanting shots as well… I hope we can get some chemistry with the bigs making space for each other. Looks like Lane has the potential to stretch the court a lot more…
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:15 PM PST up reply actions
RN
RN has great hands. He has horizontal size(he’s solid), strength and relative quickness. As Bobby Knight said once after he scored and was fouled, “it takes a strong kid to make that shot.” He has an upside.
However, CBH has to have him make that same effort on defense. Myself and others have noted that CBH often is yelling at him to get back. He needs to pay a price for it, now when it doesn’t matter.
If he is going to be a “ben ball warrior”" he needs to play D.
I don't disagree with that
he’s clearly a player. I just don’t know how we will use him given CBH’s typical guard/shooter oriented offense – not saying we can’t do it, just that we haven’t used a 4 like him under CBH.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:26 PM PST up reply actions
what can anyone say?
everyone takes the blame for this one. it was ugly. ball handling to shooting to rotation to energy to coaching…
i get what you’re saying N about CBH and Rago. It is mind boggling. then the rest of the team…damn.
the privilege these players got, the scholarship and everything came too easy for them…they have no appreciation. how can the coaching staff have wrongly evaluated this crop of “talent” or lack there of? I mean, damn! ML can’t even dribble around the perimeter without shaking in his shoes whenever someone’s pressures just a bit with a little hand motion. Our centers can’t post up for shi*. Our team can’t figure out any defensive or offensive scheme. The athleticism is so poor…DAMN! Really? The scouts thought this was America’s best group of kids to play for UCLA?
Mismanagement is a joke
Like shifting deckchairs on the Titanic. With slow players and no point guard, we get killed when the opponent pressures us and shoots well.
At tip off?
For everything UCLA baseball, visit my UCLA baseball twitter.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Feb 20, 2010 8:18 PM PST up reply actions
I didn't get to sit down for the game until
it was already 30 – 57, early in the second half. I would say I am in shock if not for the fact that this season has left me numb. I couldn’t even feel it when my jaw hit the ground.
The best thing you can do for your children is to love their mother. John Wooden
Sorry if you can't follow my point.
You are so focused on Drago, you miss the big problem. The team is too slow and there is no one who can play point guard. Criticizing substitution is a joke. They all are too slow. BL played a lot and fairly well.
Uh no you have missed the point the entire freaking season
I didn’t say benching Ragovic would have won us the game. I have made the point all along by allowing Rago to play mins without any accountability, Howland has set a bad tone the entire season that has infected the whole team. Why should the underclassmen play with intensity and focus when the senior “leader” gets to prance around with no accountability. You have been defending Howland’s decision to play Rago like an idiot all season long.
You know if we make the NCAA tourney there is good news
We will likely win Thursday, and embarrass ourselves on the weekend
Louisville, KY for UCLA class of '87
Changes must be made
To me the season was lost after the second SC loss. I wasn’t too impressed by WSU game because I thought it was more of a less talented WSU losing than us winning. Well, today we had the same thing happen to us.
After seeing JMM play the last two games, I really have to question CBH on his not playing JMM more this season (yes I know he was hurt for a few weeks). I am so sick of seeing RN get killed inside trying to play center at 6’6 (I’ve stood next to him, he is barely 6’6, not even close to 6’8). Its no surprise that the zone looks so much better with JMM in then when RN is in. Sure RN should give better effort, but he cant grow and become more athletic. He is a power forward, not a center.
Since this season is a total waste now, if CBH doesn’t move JMM to center and RN to power forward and ND to the bench, he not only is wasting what is left of this season, but he is hurting his team’s development for next season.
Nelson is the same Rago
I have a sick feeling we are going to have the same issue next year about a player getting his mins without putting effort on D.
Wrong example
It worries me that he is more the next Gordon. Likes to try and block shots, plays no position defense, is a black hole on offense, and mistakes emotions for leadership.
That is an interesing thought
may be some truth to it. CBH and RN seem to disagree a lot.
