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(video) UCPD Shoots at UCLA Student Inside the Powell Lib.

Bruinsnation_tiny by Nestor on

UPDATE: Here is the video via KNBC. Amazing and surreal. I could never imagine this happening in the library while I was a student.

This is an amazing story. From the Daily Bruin (emphasis mine throughout):

UCPD officers shot a student several times with a Taser inside the Powell Library CLICC computer lab late Tuesday night before taking him into custody.

No university police officers were available to comment further about the incident as of 3 a.m. Wednesday, and no Community Service Officers who were on duty at the time could be reached.

At around 11:30 p.m., CSOs asked a male student using a computer in the back of the room to leave when he was unable to produce a BruinCard during a random check. The student did not exit the building immediately.

The CSOs left, returning minutes later, and police officers arrived to escort the student out. By this time the student had begun to walk toward the door with his backpack when an officer approached him and grabbed his arm, at which point the student told the officer to let him go. A second officer then approached the student as well.

The student began to yell "get off me," repeating himself several times.

It was at this point that the officers shot the student with a Taser for the first time, causing him to fall to the floor and cry out in pain. The student also told the officers he had a medical condition. First of all I cannot imagine being shot at by UCPD inside Powell Library.  And then you have shooting at someone who had already said he had a "medical condition"?

Check out some of disturbing quotes from students who were reportedly at the scene: "It was the most disgusting and vile act I had ever seen in my life," said David Remesnitsky, a 2006 UCLA alumnus who witnessed the incident.

As the student and the officers were struggling, bystanders repeatedly asked the police officers to stop, and at one point officers told the gathered crowd to stand back and threatened to use a Taser on anyone who got too close. And this: Laila Gordy, a fourth-year economics student who was present in the library during the incident, said police officers threatened to shoot her with a Taser when she asked an officer for his name and his badge number.

Gordy was visibly upset by the incident and said other students were also disturbed.

"It's a shock that something like this can happen at UCLA," she said. "It was unnecessary what they did." Holy crap. What is going on here? FWIW here is UCPD's side of the story reported in the DB article: As the student was screaming, UCPD officers repeatedly told him to stand up and said "stop fighting us." The student did not stand up as the officers requested and they shot him with the Taser at least once more. It'd be interesting to see if someone has a video of this incident up on YouTube.  Apparently per DB's report a student's camera phone may have recorded the incident. I sure hope someone gets a hold of that video.

At least based on the report the UCPD doesn't come off looking very good. Shooting taser gun at our students inside the Powell Library? That is insane

What is even more disturbing is some of the reactions I read on message boards in which some posters were outright gleeful about UCLA students being shot up on campus.

If any students are reading BN, please let us know what is going on around campus. This just sounds crazy. There better be a good explanation on the part of UCPD.

GO BRUINS.

This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of BruinsNation's (BN) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of BN's editors.

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Sounds like business as usual
on the students end. What on earth would possess UCPD to use a taser?

by Tydides on Nov 15, 2006 3:05 PM PST   0 recs

That's Not The UCLA
I remember....

by laertes on Nov 16, 2006 12:27 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

One more thing
which message boards are out there that have posters that are happy about this? I'd like to know in case I frequent them so that I know what kind of sick bastards I'm dealing with.

by Tydides on Nov 15, 2006 3:07 PM PST   0 recs

Hmm
Wonder why I don't post on BRO anymore...

by Tydides on Nov 15, 2006 3:34 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

to be fair
some posters in that thread are being sane and rational. But still some of reactions which you can discern from the title of the posts are just ... well you make the call.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 3:36 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

half of those tools
Probably didn't even go to UCLA. Otherwise they wouldn't take pleasure out of one of our students perhaps getting abused by cops on campus. I will hold my judgment until all the facts come out. The video is pretty chilling.

by bluestreet on Nov 15, 2006 3:37 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Okay...
I will premise this by saying that I do not like police officers (in general).  I find most of them to have lost perspective, and to have fallen in love with their position of authority...

That said, I do whatever they say, whenever they say to do it, precisely because of this stuff.  When a law enforcement goosestepper...er, I mean officer tells you to beat it, you leave.  That's it.  Because they will tase you!

