Hoops Power Outage Continues for UCLA: Bruins Implode Against Texas 59-69
by Nestor on Dec 3, 2011 4:05 PM PST
in Basketball
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And the pain continues. Just like the UCLA football team provided some flickering moments of "hope" Ben Howland's basketball program got few of us a little encouraged this afternoon against Texas Longhorns. Just like last, reality also cough up with Howland's flailing basketball program tonight. Bruins dropped to 1-5 (we are not going to count the "win" against Chaminade), losing by a double digit margin again. The final score was 59-69 (boxscore).
Bruins came out scorching hot making their first 7 shots and went up by a score of 17-6. At one point they were up by as much as 11 points in the first half. Then Rick Barnes made some adjustments, few Bruins "checked out," and the Longhorns ran away from the bumbling, stumbling, and befuddled Bruins. To top it off in the first half we had a little "power outage" in the Garbage Sports Arena, putting an exclamation point on the state of Chanti Dan's major revenue programs (he may have forgotten to pay the power bill). The Bruins still hung on for a 34-28 lead at half time but then completely imploded in the second.
Texas came into the game as an inexperienced team recovering from mass NBA defections and struggling around the boards. As DC Bruins noted in his preview those guys had been out-rebounded 46-30 by the North Texas Mean Green, coughing up 22 boards on the offensive end. Yet against UCLA this afternoon the Longhorns found a way to outrebound a Howland coached team 30-29. They also shredded our defense , shooting 54.7 percent from the floor, making a mockery out of out interior defense in the second half.
I guess Zeek Jones was the leading scorer for the Bruins with 21 points. The problem though was he had a grand total of 1 assist, showing no ability to set up his team-mates for score. He also got torched on the defensive end time after time. The Wear Twins showed some sign of life in the early going but eventually reverted to usual form of putting up one weak jump shots after another killing any natural flow of the offense.
What was interesting is that when the Bruins came out in the first half there was some semblance of flow when the Wear Twins were playing at the 4 and 5. Yet when Howland made his substitutions and had D. Wear playing at the 3, that's when it all started going South. D. Wear continued to get beat at that spot, as the Bruins in general looked like a slow and unathletic bunch against the ‘Horns.
Those guys were bad. Some of their team-mates were just downright brutal. Let's start with the obvious one. Reeves Nelson looked like his mind was somewhere else. He looked to be mentally checked out when he came off the bench and was completely out of sync. Same goes for Josh Smith who once again looked slow, disinterested and out of it. Every time these two guys got on the floor it looked as if the Longhorns were on some kind of "power play." These two guys - who were being counted as Bruins' front court strength - combined for 6 points and 6 rebounds.
Speaking of being out, Howland did not bother giving Brendan Lane any minutes. He also didn't bother using Anthony Stover until situation became desperate in the second half. He never got into any kind of flow or rhythm with rest of his team-mates. One would think he'd give these two kid real opportunities given how Nelson and Smith were completely checked out during the game. Yeah, I am sure all of this is going to really help the chemistry of this program.
We will have lot more on this game later on BN. For now we will leave up to you guys to provide your instant thoughts on the game. If you want to share extended reflections please consider using the fanpost section. Fire away.
GO BRUINS.
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My wife and I used to be fanatical U.C.L.A. alumni...
now we just watch whenever we make a bad TV viewing decision. To be honest, we flipped to the game when it was 40-40 and my wife said “do we really have to watch this team lose another game? please put it back to ufc ultimate fighter.” I agreed and flipped it back.
I have never been willingly been associated with anything this crappy… so willingly mismanaged… so willingly crappy.
I’ll be honest again… I really don’t associate mediocre family either… I have a nephew, I don’t know if he is a little slow or just lazy, but I don’t even like him. It isn’t that he is a bad kid but the slackjawed mouth breathing with the blank stare just angers me. It probably makes me a bad person. However, if I won’t tolerate dumb people in my own family (thankfully, not from my family’s gene pool), I sure as hell won’t tolerate it from a 50 something AD that makes $700k a year and is destroying something that I used to love.
The coaching search is irrelevant… just make sure that he doesn’t commit to some dumbass contract… we need to focus on canning Guerrerror and letting a new AD clean house.
by beanandcheeseburrito on Dec 3, 2011 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
We stink
And there is absolutely no way Shabazz Muhammad should even remotely be considering UCLA…safe to say we’ve given up on him yet?
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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I doubt it
Looks like a one-and-done for sure. Kyle Anderson on the other hand…
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:11 PM PST up reply actions
I'm amazed at how frequently this team manages to stray from a functioning game plan
And I realize a lot of it has to do with insane assignments (e.g. D Wear at SF), but what in the world is going through these guys’ heads? Given what happened when they went away from the flow, why are they apparently so eager to keep doing it? In the same game no less!
I look at your photo of reeves and smith and I read the photo
as both guys knowing that they are screwing up. They meaning themselves—smith and reeves.
I do not know if they have a plan on how to fix themselves. But I think they are starting to realize that they need to do something.
I mean really what can we do
Josh Smith fasts for 3 weeks and loses 50 lbs? Reeves Nelson decides to actually give a shit? Pauley Pavillion magically materializes so we don’t have to play in the Sports Arena? Still holding out hope we’ll turn it around before Pac-12 play starts but losing hope fast…
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:14 PM PST up reply actions
Great...after next year, our incompetent AD can screw up
a basketball coach search…
Not that I'm too enamored of Howland these days, but dude has a lot of contract left.
So given UCLA’s track record on this, I think it’d take a Neuheisel-esque implosion to hasten any kind of coaching move.