I saw him Gordon-esque like
He obviously has a lot of passion and emotion for the game, and is willing to muscle his way through, but is making a lot of the same mistakes as well, and it appears to often let his emotions get the better of him
I love his fire, but when you play with fire, you get burned…
The one difference that stands out to me
Is that Nelson doesn’t seem to have Gordon’s arrogance. Gordon really seemed to think he was best suited to a high flying, offense first system. He thought he was athletic and skilled. I think one of the biggest problems with him was that his opinion of his own abilities didn’t quite match reality.
by SuperBruinMan on Feb 20, 2010 8:41 PM PST up reply actions
If you think that way, why come to CBH's UCLA?
I remember even JF said he came to UCLA because CBH talked to him about defense.
It is not like CBH is promise kids to lead the nation in offense. He is a person who has always preached defense first. Why play for CBH if you feel that way?
meh
his throwing the guards under the bus for not getting him the ball more was a bit Gordon-esque.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:49 PM PST up reply actions
and as someone wrote about him not helping a teammate up off the floor
which happened to be ML, I hope RN understands that needs to keep his emotions in check
Also questioned unnamed teammates hearts
If things blow up next year a la Gordon, we cant say that there weren’t warning signs.
yeah his heart comment
seemed almost verbatim..
Looks like he is doing it again
This is rich:
#UCLA Reeves Nelson ain’t happy "People were watching and they can decide for themselves if we gave up. You know how I have to answer that."
LMFAO.
I think the big difference between RN and ND is RN fights for the ball
He’s willing to get hurt for the game. So he has some hope of being coached to be more defensively minded, since he’s willing to put himself forward. What’s concerning is he gets tired easily and makes stupid mistakes, but he’s a true freshman.
Yeah
He does deserve some benefit of the doubt because he is a frosh. What I am saying though he should also get treated the same way when he isn’t playing D, just like Lane, Moser and Bobo. Howland needs to be consistent.
Yeah, I would agree that he needs to be more consistant
However, I think he’s giving RN more credit for willing to dive for the ball, and play hard. ND would never dive for the wall, or risk his face from being scratched.
I still can't believe
People were supporting Howland earlier this year for wasting mins on Ragovic. As I said at this point anyone defending that decision will be banned for being morons.
I would hope this wasn't what you meant, N

"I never watched baseball on TV. It's slow and boring. I'm not a fan. Never was." - Jeff Kent
on that note I have smiled
good night people. Tomorrow we will resume life as we know it
Louisville, KY for UCLA class of '87
rofl
no, because there is no such thing as the Stanford Cardinals
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:27 PM PST up reply actions
I guess that makes me a moron
I’ll explain myself though.
Before the season even started, I pointed out that this was going to be a long year with ups and down. However, I thought this team had the components to gel midway through the year and become a tournament team and make a run at the pac 10. A successful year from ND was a big component of that projection (as was ML and JA not being pathetic). Unfortunately, ND has underperformed and continues to frustrate with some terrible shots. But I still believed midway through that this season could be salvaged until the SC game.
Obviously now that is not the case. RN should be the starting 4 with JMM at 5. BL should get minutes backing them both up and ND can get 15-20 backing up RN and TH.
What Dragovic did this year wasn't an aberration
That’s how he has played his entire career at UCLA. It has been incredibly frustrating to see Howland and number of smart observers like you poncho (and you know your stuff) to keep waiting for that unicorn (Rago playing smart, patient on a consistent basis on both ends of the court within his ability). Rago has never cared about trying hard and he just got flat out called out for not trying by one of the best coaches ever in this game tonight.
He is who he is
He really is a frustrating player. He has shown that he can be pretty good on the post, yet doesn’t go down there often. I have to think that some of his infatuation with the 3 is by CBH’s design. I’m pretty confident that at the start of the year CBH realized he had no go to player on this team and gave MR and ND the ultimate green light to shoot whenever they wanted to. Its just a shame that they have abused this privilege (MR takes some really bad jumpers, especially tonight, he just makes more of them than ND).
I don’t know if it is that ND doesn’t care so much as he just “is who he is.” He is an average player who is a streaky shooter. Thats who he was when he came here, thats who he is when he will leave here. Just a shame that he couldn’t develop more of his game in 4 years, but some players (sadly the entire class) just don’t develop and are what they are, no matter how bad we wish they were something different.
