Hoops Roundup: Taking Cues From Tyler
by Nestor on Feb 26, 2010 5:35 AM PST
in Basketball
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PrintI don't have a lot of extra notes to add to T's concise post game observations from last night (well early morning for those of us out East). Bruins are turning into team of Tyler Honeycutt. As Don McLean observed he has clearly emerged as the best player in our basketball team and I would think he will be the unquestioned leader of this group guys next season.
As for the game, I thought I had a good shot of winning the game even though we were playing a depleted frontcourt. Oregon State is a terrible 3 point shooting team and was the perfect opponent for our 2-3 zone. The Beavers played according to their scouting reporting making only 3 out of their 20 attempts beyond the arc. Coach Ben Howland was gracious about that stat line saying Beavers just "missed a lot of wide-open shots."
I liked the effort I saw from the team especially in the first half. Even Ragovic dove to the floor. He did it twice even though he wasn't successful. As T said, Bobo had some good moments on the defensive end but it seemed like he tired towards the end of the first half.
It wasn't very difficult to see what the Beavers were doing as they had Joe Burton eating up Ragovic all through the second half. I would have still liked to see Howland give Bobo more minutes in the second half, as he pretty much stuck with Ragovic. Oh well, we just have one more home game left with this guy. It is not worth getting worked up over questionable game rotation involving this guy any more.
MR played the role of primary ball handler number of times last night against the 1-3-1. It seemed to effect his point production but he didn't mind too much:
Senior guard Michael Roll was the primary passer, handling the ball when Oregon State (12-15, 6-9) pressured the top of the key. Roll, who leads the team with 3.6 assists per game, finished with seven, though he scored just three points.
"Last game, I played the point guard just because they were trapping, so we stuck with the same thing today," Roll said. "Today I was more of a facilitator. I didn't shoot well, 1 for 6 - that's not like me. But they were trapping us, trying to get into other guys, trying to bring the zone to me, and other guys were open."
The Bruins end up shooting 52 percent from the floor, which wasn't too shabby.
Going forward, I think the game against Oregon is going to be very difficult. The Ducks are coming off a victory over Southern Cal last night at Costco Center. Kent's held the Trogans to 12 points in the second half, as they clearly haven't given up on their own season. As we learned from our first matchup against them they are young but a pretty deep and athletic team.
Tajuan Porter and LeKendric Longmire have the potential to create huge headaches for our shaky backcourt. Porter himself has been inconsistent all season long, however when he gets going with couple of make shots, he can become very dangerous. Also, with Michael Dunigan (6-10, 255) and Josh Crittle (6-8, 260), they have two bangers up-front they have the ability to overwhelm us around the rim. We were absolutely embarrassing last night against the Beavers (which included a disappointing effort from Bobo in the first half). We will have to bring lot higher energy to mitigate Duck's physical advantage on Senior Day.
Last time we played the Ducks we lost to them in OT by 5 points. One of the key reasons for losing in that game was the usual lack of patience as we attempted 33 3 point shots connecting only 10 times. I really hope our whole team takes its cue from the selfless freshman who has emerged as the best player at the end of this season, by focusing on being patient and giving all out effort on both ends of the court.
GO BRUINS.
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Good to get a win when our only two big men have a total of 2 rebounds
Honeycutt is really good, only reason to be optimistic about the team at this point. He has a nice all around game.
Malcolm Lee looked more agressive at the top of the zone Defense and helped cause some to’s in the first half.
I think Bobo (or Lane if available) is going to need to play more against Oregon if we are going to win.. they are a much bigger team and will destroy us worse than OSU if Dragovic is holding down the middle.
How does Jerime Anderson (who had a few nice moments yesterday) feel when malcolm lee and roll are working to bring the ball up the court and he’s relegated to play the SF’s role in the 1-3-1 zone/press breaker?
How do you think Anderson would feel ?
He is not what he was advertised, period.
Just look at that one sequence last night when, towards the last five minute mark in regulation time, somebody passed him the ball. Standing outside the perimeter, with an OSU player not even close to him, somehow he struggled, and let the ball bounce out of his clumsy hands. That OSU player grabbed it of course and there we had a turnover.
Someone talked about off season development. Anderson surely needs it the worst way.
Bobo played less because he
Injured a finger. He went to the bench shaking his finger in pain at one point in the first half. I think he jammed one of them because he came back on the court in the second half with a wrap/splint on it. Nothing serious I would think.