Howland and substitutions
Please forgive me for repeating this, but I wrote this in the game thread 30 seconds beofr it closed.
It seems to me that every single blessed time UCLA has a team on the floor that is doing well, Howland has to take people out and replace them with players who will screw the pooch.
It’s unbelievable. It’s as if he substitutes on the basis of a timetable that he has drawn up before the game and keeps to regardless of what’s happening on the floor. We make our first eight shots, we’re meshing on defense, so it’s time to bring in Smith and Nelson.
Other teams never have to worry about taking us out of our rhythm. All they have to do is wait for Howland to do it. The Bruins would play better if he just coached practices and stayed home watching the games on TV while an assistant handled the games.
Stover.
Please guys …..what does he bring. …? Opposing players goes around him like a breeze1
I agree for the most part, but the starters can't play all 40 minutes
And he kept a tight rotation in the 1st half. But as soon as Nelson & Smith got extended minutes … well, you know the rest.
They have to play though
We don’t have enough talent on the roster without those two guys in the lineup. Just gotta hope they start producing? Seems like somewhat of a longshot…traditional motivational tactics don’t seem to work on either of those blockheads
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:16 PM PST up reply actions
What about Lane
He is holding is defensive position very well against the one he is guarding!
This team is mentally fragile
the exact opposite of BB warrior teams we expect. Lack of individual accountability and commitment by key players leading to bad chemistry and poor performance.
Hail to the Hills of Westwood.
Mentally fragile is so right
No one on this team seems to have a killer instinct. No real leadership on the floor. As soon as things go astray, no one willing to take the team on his shoulders.
I feel like Reeves would be a decent leader if he actually gave a f***
The fact that Zeke is considered a leader is a joke
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:23 PM PST up reply actions
That's what I thought he would be going into this season.
Dude was balling it up in the gym all summer long. Then just one game happens where the Wears get more shots than him, and he goes off on a pout-fest ever since.
BH may be a wonderful X's and O's guy when it comes to preparing for a Thursday
night conference game, but how can anyone give him a pass for three years of absolutely brutal recruiting. With no quickness coming next year, why would we not expect a fourth year. How can he recruit misfits such as Smith and Nelson(indeed, even Nelson’s high school coach has commented on his “issues”)? How can he not recruit a quick point guard( something every team in America seems to have except Pepperdine and UCLA)?How can he recruit a team without a single pure shooter( you should have seen the warmups in the Loyola game)? How can you spend over a year pretending the Wear twins were Division 1 starters? How can you put any of us in a position where we have to watch the inept AD have the opportunity to bungle another coaching hire?
Adams is supposed to be a pure shooter
From what I’ve read at least. Agree on the guards though, not sure which position Anderson would match up with on the defensive end, definitely not 1 or 2
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:21 PM PST up reply actions
Also
Larry Drew won the McDonalds All-American 3-point contest in 2008. I wonder if he can still shoot after riding the pine for 4 years?
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:31 PM PST up reply actions
Not to be an alarmist or anything
But Jordan Adams isn’t exactly, svelte. Google his picture. Dude’s awfully round for a wing player. Hoping he’s not the perimeter version of Josh Smith.
Recruiting misses is the story
He has recruited point guards, but missed badly on them.
08: Anderson & Holiday – Holiday was one & done, and Anderson was going to back him up.
09: No PG brought in, and Anderson failed miserably at the position forcing Lee to run point.
10: No PG brought in. Howland put all his eggs in Ray McCallum’s basket, and Ray went to play for Dad in Detroit. Missed on Deonte Burton this year. Ended up having to offer a JC (Zeek) and Matt Carlino, who bailed anyway.
11: No PG brought in. LD2 transfers in.
12: Had a PG, but lost him to Nike U.
13: Maybe a PG finally, five years after losing Collison & Holiday?
Josh Smith
- rated center in the nation when he was recruited. Top center from the West Coast. All he needed to do to become a “one and done” was “lose a little weight.”
Is it recruiting or development or both? Taking into consideration our #1 recruiting class with Holiday, Lee, Anderson, Gordon (gone), Moser (gone) and company, I just don’t get it anymore.
If Smith was the top center in the nation when he was recruted...
The rest of the bunch must have been pretty bad…Smith has only good hands and feet under the basket!. He’s got no other shot repertoire .How could it be rank at the top? Losing weight (if he can) won’t change these shortcomings. You do not start developping a variety of shots at this age.. You have to start much younger
Centers and bigs always develop later
Always. That’s why some NBA bigs have stories of not even playing basketball until the middle of high school. You’d never hear similar stories about a point guard.
Now think about this: Smith is at least 30 pounds heavier than he was last year, when he was a +/- monster, and he was integral on both ends of the floor. You don’t think losing another 30 on top of that wouldn’t have positive benefits? You don’t think maybe being able to dunk more than once a game would make him more effective?
Your clear bias against Smith at the expense of reality and facts is cute, but it doesn’t make for intelligent conversation.
Intelligent conversation..
Smith has not shown me he can develop a turn around shot back to the Basket and/or a hook shot.. He does not and won’t have that cordination regardless how many pounds he can lose.. even at 275 pounds let’s say if he can get his weight that low?. If he had that coordination and body control he would have already shown it even at his current weight for at least… the hook shot. .The few times I have seen try ….he just threw the ball up in the air in an very uncoordinated fashion.
I like how you say you're "looking at the result"
And yet here you’re dinging him on how he gets his points. You can’t have it both ways. Your bias couldn’t be more clear. I also like how you pretend to not know, or are ignorant of the fact, that body control becomes more difficult with additional weight. Anyone who has played any sport at any level knows that from personal experience.