Roll is more than a jump shooter
He actually makes an effort to play a complete game. He is athletically limited but he knows Howland’s scheme and knows what his coach wants on D. He has had some careless mistakes and he has taken some hurried shot but he is not an abomination like Ragovic.
Ragovic shouldn’t be in a UCLA uniform and should have been encouraged to pursue another option instead of kids like Stanback and Wright.
MR is our most complete offensive player
along with TH, who is dramatically more athletic. MR does shoot a lot, but also makes smart passes, even drives from time to time, runs the fast break as well as any of our PGs, etc.
MR is limited athletically and relies on positioning to be a serviceable defender. He got beaten a lot today in athletic mismatches.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:45 PM PST up reply actions
Fair point on MR
MR has improved from a strictly jumpshooter and entry pass player to a little bit more complete game. He too has been illserved by spending a lot of his time in a position (sf) that he just isn’t capable of playing. It blows my mind that for the first time under CBH, we have lanky athletic players and ended up playing people out of position to totally squander the height/athleticism advantage we could have enjoyed over the pac 10 this year.
if Lane was practicing hard and was totally game ready
earlier in the season, then CBH made a huge mistake not playing him. Most of my argument about keeping ND on the court is his ability to space the floor (particularly if the alternative was playing JK at the 4). Regardless of whether or not it is warranted, our opponents continue to respect ND’s threat, which helps out the other guys.
If BL can stretch the court in the same way and consistently hit shots, then he could play the same role and allow competition at the position based on form, etc.
There are two things I would say if I were trying to defend CBH here.
1) we had so many other issues to address early in the season that replacing our one returning starter was the least of the issues (when compared with trying to get point guard play, trying to teach man defense and having to abandon it, trying to find replacement center minutes)
2) we are seeing Lane at the end of a season of practices, and he is doing a good job; earlier in the season in scattered minutes he didn’t look so good. It is possible – though there is no definitive proof for us either way – that he has been steadily improving over the course of the season, didn’t warrant minutes earlier and does warrant them now. Obviously the facts can also be interpreted in much less charitable ways. I am not sure there is any way of ‘proving’ it one way or the other.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:43 PM PST up reply actions
We are only seeing Lane out of necessity
Because of Keefe’s injury. If not for Keefe’s injury we wouldn’t be seeing Lane and Bobo. Lane held his own few games when he was put in. I have said it countless times now how he held his own against Stanford and Oregon State. Yet he never got more minutes. The arguments against Lane getting mins in favor of Howland has been complete fucking bullshit this year and people have been doing it by giving deference to what Howland has seen in practices.
Clearly tonight demonstrated that Howland doesn’t deserve that trust any more.
sure
we clearly have different assessments of what he did in those minutes. And it is possible to analyze the minute distribution between Bobo, BL, ND and MM (and even the other bench players) since Keefe went down in more than one way; and the minute distribution over the season between the four freshmen in more than one way.
I understand the case you are making. Not holding your truths to be self-evident doesn’t make me objectively stupid, or make what I and other have said in the past to be ‘complete fucking bullshit’. It may have been incorrect.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:12 PM PST up reply actions
How do we know that he wasn't practicing hard?
And for that matter, to quote… “practice… we’re talking about practice”
Even if ND practices harder than everyone else, that should be no excuse for giving him playtime (or anyone else for that matter) if they’re playing lackadaisically on the court.
Howland’s substitution patterns this past year feel like they’re more for seniority
Yep
Rago is essentially a sh!tty version of Josh Shipp. Shipp made some great shots over his career and a great freshman season before his injuries. However, he took lots of plays off on D during his last two years and never paid the price by getting benched.
he is a shitty version of Shipp
without 2 hip surgeries to blame his inconsistent performance on
by silverlakebruin on Feb 21, 2010 12:17 AM PST up reply actions
but doesn't he have more composure?
he just seem a little safer with the ball
we were getting burned at the top of the zone
their guards were penetrating with ease, unless we hung off… in which case they shot over us. I don’t think that a small slow guy was going to help with that while we were still trying to win the game. And certainly not paired with MR.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:31 PM PST up reply actions
ML has a bigger POTENTIAL
upside. Not sure on JA, tend toward MAH over JA as backup.