"We should have a banner up there: the only team to make the tournament without a coach." -- Baron Davis, remembering his "coach" at UCLA
by inhowlandwetrust on Feb 26, 2010 7:21 AM PST via mobile reply actions
Ton of credit to CBH
Smart coach who realized he needed a better passer and decision maker with the ball coming over half court. He chooses Roll, which unfortunately takes Roll out of position for his usual shooting but think what it could have been if JA was the one. He would likely get destroyed by the trap at half court. Only 12 team turnovers not bad for this team against that defense.
Apparently after the game
Howland specifically admitted (per posted video on BRO) that he should have pulled Dragovic more, previously this season after taking bad shots with lot of time left in the shot clock.
I am not going to give you the exact quote because you need to get that from the video. I will share it if Howland’s presser becomes available elsewhere.
With just 3 games left in regular season it is kind of disheartening to hear that from him considering so many of us have been seeing the obvious for the whole year.
My first post
Hi Nestor et all, great job you are doing with the site been reading for awhile.
Regarding Howland, and I’ll definitely post much more later, I think it is an encouraging thing everytime he says he learned something or he made a mistake. He’s learning still, despite his glorious rise in coaching, and that bodes very well for us for the future. Look at it this way, it in one year he has gone back on his sworn use of man defense only, AND realized no matter how long you kick a dog that could be a showwinner, he just isn’t going to get any smarter, that’s pretty positive steps for a coach. The only thing better will be if he’s learned his lesson with yearly recruiting, in my opinion it will be a fantastic year for CBH, and IMO we owe him a learning rebuilding year after the past few (which made us forget the Lavin years).
One final point, that made me want to write this comment in the first place.
I don’t think its a coincidence that the Bruins shot more than 50% from the field and won. When they shoot well, they win. Go back and look at the box scores, when they shoot anywhere near 50% they win. Why they don’t shoot that well when clearly they have some great offensive power on their team is multifaceted and mostly probably has to do with their confidence.
Anyway, its been a really rough year to be a Bruin fan, but there have been some highlights and even though I wasn’t able to watch last night’s game live, great to see Honeycutt developing into the breakout player we thought he would be. I have a feeling if Lane was able to play last night he would have picked up some slack too.
2010-11 could be a great season, depending on off-season development.
13-9
I mostly agree with you Trevor
We owe him with at least 2 more years IMO to get this program back on track. However, I found his comment re. Dragovic extremely frustrating because it’s not the first time he has issued mea culpa type of statement only to go back to doing the same thing.
Our archive is littered with roundups with Howland quotes in which he admitted mistakes only to repeat them again. He did it with zone. He did it with mismanaging playing time for freshmen. Again, I am hoping he gets this back on track in next two years because of the goodwill he generated from his runs.
However, I have found his game management decisions last year and half frustrating and confusing. I hope he gets back to his principles (defense, hustle and effort) with true commitment (and not just contrite words in press conference) in the remaining games this year and next two seasons.
Our archive is littered with roundups with Howland quotes in which he admitted mistakes only to repeat them again. He did it with zone. He did it with mismanaging playing time for freshmen.
I know, I’ve been keeping track. Bad habits he needs to kick. Last night should be a perfect indication. There was one point in the first half where all the frosh were 50% and above shooting and MR and ND were like 1-4 and 0-2. CBH had big plans for the ND and JK and neither turned into much of anything.
13-9
with MR
At least he always makes an effort to play a complete game. He was struggling with his shooting last night but doing a solid job working around the 1-3-1. Also, if you guys ever want to zero in on him, watch him on D. He is always telling his team-mates where to go (except it often is not paid attention to by you know who).
Again, I really really hope Howland is going to adjust in next two years. We need him to because he still has a shot at turning this around.
Honeycutt's game last night
reminds me of Scottie Pipens of the Chicago Bulls.
Even at this stage, he already shows an uncanny court visions and awareness of the game. He is aptly nicknamed " toolbox " for good reasons. His pleasant, easy does it, playful personality was on full display last night too. Several times, TV camera caught that little sly, enjoy the moment smiles while chewing his gums after some excellent plays. It even drew some envious facial expressions from his OSU defenders.