Seriously, you’re reaching here, and your observations are quite frankly pure fantasy. I’m not going to continue wasting my time with someone that just makes shit up.
Any conversation you want to have about Smith’s overall potential has to include last year, and you don’t get to continue to ignore his effectiveness back then when talking about it. The issue now is his current conditioning.
Smith was the #7 center, according to Scout
Behind Enes Kanter, Jared Sullinger, Perry Jones, Fab Melo, Adreian Payne, and Meyers Leonard.
With several teams chock full of future (soon to be) NBA All Stars, Howland could not bring a championship to Westwood.
I’ve said it before — I think Howland is overrated. I think his offensive stratagems just stink, his player selection atrocious, his inflexibility his Achilles heel. And playing favorites has completely dispirited his teams, this one included. Howland does not have the ability to adjust. It’s puzzling and infuriating.
The stench of mediocrity extends throughout most of Morgan Center these days.
Sadly, it sucks to be a Bruin.
Totally overrated. How does a team with Kevin Love, Russell Westbrook...
…Luc Richard M’Bah Amoute, Darren Collison and Alfred Aboya, plus Michael Roll, Lorenzo Mata Real, Josh Shipp and a couple of promising others not only lose to Memphis but get BLOWN OUT?!!!
by Seth Chandler on Dec 3, 2011 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
Memphis was pretty damn good that year
And the problems we have then are the same problems we have now…not enough athleticism on the perimeter to stop pepole and/or create shots. I remember distinctly thinking that Westbrook was the only guy who could stay in front of his man and create him own shot out of all the players on our team
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:38 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed...
but there is no way that Joey Dorsey could actually shut Love down inside if they had actually made the gameplan around getting him the ball…Dorsey is a good NBADL player, but that’s about it…I’m not saying we should have beat Rose and Co., but it should have been closer…
If Westbrook/Collison/Shipp were able to bust Memphis' zone from the perimeter, yeah it would've been different
But they didn’t. Love never had a chance.
No excuse for getting blown out.
Howland didn’t put Westbrook on Rose. And he always had Love at low post instead of running the UCLA high-post offense. Totally wasted Love’s talent all year long.
by Seth Chandler on Dec 3, 2011 4:42 PM PST up reply actions
OK, now that doesn't make any sense.
A FF appearance was wasting Love’s talent “all year?” Obviously the Memphis game was a cluster, but Love’s talent was clearly utilized to its extent during the regular season.
That's a non-sequitur.
UCLA making the FF doesn’t prove Love’s talent wasn’t wasted. He had a decent outside shot. That’s just a fact.
I think he would have been a perfect high-post center. He was always parked under the basket, though, and kept there even when his teammates couldn’t get him the ball. We lost several games during the regular season because of that.
by Seth Chandler on Dec 3, 2011 5:24 PM PST up reply actions
Several games? They only lost three during the regular season.
UCLA lost to Texas due to Darren Collison and Josh Shipp’s inability to guard DJ Augustin and Damion James, and Kevin Love’s inability to establish post position against Connor Atchley. Love only scored 11 and played just 24 minutes because he struggled so badly on defense.
UCLA lost to USC due to Davon Jefferson lighting up Luc Mbah a Moute. Kevin Love scored 18 that game.
UCLA lost to Washington due to Justin Dentmon lighting up Darren Collison. Kevin Love scored 13 that game.
Love had completely mastered the low post and had the footwork to prove it. That’s why he was able to make the jump to the NBA. UCLA didn’t need a high-post presence — that was Mbah a Moute’s job. Kevin Love was in no way held back. The entire offense was funneled through him, perhaps to the detriment of his perimeter teammates, as the Memphis game showed. The games UCLA lost in the regular season had absolutely nothing to do with Kevin Love and his offensive ability, nor his place in Howland’s offensive playbook. They lost those three games because his teammates were thoroughly burned by an opponent on defense.
LOL
I’m sorry, but you mentioned Davon Jefferson, and I can’t see that name and not laugh (he plays in Russia now).
I do think that we could have benefited more from Love at the high post though. Putting the prince there was an invitation for teams to leave him alone and dare him to take a jumpshot…which he did, and wasn’t overly successful at. Mixing it up a little and putting Love there more may have forced teams to play more honest on Luc, if for no other reason than they wouldn’t see him missing elbow jumpers as much.
I’m not saying he was misused per se, because I think after the first 5-6 games of the season, we were putting him where he was most effective – remember this man is a rebounding machine. I’m just saying mixing it up could have helped us in the long run, and could have helped us against Memphis.
Didn't Davon declare early too? What a maroon.
Considering three of the four we lost that year were due to opponents’ wings/guards lighting us up, I don’t think Love on the high post would’ve made any discernible difference other than what you mentioned — it would’ve taken him out of a spot to dominate the glass the way he did.
Against Memphis? I suppose. UCLA didn’t lose that game in the high, or low post though. If there were any signs of life on the perimeter, that game would’ve been entirely different.
I don't know, Derrick Rose is pretty darn good though
After seeing him lead Chicago to the #1 record in the NBA…it made me feel more at ease
By having . . .
An illegal team. Remember Memphis had that Finals run taken away b/c DR was an illegal player — never took his SATs.
I mean, it should of been us against Kansas right?
Westbrook would have been able to guard him better.
And Kevin Love wasn’t the factor he could have been. The game should have been at least close, not a blowout.
Look at those five names for UCLA again. Rose may have been the best player on the foor, but I don’t think the Memphis starting five were better than ours.
by Seth Chandler on Dec 3, 2011 5:27 PM PST up reply actions
I remember
Rose taking Collison to school, play after play. and wondering why we did not put Westbrook on Rose.