As I said
I am going to know by the end of next season. I just want to see whether he can improve next year being fully healthy and a good off-season workout (after being humbled). I am not pimping him as a player just saying not quitting on him yet.
How is his health
Is JA still hurting? I will admit that could make a difference.
However, I am also angry that with all his injuries he missed sessions with the trainer.
did he really miss sessions?
with people saying he had been benched earlier in the season for academic reasons before hand too, i’m getting this feeling that hes trying hard to be the next clown..
IIRC
benched for showing up late to a rehab session
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:46 PM PST up reply actions
I stand corrected
Point is same though. I also think you don’t get benched for doing it once. I think you get benched for not taking it seriously.
I wish we could find someone from BN
to take one from the team and distract Rago from some session this week. Comeon if there is any female student reading this thread, perhaps you can distract him a little by showing up at a practice this week? (joking … sort of!).
Yep
He has been nagged by injuries all season. He is not complaining about it but he has been playing hurt without complaining about it.
Okay, didn't know JA was still hurting
obviously that could explain a lot.
But CBH cannot say next year he thought JA was going to be the next JF, DC, even JH. (if he is, great.) CBH has to have a contingency plan that entails JA not playing a substantive role.
also struggles to finish sometimes
and often struggles to knock down the freebies (though went 7-9 tonight)
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:26 PM PST up reply actions
Young Guys
It is time, after a loss like this to start playing the young guys and give them experience. I know that has been discussed already, but today’s game was horrible.
Just did the efficiency numbers for this game...look who's on top
STARTERS Eff
Brendan Lane, F 15
Reeves Nelson, F 12
Nikola Dragovic, F 9
Jerime Anderson, G 9
Tyler Honeycutt, F 6
J’mison Morgan, C 5
Michael Roll, G 2
Malcolm Lee, G 1
Mustafa Abdul-Hamid, G 0
Mike Moser, F -3
there you go
Ryan’s big lineup should play…
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 8:47 PM PST up reply actions
Well with the season long over
We absolutely need to start playing a new rotation. RN has the passion and energy in the game, but as posted above, he absolutely shouldn’t be playing the 5. We’ve seen his struggles at that position on both sides of the ball.
After these last two games, BL and JMM should absolutely get the majority of the minutes that Rago has played, and Keefe’s as well of course. We saw what BL did tonight and we know he’s got potential at the 4.
And not to pile on Reeves as we’ve done above, but he needs to be moved from the 5. It’s not just on D, but on O, when he gets the ball down low, his first thought is to go for the basket and not to pass it out or find others.
Of course, he’s a freshman, so he’s got a lot to learn from the game. Personally, I’m amazed at how much Bobo has come along even from the beginning of the year and he should get a lot more consistent time at the 5. His pass out of the double to the screener (TH) for a layup was a beauty. Of course, he got pulled shortly after..
A call to all Bruins
During the offseason Alumni Association dinners or conferences where they’ll have the head coaches as the keynote speakers, I want everyone to ask why his coaching was terrible this entire season and what he is gonna do to shore it up on and off the court. Also, ask him if he knew that Nikola Dragovic was Serbian for “No Basketball Skills.”
In person is better
I want to see him eye to eye when he gives his answer.
How I can agree with Nestor, 75 and BruinPoncho
ND won us some games this year. This year is worse without ND. Also Nestor has not said don’t play ND.
But CBH needed to mange ND better. A cold ND is no good unless we are playing UW in the first game and they key their defense on stopping him (tonight they keyed on pressing our guards). So yes you need(ed) to play ND BUT
1. You need to give him the hook when he is cold.
2. You need to tell him to go low more. He is a decent post up player and is also a good driver when matched against a traditional 4. If he won’t do this, you need to yank him.
3. He will never be a good defender, either will MR. But MR tries as hard as he can. ND needs to try more. In other words, it is okay to play zone to cover the deficiencies of your talent but that talent has to do its best.
4. At this point, as Bruinponcho says, it is time to give up on ND.
Not managing ND is telling people (Nestor is arguing RN) that they can play for UCLA without playing D or being held accountable. That is a big worry.
However, I agree 75 that even if he did all this, we would not be a great/good team. PG is the most important position in college basketball and our best point guard is an out of control 2 guard. But I always considered the winning season more important.