Go Bruins...F@#$% Southern Cal... UCLA Fight Fight Fight!

by HomeBruin on Nov 15, 2006 3:39 PM PST   0 recs

I agree with that
but man this is our campus.

again I want to wait till all the facts come out. but this doesn't exactly create the most healthy environment on campus.

I also remember the UCPD being a little overzealous in reacting to celebrations for banner number 11 back in April 2 of 1995.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 3:41 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

UCPD?
Actually, I remember being shot in the ass by LAPD, not UCPD

by stevenucla on Nov 15, 2006 6:18 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Student Conduct Policy
The University of California Student Conduct Policy No. 102.16 begins "Failure to identify oneself to, or comply with the directions of, a University official or other public official, acting in performance of his or her duties. ..."
josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 2:23 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

102.00 Ground for Discipline
Follow by 105.00- "Types of Student Disciplinary Action"

Note the absense of "repeated tasering" as a "type of student disciplinary action" in Section 105.00.

by laertes on Nov 17, 2006 6:08 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Notice absence of a Police Manual
In this Code of Conduct for Students.

I guess you can ask the Police Department for one.

Or demand they do nothing long enough next time so they won't arrive early the next time someone calls for help.

josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 10:38 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Of Course
What part of the police department manual does the "repeated tasering a person while he's down" clause fall under?

Oh, and as for your false dilemma, not one is arguing that the police do nothing, I am with the UCPD up to even the first tasering, it's the subsequent use of force that I have a problem with.

by laertes on Nov 18, 2006 9:59 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

How many students were NOT tasered by the police?
Look at their behavior and learn how to act.
josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 18, 2006 11:52 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

You didn't address the concern
What about the subsequent taser shots?

by Tydides on Nov 18, 2006 12:01 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

The investigation will sort this out
The investigation will determine if the subsequent tasings were necessary. And there-in lies the reason why he should have (as all of us should) comply with the original requests. This country has a system of legal redress for our complaints.
josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 18, 2006 12:16 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

The investigation
will hopefully also determine if he was physically able to comply with said request. Again, agitating the police and giving the CSO's a hard time is not something I would personally do. And I can even see  a possible scenario in which the first shot was justified, but the subsequent ones occurred when the video shows that he was not posing a physical threat to the officers. Excessive Force.

by Tydides on Nov 18, 2006 12:59 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Non Sequitur
What does the fact that other students were not tasered have anything to do with the fact that this one was repeatedly tasered?

By your argument, because the majority of Iraqis were not hauled off and killed in the middle of the night, the Iraqis whom Saddam did kill had it coming and should have learned not to be so uppity.

by laertes on Nov 19, 2006 10:08 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Iraq brings us way off topic

You've gone completely off topic.

It all started with the kid's behavior and reaction to the policy.

The student bullied the library staff like a kid in the school playground, claimed mental issues, and said he was targeted. There weren't a dozen students doing this.  It was one individual.

The policy is colorless. Don't like the policy? Complain through proper channels. But don't give the library staff a hard time.  Let them do their job.

Let's curb aberrant behavior. At the end of the day, stop this behavior. Trust the staff who did their best to enforce the policy.

josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 28, 2006 1:00 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Could not tell much from the linked video
I don't understand either side. What compels an officer to taser a student? What compels a student with a medical condition to get into it with officer that carry weapons?

by cv on Nov 15, 2006 3:46 PM PST   0 recs

Sounds like
Bad judgement on both parties.  The student being escorted out should've known not to escalate the situation by yelling at the police officer, and the UCPD shouldn't have used a tazer either.  Using a baton on the other hand...

Just kidding.

by JWongUCLA on Nov 15, 2006 3:53 PM PST   0 recs

For what it's worth
I certainly wouldn't be trying to agitate the UCPD in that situation, but I also wouldn't expect to have a tazer used on me if I did. Quick trigger finger those guys have...did they get some new toys recently?

by Tydides on Nov 15, 2006 4:13 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

From what I can tell...
that video from KNBC appears to be a cameraman filming the play-back on someone's MacBook.

Doesn't anyone have any digital transfer software?  You'd think if anyone has this capability, it would be KNBC.