Yes, because you are not stubborn.
And because you pay attention to what is actually happening in a game. Unlike ben Howland.
by Seth Chandler on Dec 4, 2011 1:52 PM PST up reply actions
Overrated, maybe
But the guy is always rated in the top-10 of NCAA coaches. I mean, unless we find an “up and comer” (I hate that phrase) or poach a big time coach, he’s probably the best we can do. Think up the coaches of the top 10 teams right now, would any of them leave?
It was absolutely clear to me...
Ben Howland must go. He’s failing on every level. At this point I would settle for mediocre. We are simply dreadful right now and trending the wrong way.
I gotta stand by BH a little bit . . .
He lost Lee and Honeycutt, who obviously were two extemely well-rounded players. Both could play defense and offense. They were supposed to be replaced by a top-10 lottery pick Josh Smith who lost 50 lbs and Reeves “First Team All Conference” Nelson. Both those guys have blown it.
On the other hand, maybe it’s his fault these guys haven’t gotten mentally and physically prepared for the season. What was JS doing the entire off season? Is that BH fault? I just don’ tknow.
Partially agree
The ice, however, is wearing thin for Howland and every facet about this man (recruiting, coaching/relationship with players, etc) is sounding worse by the week. I find it rather odd to have achieved so much between ‘06-’08 to only spiral down to where we were back when Howland took over.
Josh Smith is, by far, the most disappointing in terms of fulfilling even my minor expectations. SMH.
Somos los Bruins poderosos...
Kerry Keating is the reason
He was the recruiter. Since he left for Santa Clara it’s been all downhill. Howland can’t recruit. At Pitt it was Dixon. Without a Dixon or Keating, Howland is lost.
by BruinsinceBarnes on Dec 4, 2011 9:11 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
We missed 10 out of 20 free throws and a ridiculous number of layups
One of those missed free throws was an airball by Lamb. Lots of great defensive possessions followed by giving up the rebound. This team just lacks mental focus, and I think it’s more than just Reeves and Josh – it’s everyone.
The 70% empty sports arena doesn’t help much either. Thanks Dan!
by Objection Penguin on Dec 3, 2011 4:22 PM PST reply actions
Maybe if the S.A. was 99% empty,Chancellor Block would take notice...
Nah………….he doesn’t give a damn..
"Yeah, but did you see the Pepperdine game"
Ben Howland is done. But, you know, the season is long. League games start in 4 weeks. Maybe we’ll improve. Go Bruins.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Every time I see that picture of Josh Smith I think:
Reeves: Hey Josh, do you ever think there’s more to life than just basketball?
Josh: ignoring Reeves, but thinking: Should I go to Rendezvous for lunch, or Cafe 1919? Damn…
Josh Smith probably inhales Cafe 1919 pizzas at the rate you and I breathe
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
FREDERICK P. SOFT NOWHERE TO BE FOUND
Official Sponsor of We Believe
by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:26 PM PST up reply actions
wait, I wanted to check that place out o
by bruinbunz on Dec 3, 2011 6:16 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
wait, I wanted to check that place out
for dinner on Thursday night. is it really closed?
by bruinbunz on Dec 3, 2011 6:16 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
It's not good...
when the lack of shooting ability on this team makes me honestly believe that if I were on the team, the quality of guard play would go up…and I’m a freakin accountant!!
One other thing to note. I don’t know if there is any other coach in the country whose offense is specifically designed to get his players the ball in terrible scoring positions. It’s like he wants to prevent his players from getting in any sort of rhythm…utterly ridiculous.
Can't blame the system when the players don't follow it
Offense worked just fine in the first half when they were actually following it. Lights go out, and it’s like they just shut it down mentally.
Players not following
is on the coach.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Yeah, I get that.
But at some point dudes have to just suck it up and do what works. It worked in the first half. WTH were they thinking in the 2nd half? What’s better? Hating the system that works, or freestyling and not having that work? I’d rather win.
I agree this team is not the most efficient
at following the offense. But it was obvious that Barnes and TX had made adjustments at the half and were rotating a lot better. I agree that the players saw the offense not work a couple times and started running who knows what. But it’s not like BH really did much to reign them in and make adjustments himself.
Don't think I can agree with this.
Should we hold Howland 100% responsible for smith’s weight probs and RN’s mental instability and Anderson’s sticky fingers?
Hail to the Hills of Westwood.
The short answer is it doesn't matter
It’s still going in the portfolio under “Reasons this coach needs to go: inability to manage program”.
True, but bottom lining it like that does not make for much discussion here.
I think he could have helped himself by dealing more aggressively with the discipline problems he’s had. Then the focus might be more on player accountability, character, etc vs his shortcomings as a coach.
Hail to the Hills of Westwood.
The reason it is that way
Is because we’ve called for exactly what you’ve said for years now, and at a fever pitch ever since Ragobrick. Eventually you just declare it a lost cause.
My thought is that this still amounts to managing perception vs maximizing
results. I am not a mind reader and you can say this is generous but I believe he was doing what he thought was the best way to win games and tone deaf to the rest. He is more basketball coach than diplomat.
Hail to the Hills of Westwood.
If you ask some of his players
He’s more stubborn ass than basketball coach or diplomat. I don’t care what he was trying to do, because whatever it was, he clearly failed at it.
I don't have that access and I suppose it would depend on which players
I asked as to how much weight I would give it but he clearly has a system and philosophy that he strongly adheres to and it’s been successful (and a failure). I have friends that are friends of the program and support him “financially” and they love the guy but to your point, it doesn’t amount to anything if we don’t meet a minimum expectation and recently he’s not. Here’s hoping we improve dramatically and avoid the pain of another drawn out dismissal, recruitment, etc cycle. Like us, I can’t imagine he’s having much fun right now.