But now I agree with Nestor I think we would better shape for the future if we held ND (and maybe RN) more accountable.
I am not as sure about all this but thought I would throw it out there.
by DCBruins on Feb 20, 2010 9:06 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I knew you would say that
ASU is the most obvious, our second biggest win of the year, for one.
Not really
He got us off to a good start and then his lollygagging on defense allowed ASU to make a run and made it close in the second half. So I can’t really give him too much credit for that win. What other game?
I disagree
His offense changed that game. Playing ND tight opened up the offense for others. We don’t win that game without ND’s first half. And no one else on our team has had a game like he had in the first half.
We don't know
How our offense would have been if Rago didn’t keep getting 32+ mins a game. How many other games have Rago won us? Do you want me to list all the games in which he was a nonfactor? That would be 90 percent of this season.
In PAC 10
He averages 16 points in wins and 11 in losses. He shots 46% from 3 in wins and 23% in losses.
You can’t easily match up to a 46% shooting from a big player like Drago and it forces teams to alter there game when he is hitting. The first UW game was the extreme example when UW keyed on ND. It let us have a chance to win. No one else on our team does that.
Thus I think we needed ND but you are right Nestor, not that many minutes a game, a much quicker hook, and not now.
For every 16 points he score
He usually gives up 22+ points a game. So he is still a nonfactor. What we can’t quantify is the bad example he keeps setting by not playing defense and making any kind of honest effort game after game after game. It has a demoralizing effect on rest of the team and it ruins team chemistry.
He has been nothing short of cancer on basketball court and it effected the entire team and program. The fault is on Howland for not addressing it at the get go.
For all the game prep tonight, he put up a stupid, ugly, hurried shot to start the game completely ignoring the plan to be patient. If Howland wanted to stick to his principles, he should have benched him on the spot but he didn’t. He did the gutless thing by keeping Rago in the game and the entire team followed his gutless example. Just pathetic and I don’t want to see any more defending of the indefensible. It (as in defending the decision to stick with Ragovic this year) is as stupid and blind as people who were defending Karl Dorrell.
he should have been yanked
immediately after that first shot. That was one of his worst offensive plays of the season. I typically don’t subscribe to the ‘setting the tone’ comments, but that really showed a lack of purpose from the get-go.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:35 PM PST up reply actions
again
the apparent lack of effective gameplan to start the game was more worrying to me than any of the in-game management.
Maybe we just have much, much worse players than them, but we looked completely clueless on both ends right from the start. If UW had started more composed it would have been a beatdown even earlier in the game.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:38 PM PST up reply actions
We do have worse players than them
and they had a game plan, with Knight and Bias talked about, pressing the guards. We did not, you’re right. This was not a game we should have won but it is one we should not have lost this bad.
Unreal
I was getting pumped for the game, and standing up at tip off. Then rago takes that shot and I sit down on my couch, put my hands on my hand and said, “are u serious?” I could not believe it.
I then look up to the tv and CBH did not take him out. I gave up hope on our coach at that exact moment.
by UclaCO2007 on Feb 20, 2010 10:23 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Oops
Meant “put my hands on my head”.
Seriously, CBH your team will continue to quit on you until YOU start to implement and teach fair and equal discipline/accountability.
by UclaCO2007 on Feb 20, 2010 10:28 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Is there any game this year that any player has won
The games that we did manage to win were because 90% of the team on that day had good to great games. This team isn’t talented enough to not win as a team. I really cant point to any game where one person single handidly willed the team to victory.
Then why did we keep starting Rago
Game after game and kept wasting 32 mins on him at the expense of developing our youngsters?
Your point doesn't make sense N
I said that no one player could win a game by himself this year. I don’t think BL or MM or AS could win a game by themselves either. Like I said above, this season was still redeemable up until the SC game. When that went bad, I fully agree that BL and JMM should be getting more minutes.
Not sure what's so difficult to understand
Rago was never crucial to our success this season. So there was no point in wasting those mins on him throughout the season even before the SC game.