Then the camera focused on him in a huddle after Howland called time. He spiritedly doled out some suggestions to his teammates. When he lifted up his water bottle to drink, I saw clearly on my big screen HD TV the tattoos on the inside of his forearm. Inscribed were two Oriental characters that my wife said meant " eternal love ". I don’t know if they were meant for UCLA or, young as he is , there’s already someone in his life. Should that be the case, she is one lucky girl indeed because even Don MacLean said he would be a big time basketball player for UCLA.
Don MacLean called a spade a spade, whenever he saw one. It’s been quite a while now when he dished out such effusively praises on our players.
CBH on how ND got UCLA "off"
Even the ND “defenders” will agree with what CBH said. The quote was in response to a question about OSU closing the game to one point and UCLA coming back. The relevant part is when CBH said the low point was when:
NIkola took a bad shot. About 30 seconds on the shot clock. 26 feet out and I pulled him right away. And I probably should be doing that more to him cause that really got us off.
saw CBH ripping on Drag
After Drag uncorked a long brick with about 30 seconds left on the shot clock, the ball went out of bounds and there was a short break and Howland called Drago over and laid into him. Would have been nice if he’d yanked him too but I don’t know if Bobo was injured or what. Bummer not to see Moser at all.
by RealisticBruinFan on Feb 26, 2010 8:37 AM PST up reply actions
he did yank him
as i saw it. but then put him back in very quickly thereafter.
Bruins Forever
by bruinsince69 on Feb 26, 2010 9:21 AM PST up reply actions
It is also interesting about ML
He had his best game in a while. Yes he had a dumb foul, dumb TOs, air balled a three, but he also scored on the break, played great defense, etc. His ability to release and not have to worry about bring the ball up helped a great deal. It was a good sign for us if he can go back to playing 2 in the future.
That is VERY interesting
Unlocking ML has a lot more to do with a change in Ben Howland’s slow half-court offense to a quicker more atheletic offense built on dribble penetration. Amazing how when one or two guys do their job, and play their position, things start to work out, and your #2 has some room to breathe.
13-9
disagree
i think it mostly had to do with defensive intensity and on occasion because we broke down their extended 1-3-1 and had space to work. ML has little skill in breaking down a defense from a half-court set IMO.
Bruins Forever
by bruinsince69 on Feb 26, 2010 9:23 AM PST up reply actions
Not disagreeing with your point on ML but reaching different conclusion
ML was playing 2 last night so he played better. As point he has to break down teams, not his skill set, as you say. As 2 he has more freedom and he was much more active on the offense end without the ball.
He didn't play better.
ML scored on turnovers, primarily caused by TH. Being able to dunk after leaking out doesn’t make for a good game, IMO. ML still can’t shoot, actually took six steps on one of his dunks, but most importantly, turned the ball over under only moderate pressure. I am surprised that he is being praised for a good game. I was very dissappointed in his play last night. I thought JA played better.
Can someone help me understand
For the more astute basketball folks on BN, does anyone have a point-of-view on why we seem to walk the ball to the half-court line, then stop, then walk across the half-court line into a trap? What ever happened to using speed-guile-moves-basketball IQ to get the ball into the front court and create? Since our team does this on every possession I’m assuming they are coached to do so as part of the half-court offense but I cringe every time waiting for the pass to be picked off or the rainbow across and over to the far side of the court, etc.
It’s Ben Howland’s control half-court fundamental offense. It works when you have 5 players on the court who are very capable and are astute in their fundamental position responsibilities. Ie a #1 who plays #1, #5 who plays #5, etc. You control the pace, the ball movements, the game, and dominate the opponent. CBH has had that luxury over the past few years. This year it has been exposed because he does not have a solid 5 that play the solid 5 positions. Its also why CBH’s traditional man defense didn’t work, we don’t have the 5 that have a high enough IQ, the discipline, and in some cases, the talent, to play their position in full responsibility. Note how when the game plan changes – fast break, motion, zone, etc… things start to change. Note how if we play the slow and steady that CBH wants us to play, the closer we get to a real #1 through a real #5 the better we do. We just didn’t have the personnel this year to carry it off. Again, CBH must learn from this – its a recruiting problem AND a coaching game plan problem, and only now is he starting to realize it.
Look at it this way, MOST coaches have to develop a new game plan EVERY year based on WHAT THEY HAVE, not what they want their unmatching players to be.