Hail to the Hills of Westwood.
yup
he recruited those guys, and now he has to handle those guys.
Those guys have to step up and be accountable, but if they don’t, then it still counts against CBH.
WE ARE NOT VERY GOOD....PERIOD.
Help is on the way, next year’s class will be good and hopefully Josh Smith will be in better shape. If Howland, doesn’t turn it around next year, then I believe he’ll be gone, but as far as this year goes, we are in store for a 15 win season, at best, and even in a weak Pac 12, we will finish no better than 3rd, probably 4th place and maybe be invited to the N.I.T.
Yeah the season is pretty much lost
I just hope it doesn’t end up with a losing record. We can miss the tournament, but please no losing record.
"We can miss the tournament?"
No we can’t. That’s never “allowable”. We’re UCLA.
Fight through your Learned Helplessness.
Ben Howland. Do you see what you’re doing to our Bruin faithful.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
I also thought it was never allowable for us to not be competing for the Pac 12 and national title
but we’re doing it anyways.
So you're saying he should be fired immediately?
Because I’m closer to that sentiment right now than I am to waiting to see what’s hiding behind door #2 in a couple of years.
I am. Ben shoulda been long gone. However, the BN Expectations have
been pointed out to me. I’m willing to cool off that, and see what happens during Conference play. But, I’ll say this… if, for whatever reason, we get more student defections from this squad during the season… that would signal a major crisis going on with our students. We then must act to protect our school. I want Nelson, and Smith, and anyone else to “work-out”. And… fortunately… there’s time for this ship to be righted. But, I am paying close attention (looking at you, Ben Howland).
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
There may not be much longer to wait TBH
5 losses at this point in the season means time is running out. Quickly. Even if we somehow get to 20 wins or so, the way the Pac 12 has handled itself this year, seems to scream “bubble out”. Now look at the record we need to compile from this point forward just to get to 20. It’s not looking good.
I'm probably in full out post-mortem mode due to the recent state of the proram
But who’s to say we’ll even make the tourney next year? The top programs are bringing in top talent with elite athleticism and we aren’t…
Kyle Anderson comes in, but I don’t really expect him to have any more impact than Honeycutt did his freshman year. Jordan Adams comes in and maybe relieves some of our perimeter scoring problems, but neither him nor Anderson look to be ready to defend on the perimeter at the D-I level. Zeke is gone, Drew probably gives us a similar level of play at the PG position, which to say is not much. Can’t see Reeves playing for us next year at this rate. Josh Smith might come back motivated, but probably not.
Can we PLEASE recruit some athleticism on the perimeter…
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
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by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 5:19 PM PST up reply actions
Athletes love to run. Ben doesn't like running.
Athletes will not be held in a box. Ben sits on the box top.
Therein lays the problem.
If I’m athletic, and I can run, and I can jump to the sky, and I don’t get gassed easily… there is no way I’m gonna put on the Ben Howland harness. Who would?
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Didn't we try to become a running team last year?
I mean, in comparison to previous years at least.
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
FREDERICK P. SOFT NOWHERE TO BE FOUND
Official Sponsor of We Believe
by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 5:27 PM PST up reply actions
Team can't run when it doesn't create turnovers and rebound on the defensive end
Has nothing to do with “not liking running.” The 09-10 team was dismal at it, and so is this year’s team in all the games it’s lost.
+1
can’t start a fast break when the ball is in the ref’s hands.
EXACTLY!!
Playing solid defense and rebounding well (Ben Howland Standards) CREATES fast break opportunities and chances to run. These kids don’t seem to understand that. I blame the “And 1” streetball movement which many of these players grew up watching and idolizing.
What these players also don’t seem to realize is that learning to play defense and being a great defender is EXTREMELY valuable in the NBA, and will significantly raise their stock as pro prospects. Scorers are a dime-a-dozen in the pros, but guys who can defend as well (especially on the perimeter) are a highly valued commodity. Guys like Afflalo, Collison, MBAM…they’re not big time scorers, but their value comes from their defensive ability.
Missing the tourney will not be acceptable
Period.
by Nestor on Dec 3, 2011 4:37 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Serious question
If we don’t make the tournament, and still don’t think Howland should be fired, will we become the new “neubs?” Can we still make arguments that Howland should stay? Or once the Bruinsnation front page writers make the decision Howland should go is that that? I am serious because unlike Neuheisel, firing Howland seems to me a lot more complicated and nuanced.
Michael C
www.onviolence.com
Depends
Neubs are Neubs not because they supported Neuheisel. They’re Neubs because they substitute emotional arguments for factual ones and expect us all to assign that equal validity. If your main argument to keep a coach can ever be boiled down to some form of “wait till next year” or “i’ll wait until ____ then see” then it’s probably a shitty reason. If you have to resort to the “everyone’s opinion is equal/valid/worthy of consideration” canard, it’s probably a shitty opinion.
hopefully Josh Smith will be in better shape
Fat chance
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
FREDERICK P. SOFT NOWHERE TO BE FOUND
Official Sponsor of We Believe
by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:34 PM PST up reply actions
Smith in better shape next year!
How do you know that?
I don't, but if Smith doesn't understand after this season, that he needs to lose 50 pounds and get in better condition, he more than likeley has decided he doesn't want to play in the NBA.
Who knows, maybe he doesn’t and wants to be a chef or something.
Not that I'm enamored with Howland currently, but the guy has a lot of contract left.
Like, nearly $9 million of contract left. As long as DG is in charge, you know how he runs things.