Adding
Yes the arguments that Howland was justified in giving Ragovic 32+ mins through 24 games of this season was idiotic and at this point we are not going to litigate that issue given the record speaks for itself. Kind of like after a while it was pointless to argue whether Dorrell was getting the job done. I despise this loser (Rago) worse than I disliked Dorrell.
Bottom Line
If CBH does not finish 500 this year and tolerated this crap from ND, then he blew it.
If he gets to 500 or better than it was not good but CBH accomplished his stated goal for the season.
I blame CBH not ND
It just depends on what you wanted out of this season. If you thought that it could still be successful like CBH and I did, you put the team out there that you think gives you the best chance to win that particular game. If you want to spend the entire season preparing for the next year without regards to wins/losses, then ND/MR/JK/MAH shouldn’t have gotten any minutes all season with the freshman and sophomores thrown to the wolves.
I am definitely not telling you what to do/think here, but personally I never will call a student athlete disparaging names. I will critique their games and call them out for bad performances, but at the end of the day they are 18-21 year old kids playing for free/scholarship. Coaches on the other hand are highly highly paid adults and deserve all the criticism and names. CBH has totally mishandled this season. I don’t fault ND for not becoming an NBA level player, I blame CBH for putting ND in a position where those unrealistic expectations were forced on him. Its the coaches job to manage the team and he should be the target of our criticism.
I doubt Dragovic actually gives a rat behind about UCLA ...
He never played like he cared or acted off the court like he cared. I doubt he is going to care once he is done getting his 30+ mins rest of this season. I never considered him as a “student” or an “athlete” for UCLA.
Well he did stay for four years and I am pretty sure is going to graduate, so thats better than some mercenaries that have passed through Pauley over the last couple of years. Just because he isn’t a great basketball player doesn’t make him a terrible person.
And if you are right and he really doesn’t care, then that supports my point even more that CBH is to blame for putting him on the floor. From a practical standpoint, as you point out, ND and all his shortcomings will be gone in a few months. CBH and all his shortcomings will still be around.
Yes, the blame ultimately falls on Ben Howland
for recruiting him and persuading him to stay (when he was thinking about bailing out two years ago), while apparently players like Stanback were encouraged to transfer out of the program.
fwiw
not clear to me that just sending the frosh/sophs out to take their lumps prepares them that well. For any individual player, it is easier to learn the system if the other guys you are playing with already understand the system. And if we are worried about setting the tone and breaking the cycle of entitlement, then handing minutes to freshmen simply because they are supposed to be good is no way of doing it.
Obviously if we were just planning for next season, we could have given younger players a lot more minutes. Just wouldn’t advocate removing all minutes from the only guys who have played in successful teams in the system.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:53 PM PST up reply actions
No one was advocating "removing all minutes" for Rago
The argument we have made all season long that his mins should have been in the 15-22 min range, while the balance should have gone to the underclassmen. That’s a BS strawman argument you have been raising. And you need to stop that nonsense bringing up same repetitive crap.
Give it a freaking rest. Stop defending that decision to give Rago mins. I will not give you another warning. Enough. Thank you.
This year would be worse without Rago? Really.
Without him those 30+ minutes would go to someone that we can develope for the future. With Rags we are 12-14. What does it matter if we are 9-17 or 12-14. Developing freshman that can be meaningful to us next year would be huge. If those players were absorbing those 30+ minutes that Rags was sucking up, how good would they be now? If he wasn’t in there jacking up low percentage shots, what would have happened on those possessions? It is hard to believe that any player would be as much of defensive liability and overall lazy a$$ player as Rago. I would take my chances with just about any other forward on this team. At least there would be effort.
by 84 on Feb 20, 2010 9:16 PM PST up reply actions
That is a garbage argument
About this year being worse without Rago. Rago couldn’t be any worse than he already is as a basketball player. He is the worst starter in last 30 years. Perhaps Ryan Walcott was worse as was Michael Fey. Unlike Rago, their mins were cut drastically.
Wow - Jon Gold is living in the 90s
Jon Gold is having a hard time from understanding how Howland mismanaged this game. Check out this twitter exchange as he is trying to dismiss all of us for being “fans” and not good enough to be a "reporter like him.
is there an easy way to see both sides of the conversation on twitter?