13-9
I agree with the last line as well wholeheartedly as well and on 281 Question
This team was not going to be “ben ball warriors.” Without focusing on the obvious example, take MR, a great kid and one of the best this year, but MR will never be a great “ben ball warrior” defender. He just does not have the speed. It was my hope that CBH would focus more on offense this year as this team cannot win the traditional CBH at UCLA way.
Last night he did in a sense and it is the answer to 281 question. The reason we had MR be “point” last night was because we needed a passer not a ball-handler. The OSU 1-3-1 is a trapping defense with their best defender, Tarver at the top. Tarver’s goal is not to take a player one on one but rather with one of his teammates to trap you and make you make a bad pass. You want your best passer to get you out of the trap.
It also why a team like $C lost to OSU and may do so again. Garrity at $C can handle ball pressure but a trap is something different and as we saw at the end of our last $C game they can throw bad passes.
But back to MR. He is not the solution at point against a ball pressure team like $C or the second UW game. Unfortunately ML is are best option there which is one of the reasons $C beat us twice and is so far the ONLY team to do that this year. ML is doing his best but he is really a 2. I think it is the reason that CBH stuck with JA early so long this year, it was in part for ML.He hoped JA would be the solution but (hopefully because of injuries) he was not.
Which leads to the answer to why we seem to walk the ball. ML gets out of control if he has the PG responsibilities and tries to score\create. He is not a RW who was a 2 and became a very good 1. He is a 2, IMO, sacrificing for the team and playing 1 because there is no else better at handling ball pressure. His UCLA playing model is AA, great defender and a 2. (No I am not comparing or stating he will be that good.)
Thank you Nestor
And DC, nice thoughts. Its fascinating to spend time on this, trying to figure out why MR, a #2 at heart, is spending time playing #1 at all when ML, JA and even MAH are on the team. That tells you all you need to know… we have no PG. JA is just too inconsistent to even be considered. He’s making mistakes (taking your eye off your defender and not protecting the ball when dribbling in the open court) that you stop making as a Fresh in high school if that late. MR should NOT have to be a #1. Never. But he has the highest Bball IQ of anyone who can play the #1 so he is able to pass.
Regarding your last comment DC, I believe the “slow walk up” not-push-it offense has been there as long as Ben Howland has been there. I can’t think of a time, short of beating a full court press that any guard has pushed the pace on an opponent.
13-9
Good point on Slow Walk Up
Yes we have never pushed it is as much as many (Muir Coach articulates it well) as we seemingly should. But we could and did do so occassionally.
I have always believed we did not do it more because we have always been a defense first team. Our players rest on offense and then go all out on defense. A zone, let’s our guys rest on defense (No, ND jokes please), so this would be a great year to be more offensively minded and push it, but we don’t have a true PG.
So yes, we have never been a push it team but before we could and did at times. This year we should but it is tough.
Hey Trevor, what a Hall of Fame statement you gave us
I am sure Howland will engage in plenty of reflections and soul searchings once the season ends. He is just starting to realize, albeit belatedly, the problems he created for himself and his team.
I had the same question last night during the game
and have not read anything yet that explains the pause PRIOR to the mid court line.
I can see us walking up the court, I understand that. I can even understand why we stop prior to mid court when we are being pressured. Why then, when there is no pressure, are we still doing it?
I saw the guards do it several times with no one guarding them, stop and look around and then have to make a pass when they could have easily crossed the time line. Habit? Why take the chance on a violation? Just wondering if anyone had any insight? Seems like a bad habit to get in to.
by LongtimeBru on Feb 26, 2010 10:52 AM PST up reply actions
Reason against OSU only
OSU’s 1-3-1 is a half court trap. They could care less what you do in back court. But as soon as you cross half court, Tarver is on you and they will try to trap you. Thus, you pause right before half court because it is your last second without pressure, a chance to look around, and decide what you are going to do, etc.
It is sort of like throwing the ball in from behind the half court line with an option to dribble as well. Out of bounds, you have 5 seconds to make that pass, here you have a few seconds to decide as well. Does that make sense?
Also as 75 said
.
If you speed dribble into it, the dribbler will be double-teamed more effectively.
A pause is good against the 1-3-1.
As soon as you cross the half court line, you can't go back.
This makes it easier to trap you, the half court line being part of the trap.
Go Bruins!