Can't really assume DG is gonna be around can we
I mean the football and basketball programs are both absolutely laughable, what the hell is still keeping him around.
NINERS SUPERBOWL OR BUST
FREDERICK P. SOFT NOWHERE TO BE FOUND
Official Sponsor of We Believe
by Tom Huddlestone on Dec 3, 2011 4:35 PM PST up reply actions
Why is Chianti Dan himself still around?
Shitty football, shitty basketball, bad attendance for both. What more do you need to see before you send him down the road?
Yeah, not well-versed on these contract issues. I just figured whatever the remainder on his deal
is what the school would have to pay out, should he be terminated.
That's pretty much never the case
Both sides almost always have a buyout clause for early termination.
A few reasons why DanG is still here:
Clean programs, No NCAA sanctions/investigations, successful non-revenue/olympic sports, close ties with top NCAA/Pac-12 brass, secured lucrative TV/apparel deals, secured funding to renovate Pauley
LOL What a shitty list
Clean programs, No NCAA sanctions/investigations
That’s a baseline expectation for your job. He gets no extra credit for this.
successful non-revenue/olympic sports
Less and less by the year. Starting to be a reason why he needs to go as well
close ties with top NCAA/Pac-12 brass
And doesn’t use this to benefit UCLA in any way whatsoever, only to fatten his own wallet and further his own career.
secured lucrative TV/apparel deals, secured funding to renovate Pauley
He didn’t do shit to secure a TV deal, and our apparel deal is terrible. It pays Chianti a lot of money, sure, but what has it done for Bruin fans? And are you sure funding for Pauley is secured now that it’s going to be “GoDaddy.com sponsors Pauley Pavilion”?
So thanks for listing a whole bunch of additional reasons why he should be fired.
Howland's contract
“July 1, 2008
LOS ANGELES – UCLA head men’s basketball coach Ben Howland and the University have agreed on a new seven-year contract, athletic director Dan Guerrero announced today. The new contract, which runs through the 2014-15 season, includes guaranteed compensation of $1.97 million for the 2008-09 season and escalates to $2.3 million for the 2014-15 season. It also includes the incentive package from his previous contract that has a maximum value of $235,000."
Is this when the decline began?
by CharliePotts on Dec 4, 2011 12:38 PM PST up reply actions
Even Lavin only had 1 losing season...
this will be Howland’s second…
Howland's 3rd.
He got paid his first year. That first year is on the record. That first year counts.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Correct...
I would give him a pass for that one, but not the second three.
It counts against Lavin
If you’re going to build an airtight case against Howland, you have to approach it fairly, and putting Lavin’s trash on Howland’s plate for year 1 isn’t fair.
None of his players
Counting TJ Cummings, Michael Fey, Jon Crispin, et. al., against Howland’s record isn’t fair.
Reeves Nelson, Drew Gordon, and Josh Smith on the other hand … absolutely.
I hope this team doesn't think it deserves better than the Sports Arena right now...
because with this atrocious start they should re-evaluate whether they belong at Pauly Pavilion at all. I will be rooting for them to turn it around but its up ultimately up to the players to be hungry and win.
God Loves UCLA.
Ben Howland is really, really infecting our mindset.
Dan GuError too. UCLA Brass, save us.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Outplayed by 6 freshmam...
and outcoached…where Holland had no answer to Barnes brillant second half adjustment.
There is absolutely no offensive team ball movements on the part of Ucla……just individuel effort ..and/or the lack of it
Total regime change.
The “basketball” group (I can’t say team) is unwatchable. Smith and Nelson do not even give a crap. They should both be booted off the squad for indifference. Addition by subtraction, or the Howland Way, to wit, Moser, Stanback, Gordon, you name it. Alternative: bench Smith until he loses 25 pounds and Nelson until he gets that sulker’s pout off his face, not that I blame them.
Probably can’t fire CBH this year, but the train wreck of his crappy coaching has permanently destroyed the program. I doubt we finish above .500 or qualify for the fricking NIT. The mask is off and the epic fail of CBH and the bumbler is obvious to all.
We are, barely, a mediocre Division II team. Disgraceful.
Huh?
Permanently? So the program will never recover? Don’t be ridiculous.
by jcgobruins on Dec 3, 2011 6:08 PM PST via iPhone app up reply actions
We bring in the Xmas tree.... UCLA up 30-19!
By the time we have the lights strung around the tree after the half, young Texans have turned it around to the tune of a 10 point lead. The Josh Smith and Reeves Nelson that had me so inspired last year & looking forward to “better times” look lethargic, uninterested & indignant to be benched. Shame on them, shame on today’s UCLA basketball. I am so bummed about the train wreck that has become UCLA sports. Thankfully I have three other offspring at three other universities to root for. I will never stop rooting for UCLA, but I find myself channel changing & giving up on our team in a way I never did before. Bummer.
i dont think i can take
anymore defeats from the money making sports. As a student and a lifelong Bruins fan this is just ridiculous. Whatever happened to our standard of excellence that UCLA WAS known for? This is bush league stuff from the athletics department. maybe its my fault because i get emotionally involved when i cheer UCLA on, but all this defeat is just too much.
so the ultimate question is
should we all just boycott UCLA athletics until regime change?
just got back from the Sports Arena
very disappointed after a bright start.
As I said in the game thread in response to one of DC’s comments – having to play DWear at the 3 was taken out of Howland’s hands somewhat by the fouls that Zeek and Norman picked up. Unfortunately, when we got the starting 5 back on the court in the 2nd half they weren’t able to get back to what they had been doing effectively in the 1st half – for some reason our defensive rotations were much slower, opening things up inside and also leading to open 3s when our defense tried to scramble back inside. Barnes made good adjustment; CBH didn’t.