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:19 PM PST up reply actions
He essentially admitted
He is more worried about his access and not p!ssing off Howland than being intellectually honest in his reporting/analysis of Bruins.
But at least
he can admit it—unlike the “virgin white” LA times shitty beat reporters
just read both sides
how much do you blame him and how much his bosses? It seems that you both have a point – he wants to continue to hold his job, and you think that the access/beat reporter job is symptomatic of the problems of traditional media.
This access issue seems like a real one, particularly now that media outlets like the Daily News, LA TImes etc are less useful to the likes of UCLA – with all the new-media internet, facebook, twitter stuff, sports teams and individuals can get their message out without having to bargain with media types. The balance of power has shifted in favor of teams being able to threaten people with lack of access. Not sure if there is a solution to this – it is a major issue with the media all over the place, particularly in politics I think.
But I thought the lamest copout from Gold was saying that he asks the questions but doesn’t always get usable quotes. That’s on him if he can’t ask the right questions / follow-ups to get insightful material.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 10:23 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed
I don’t really blame Gold for the lack of analysis. That’s not his job and like everyone else in the work force, you’ve got to do what your bosses tell you to do. He’s doing what he’s told to do. The blame belongs with those higher up, who as N pointed out, are largely responsible for the failings of the traditional media.
His not pushing harder with his questions is all on him though, as you said british.
For everything UCLA baseball, visit my UCLA baseball twitter.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Feb 20, 2010 10:28 PM PST up reply actions
Best I can figure is to open 2 browser windows, one w/Gold's twitter, and the other w/BN twitter
formerly bruinhoo
k thanks
I don’t use it so wasn’t sure if there was something I was missing.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 10:09 PM PST up reply actions
Earlier comment about CBH designing Rago as a 3 point specialist may be true
The UCLA teams in years past had alot of difficulty with zone defenses. Maybe CBH has it in his head that he needs two zone breakers in the lineup. Unfortunately for him, Rago isn’t a zone breaker except for 1 game a year. And that one game where he does go off just makes it worse, as it creates a false sense that he is capable of this game in game out. I was happy to hear Bilas and Knight call him out for not playing the game he is suited for. I have said it all year, Rags is not a 3 point specialist and the frustration with his game should not be a surprise to anyone with half a brain. Why CBH didn’t teach/force him to develope a low post turn around game is beyond me. His only positives are that he is a good shooter inside the arc and at the free throw line. Not enough to make up for his liabilities. N is right on in that CBH needs to show us that he can see Rags lack of overall basketball abilities. Continuing to play him significant minutes when the game is still in question is not acceptable. I have never despised a UCLA basketball player as much as I do Rago. There is nothing about him that even remotely represents our great university, whether it be trouble with the law or basketball.
Just got here
just tried to start up the game on the DVR, but it somehow screwed up recording the game. After reading through this thread, I guess it just has standards about minimum quality for recording. Just like LongtimeBru above, I watch because I’m a Bruin and I have to – but I’m glad I didn’t have to watch this.
This from Bruin Basketball Report
Forward Nikola Dragovic, in particular, did not react effectively to the opponent’s ball movement and the Huskies capitalized on his defensive side of the court numerous times.
as Bob Knight was commenting
they would take the ball one way, then reverse it back to ND’s side, who would be left with two offensive players to deal with due to a lack of rotation. “And two of them have an open shot!”. If ND had moved more effectively towards one or other player, I guess only one of them would have been able to take an open shot.
This is one game where we had glaring defensive holes in every part of the zone. To pick on ND for that seems churlish.
Yeah, I know he sucks. I dislike him as a player and also, from what we have seen, from him off the court, as a person.
by britishbruin on Feb 20, 2010 9:59 PM PST up reply actions
If he doesn't commit to a player
help is meaningless. He needs to commit to the proper player, and then help should come. If it doesn’t, that can be corrected. If he doesn’t commit, no single player can guard 2 open men.
by silverlakebruin on Feb 21, 2010 12:20 AM PST up reply actions
I am not going to comment
if for no other reasons than I have done it so repeatedly that it becomes embarrassing and too time consuming for me to do it. There is an obvious disconnect within this team between themselves, as well as between their coach and themselves, that it is affecting everything that they do. They don’t do anything well. The problems are too numerous to list……although we all try. I am done. That is why CBH gets paid good money, to figure these problems out and correct them. If he wants to keep making the same mistakes game in and game out, then so be it. If he wants to keep relying on guys who don’t care about the game, then so be it. If he wants to limit the minutes of the guys he’ll need to bust their butts for him next year, then so be it. I guess if I want to go see some good basketball, I’ll have to head off to watch CIF girls basketball playoff games…………like I did tonight…….so be it. At least I saw some players who cared.