281bruins...the reason UCLA walks it up
Against the 1-3-1 the weakness of the zone exposes itself once the ball handler accepts the double team. It comes from different points in the zone that is predicated on where the dribbler is once he crosses midcourt. The ability to swing the ball and make the extra pass – specifically into the corners – allows for dribble penetration along the baseline or a wideopen jump shot. What OSU wants you to do is speed up, beat the first defender (the point man/Tarver) off the dribble and drive into the teeth of the defense without a passing angle to the corners.
UCLA’s game plan was to accept the double with their best decision makers – Roll, Honeycutt and Lee – all have length and the ability to see over the top of the second defender. Anderson isn’t a good decision maker, has an unsteady handle and would have to leave his feet to pass over the top of the zone. UCLA decided to walk it up to cut down on turnovers. Howland obviously felt the best way to beat OSU was to not allow them too many cheap baskets off turnovers. CBH knew the Beavers didn’t have the ability to consistently shoot from beyond the arc.
To sum it up it all comes down to good guard play. This club is devoid of it, has been the entire season outside of Roll. If the Bruins had better decision makers they would open the floor and run. With their limitations in the half court it makes a lot of sense. CBH has made the wise decision to slow the tempo limit possessions and risks on offense because the Bruins have lost at least four games this year because of turnovers (CSUF, @ USC, @ Oregon and @Stanford).
Life is what happens when you're busy making plans.
75natchamps
After a made basket, teams like OSU go into a trapping mode. If you speed dribble into it, the dribbler will be double-teamed more effectively. Last night, the Bruins spread the court well and actually handled the trap very well for most of the first half. In the second half, they got sloppier and started to turn it over. The pressure from the 1-3-1 wasn’t that strong. It is pretty telling that after a full season at the point, CBH has to use Roll to break pressure rather than ML or JA.
Why TH is the best blocker on our team
If you see the picture on your post, his arm is one foot longer than the guy he was guarding. No wonder he had as many as 5 blocks last night. His only weakness is foul shooting, and he needs to improve on it. Besides TH, I don’t think we played good last night, it was because Oregon St. played very bad. It is unlikely we will catch Oregon shooting poorly tomorrow, but you never know. I can quarantee you that Oregon will pound it inside every chance they get and we would have no defense at all. DN is not the answer inside. Could we try TH at center if Bobo gets tired?
If Lane is healthy...
If BL can go tomorrow I believe he gets a lot of run at center. You are correct that Oregon will pound it Dunigan all game. Oregon has really underachieved this season, when you look at their roster they should be in the top four in the conference without question. If the Ducks are making their shots from the outside it will be a long day for us – hope the Bruins limit the turnovers, can keep the Ducks off the backboards and just play a smart game at home – do those things and they likely win and get a little momentum heading into the Arizona roadie and the conference tourney.
Life is what happens when you're busy making plans.
Is BL ready?
I would play Bobo until he gets dog-tired before I use ND at all. ND looked very bad at center although he did provide some much-needed firepower at the end, including a couple of critical foul shots.
Bobo
I’ve been Bobo’s biggest supporter the entire season just wishing the light would eventually go on for him, but this late into his sophomore season you just have to chalk it up to him being what he is right now. His length will allow him to take a few fouls, maybe stumble into a put back and grab a couple of boards, but Lane has the ability to stretch the defense – drawing the center/pf out of the key and opening up some opportunities to drive for TH and ML.
Life is what happens when you're busy making plans.
Hmm
What is funny is all this time I had completely written off Bobo yet now I am coming around to the idea that let the kid play a bit. Let him sink or swim. He is not a good rebounder at all but I have seen some faint sign of progress in terms of his understanding of our zone defense and our offensive scheme. Again really interested to see what he does. I am not giving up on this kid.
Thinking the same
about Bobo; he had his moments. Just now watched the game (long story) – I think it’s telling that even with 8 scholarship players available, if Donnie Mac was right, MM’s only reason to get up during the game was to applaud.
Problem with TH as center is rebounding
You need TH to rebound. He had 1/2 our boards in the first half. While he got 5 rebounds in the second half two of those were at the end when the game was over. While he was blocking shots there was no one left to rebound.
If you go for the block you are out of position for the rebound. So while, he could get 5 blocks again he may not get as many rebounds and we can’t replace that right now. (ML was briefly three on defense last night as he may be the second best rebounder left healthy!)
Of course a couple of those blocks were outside shots, so the point is not relevant there but it is best to have your 4 lead your team in rebounding in a zone and he is our best 4.
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