I am also sick of Josh Smith. For all the complaints about the Wears being soft, Travis got his teeth knocked out, calmly picks them up and goes to get things fixed; whenever Josh feels he has taken a knock in the face he doubles over and completely takes himself out of the game. He never seems to respond well to adversity – whereas even Reeves SOMETIMES reacts to adversity by doubling his efforts.
Jerime tried hard to the end of the game. Tyler Lamb is showing himself to be a pretty versatile guy with some offensive moves and good court awareness. Zeek at least hit some shots – if he can be a consistent outside threat again, that will actually help him drive and assist. But with Parker out and Powell playing like a freshman, we are leaning a lot on three shooting guards to play the 1-3. This team needs to dominate inside to win games, and until Josh and Reeves get themselves together, I don’t see that happening. The Wears cannot carry this team.
I wonder
If Josh Smith can even dunk anymore.. besides maybe an Oreo into a glass of milk. My guess is probably not.
If I could be sure it were only milk & Oreos
The way he put on pounds, it sounds like it was dunking cheeseburgers into a vat of butter.
Clearly, there are issues at play here. It's not just what he's eating - bit. what's eating him?
Dude use to be motivated to do better. In fact, we all know the praise heaped upon him a year ago, when he seemed to be making strides. Joshua Smith publically stated at that time, that it became clear to him, that he needed to get in shape, and on his own accord, he got to work.
Then guess what? Last season happened. And all that entailed with day to day on our Varsity team. Then, all of a sudden, motivation is gone/lost. Is it the lack of wins? What in the world caused a 19 year old, who was excited about the compliments and results… how does his mindset change to worse? What happend or is happening in his mind? Hey, I’m not making excueses. I am saying, what’s the story? Has anybody heard anything? Even “laziness” comes from some unhealthy psychological, or emotional state.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Whatever the reason for Josh's slump and regression,
it is just disheartening to see because he has the potential to be one of the best centers in D1 basketball. If Josh came in weighing at around 270 right now, he would at the very least be a double-double machine. And on top of that, If he put on 10-20 pounds of muscle and lost 10-20 pounds of fat, how high would his ceiling be then?
And in all honesty, if Josh Smith’s 300+ pounds were in any way, shape, or form similar to Shaq’s 300+ pounds right now, his weight would probably be his, no pun intended, biggest asset.
I guess it's easy for us to say
But damn, what some of us more motivated people wouldn’t give to have his skillset and natural physical advantages. You can bet your ass I’d be in the gym every day knowing it would mean a 8 figure payday.
The rest of his fellow students have their noses buried in books this week only to face an uncertain job market when they graduate. Someone needs to provide that kid some perspective.
Josh was plenty big last year...+/- lbs within a few not an issue.
What is an issue is his mindset. Last year I saw an upbeat freshman, full of the wonder of what might lie ahead, grateful for his opportunity. Now I see a (let’s face it) overweight sourpuss with a bad attitude and a sense of entitlement. (Gee, sorry we are renovating Pauley to rival the venues of our opponents, and gee sorry you have to play in the relics of a once grand sports arena.) Look beyond the moment, Josh, quit listening to Reeves and his cohort Drew Gordon who quit the team, and is now a “somebody in the MW conference in NM” . There are plenty of Bruin bb alumni proud of their tradition who are still evolving (or maintaining) their super star status in the NBA
Be honest
You’ve been waiting for a while to say that
Please Fire Ben Howland
He is our biggest problem. Terrible coaching is the reason why this team is playing the way they are. Let’s start with his decision to play man to man the entire game. We don’t not have the athletes it takes to play man to man. Josh Smith is too fat and lazy to play man to man without getting in foul trouble and the Wear twins have some of the slowest feet I’ve ever seen.We have no point guard, which every team needs in order to succeed.No coach knows how to slow down and ruin their team’s flow better than Ben Howland. He calls some of the most pointless timeouts ever. Due to his terrible coach, Mike Moser and Chace Stanbeck are at UNLV lighting it up.Reeves does need to work on his attitude but I think he is just as frustrated with Howland as the rest of us.
Suckage Era: 2008 - and continuing
This is my consternation.
Suckage year? ok. I don’t like it, but ok.
But a Suckage Era? Oh Hell No. I won’t take it.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
Is there one site that has Bruin Basketball Archived Stats in a snap?
I’d like to know what kind of season(s) have we had when the 5th loss comes in the first week of December. Plus, I’d like a handy reference. I’m to slow, and don’t have the time to be looking at multiple sources. Does anyone have a favorite site for stats? Thanks.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
I'll continue to google around.
U-C-L-A Fight, Fight, Fight! Go Bruins!
NBA: Where Greed Happens. RIP 10/10/11.
W/L isn't the most useful stat necessarily
But a 5th loss this early in the season isn’t a good sign. However other stats will bear this out. Look for rebounds, assist/turnover, FG%, opponents FG%. Pretty sure all of those will show negative for the Bruins right now.
Assuming that we don't count Div 2 Chaminade
If we want to get to 20 wins in the regular season this year, we need to go 19-5 the rest of the way. Even with the Pac 12 being as bad as it has been, it’s hard for me to look at a team that’s basically 1-5 and project 19 wins the rest of the way with the same number of losses.
I figure the rest of the OOC slate will get the team to .500.
But looking at the rest of the schedule, I’m thinking 18 may be the high point.