Actually you should watch our women's basketball team
they care.
by silverlakebruin on Feb 21, 2010 12:21 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I am the lucky one who had a prior commitment and didn't see one second of this debacle.
I did hear it for about a minute on the radio in my car, but had to turn it off when Chris Roberts said one of our inept guards lost the ball leading to an easy basket, then we threw up a brick and they hit a three to go from 8 up to 13 or 14 up. I can’t remember.
I started feeling angry, frustrated and stupid for even turning it on. So I turned it off and felt fine the rest of the night. Just reading these comments from my fellow faithful Bruins, however, makes me sick. I can only imagine how terrible it was to see this crap unfold live an entire game. Yeeeecccccchhhh!
I can forgive a team without real talent for losing. What I can’t see is letting anyone who does not bust his ass with those 4 letters on his chest getting any playing time, period. That’s why I really don’t watch anymore. This team has become the most pathetic UCLA basketball team in history because players who really make no effort are allowed to stay on the floor.
That’s the one part of CBH’s coaching that I just don’t get. Find five guys who care and just play them, really.
Rant over. Sorry, fellow Bruins.
You’re all braver than me for watching.
I'm on the East Coast
So I went to bed before this thread went this far.
If I’m Bobo, I’m calling LSU this morning to ask if they’ll take me back. Couldn’t be worse. At least he’d be getting some playing time.
The low point of the commentary to me, as a geezer, came when Roberts pointed out that the worst UCLA loss in Seattle previously was in 1975, Coach Wooden’s last regular-season game, and the Bruins went on to win the championship. Bilas then listed some of the players on that team, but omitted David Meyers. And Knight said, “The reason UCLA won in 1975 was that Scott May broke his leg.” At that point, I turned the damn thing off.
I really thought that after the WSU game we’d see Bobo and Lane starting and getting a lot of minutes. Maybe Lee, Roll, Honeycutt, Lane, Bobo, and Nelson first off the bench. I never dreamed Dreckovic, after all those horrible games, would not only start but throw up a totally embarrassing brick—and then not get yanked!
Oh, well. I guess I’ll stick to the Olympics next week and not bother to burn the midnight cable just to watch more of these fiascos.
Knight had a good team at Indiana that year and an even better one the next year
but the conceited attitude that ultimately led to the door at Indiana showed up yesterday especially during that comment. His personality disorder leads him to believe that he is the all superior coach. Any loss of his couldn’t possibly be his fault, it would have to be a players fault. The other team would never outplay him and certainly no other coach would ever outcoach him. Coach never has a good thing to say about Knight and I am sure that Knight is aware of it. On top of it, the state of Indiana is Coach’s home and that probably bugs Knight since he thinks he is the king of that state. I give Knight credit as a color commentator for speaking his mind, but most of the stuff coming out his piehole are things along the lines of “if I was the coach, I would tell them…blah, blah, blah”. He really should say the truth though and say “if I was the coach I would strangle Dragovich, throw a chair at the SPDR’s, assault a student fan and blow a fuse at the post game presser”.
by 84 on Feb 21, 2010 8:44 AM PST up reply actions
Aside from that one comment
I give him a pass for the rest of the commentary last night. Nightmare game for anyone to have to provide commentary and keep an audience interested.
by britishbruin on Feb 21, 2010 9:40 AM PST up reply actions
Living in the Great Lakes region, I tuned in the UCLA game, just to catch an"out of region" game for me. I couldn’t get past halftime, had to turn it off. I can see why there is so much angst on the board. Not only was that not the ‘UCLA Basketball’ that I remembered from years gone by, this was just godawful basketball. I wish you fans luck in getting this mess straightened out.
Granted, I don't know what down it is..

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