W- Penn, EWU, Davis, Irvine
L- Richmond
6-6
@ Bay Area: split, 7-7
vs AZ: split, 8-8
@ USC: win, 9-8
@ OR: split, 11-9
vs UT/CO: win, 13-9
@ WA: split, 14-10
vs Bay Area: split, 15-11
“vs” USC: win, 16-11
@ SJU: lose, 16-12
@ AZ: split, 17-13
vs WA: split, 18-14
What really pisses me off is that I bought a lot of tickets this year too!
To the Cal, Stanford, and Oregon games on the road. And I’m not entirely sure they’re going to win any of those three!
See the media guide.
Must be football.
But man, Wisconsin & Michigan St basketball … remember when we used to play like that?
I don't get the round peg in square holes coaching
CBN and XCRN both share it. The system is apparently more important than the results.
Well, it seems to me that you either recruit kids that will fit/buy in to your system, or you adopt your system to play to the strengths your kids have.
A good coach puts his guys in position to succeed, because he knows how to maximize their strengths in ways to exploit the opponent’s weaknesses.
CBH has either lost his mind, lost his team, or both.
I don’t care WHO this program has lost to the NBA. I don’t see this kind of epic collapse from Duke, UNC, Michigan State…
We are getting dangerously close to watching what’s left of the Bruin legacy vaporize before our eyes.
I wretch every time I hear the phrase “once proud” to describe any of my favorite teams. We are on track for that very assessment, if not already.
by DrJay32 on Dec 3, 2011 6:28 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Another parallel between football and basketball
Both coaches went away from what they knew: Rick went away from the pro-set offense to the pistol. Howland went way from “Ben Ball defense” to…“who the hell knows what” ball.
It will be the undoing of both.
And both favor seniority over talent
by DrJay32 on Dec 3, 2011 6:43 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
This is why...
I’m not sure it’s just a coaching issue – I think a lot of this goes up the ladder. Because what are the odds both football and basketball engender this kind of coaching?
Not defending Howland, but he's far from being the only coach to do this.
That’s sadly a pretty common theme with coaches. Some know better, but it’s hardly unusual to find a coach go with seniority.
bruin hoops
they are unwatchable..lamb the best defender???? obese josh and walkabout reeves…kick nelson off the team…put smith on a weight program that ties to minutes…play powell…and ben use what you have…which is not much…to best advantage…they are bottom third pac 10…hope you dont lose your recruits…these are not bball warriors…disgusting
Incredibly weak atmosphere
My high school games had more energy in the crowd than this game. I knew that playing in the Sports Arena was going to be tough, but I was expecting at least the student section to provide some spark. Given that it’s finals week, I expected the student section to be small but at least spirited.
Unfortunately beyond a few moments when we went on our scoring run and outrage at some bad calls, you couldn’t feel too much energy from the students or anyone else besides the band. If I was a player I wouldn’t feel much of a homecourt advantage at all.
There was one awkward time when they had this “dance cam” where the camera would pan to the crowd and I guess watch people dance but everytime the camera focused on somebody nobody moved because it was so dead in there. Though they found some kids in there who seemed to enjoy being on camera so at least someone was having fun. Even when they did the Sarah Leonard’s watch giveaway there was maybe 3 rows of people cheering while everyone else kind of just watched.
And to really rub it in, even though there was absolutely nothing going on in the crapiseum, SC turned on their gigantic LED screen to flash an obnoxious “We are SC” graphic so that all of the UCLA fans walking to their cars could appreciate what it’s like to have an on campus stadium and a modern screen (I have to admit, that screen was really nice)
Your high school games
probably had better attendance. Better free-throw shooting, as well.
Roses are red, violets are blue...f*** $C.
Nothing to get excited about
https://twitter.com/#!/jordanadams1231/status/143207540983992321
For those who can’t see it, Jordan Adams says:
“my freethrow streak ended at 31 tonight i almostr cried when i missed it smh );”
hope he can keep this up when he gets here. We have NO shooters.
problem is guys on the bball team all fancy themselves nba players
it seems literally. methinks they’ve been under the assumption that they were locked out, sure have played like that. someone tell them the lockout is over.
Across The Face
Bizarre
As I wrote in my game review: Watching that roster of Bruins players today, it’s hard to believe they were recruited by the same guy who brought Russell Westbrook, Kevin Love, and Aaron Afflalo to Westwood.
I’ve always been pretty hard on Howland, but it used to be in the “I wonder whether he’ll win a national championship” way. But the team is an absolute mess right now, and has been for a couple of years running now. I was obviously rooting for Texas today, but I’ve always liked UCLA hoops and hope y’all get it figured out, and soon. Watching that team play listless basketball in a listless Sports Arena was depressing. And we won the game. I can only imagine how dispiriting it was on the other side.
Good luck in the Pac 12 this year.
76-37-5. Now GTFO.
The sky is falling!
At this point, I wonder if the mens hoops team isn’t doing us a favor by continuing to implode and expose the program for being in it’s current state of mismanagement &disarray.
I figure about 3-4 more losses in a row and there will be a significant increase in the calls for Chianti Dan’s removal, to the point where it might start actually becoming a real possibility in our lifetime.
We probably already lost any chance in hell of landing Shabazz…and now just praying we can hold on and not lose out on Kyle Anderson or Jordan Adams as the future of UCLA men’s athletics does it’s own version of the “beer & chicken letdown” a la the Boston Red Sox.
BREAKING NEWS
Reeves Nelson suspended indefinitely by CBH. At this point I agree with Coach.
pretty funny
That Reeves was suspended for “laughing & joking w/fans & teammates” at the end of the Texas game.
Guess that was the one time in his career where he would have been better off sulking.
“strageic sulking” needs to be a part of his vocabulary if he ever gets reinstated, which is looking like will never happen again. my guess is in 2 weeks he is off the team and out of UCLA basketball for good.
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