Regardless, the UCPD are total tools.  I can't blame them too much - anyone would grow to hate 18-22 year old kids after likely dealing with all the crap that goes on Thursday-Sunday, but that's absolutely uncalled for.  There's no need to tase the kid unless you're doing it just for fun.  Don't tell me three police officers or however many there are that are present there can't take care of one kid by themselves, without using a taser.

by CAJason80 on Nov 15, 2006 4:36 PM PST   0 recs

Well
First of all, it was night time, which means that only students with bruin cards are allowed to be in that area. That is for the safety of the students, who pull all nighters at powell and to prevent theft. He should have carried his bruin card or left at the first request. On the other hand shooting a taser at him is way excessive, especially when they  had more number on their side. I wonder what the administration will do?

by justwatching on Nov 15, 2006 4:36 PM PST   0 recs

yeap
it will be interesting to see how the admin. reacts to this.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 4:44 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

and BTW
it's great to see the measured and balanced responses here on BN. As I said my original post it will be interesting to see how the facts turn out in this story.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 4:46 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

i think that
all depends on 1) which scumbag attorney this guy retains to sue the school and the UCPD, and 2) how much traction any "special interest" group generates on the local media with this non-news event.

by kdout on Nov 15, 2006 5:02 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Question kdout
Can they at least sue the taser company?

by alcor805 on Nov 15, 2006 5:12 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

sure,
they can name the taser company as a defendant, but they won't get very far with their action against the taser company. Remember all those lawsuits against the gun manufacturers that got dismissed? I believe it would be the same thing here.

At the end of the day, all that the taser company did was make and supply a legal product to trained officers; the company had nothing to do with the officer's tactical decision to fire his taser. I can't see any credible judge, even in California, holding the taser company responsible for the independent actions of the officers, assuming the officers were wrong or at fault.

by kdout on Nov 15, 2006 5:21 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

kdout
if you want to generalize and call out "attorneys" as "scumbags" please try another site.

as I have mentioned already let's wait till the facts come out. Thank you.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 6:06 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

you're right...
sorry about that.

Just the idea that this guy will sue the school over this incident infuriates me.

by kdout on Nov 15, 2006 6:13 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

again
wait till all the facts come out.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 6:46 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

All I'm saying is
lets not pass judgment on the UCPD. That cell phone video doesn't show much, but you can clearly hear the officers yelling at him to stand up in the small room upstairs and then in foyer downstairs. Now,why this guy refused to stand up or show his ID or leave when asked to, the video doesn't show.

Also, people are assuming that this guy was a student. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't. We don't know that yet and if he is not a student or an alum, he does not belong inside Powell, using its computer. Last time I checked, while UCLA is a public university, certain of its resources are reserved for students and/or paying alums.

Finally, as to him shouting out that he has a medical condition, whether thats true or not, there is no way the officers could have known that. And if he does have a medical condition, he shouldn't go around provoking officers and then shouting out that he has a medical condition after the fact.

I'm not saying this guy deserved to get tazed and I'm not glad or happy that he did. But it seems like a little common sense on the part of this guy would have defused the situation before it even began.

by kdout on Nov 15, 2006 4:39 PM PST   0 recs

I Get Angry Watching That Video
I hate seeing someone scream like that at the hands of another human being. Those cops are lucky they didn't escalate the tension further by tasering another student who was getting in their face. 'Back up or I'll tase you.' makes the video even more annoying. Those cops deserve a beat down for treating the current Bruins that way.

by alcor805 on Nov 15, 2006 5:10 PM PST   0 recs

he was a student
the kid was most definately a student:

Statement from UCLA Acting Chancellor Norman Abrams About Incident at Powell Library:

"University police are investigating an incident late last night in which police took a student into custody at Powell Library. Investigators are reviewing the incident and the officers' actions. The investigation and review will be thorough, vigorous and fair."

And this from the UCPD website:

"... the student was not shot with a Taser; rather officers used the "drive stun" capability."

I haven't been this pissed in years.  I know exactly what alcor805 means.  That video makes me angry.

The officers are lucky they didn't get hurt.  I've been in riots that started for a lot less than what happened last night.

by bruinecon08 on Nov 15, 2006 5:16 PM PST   0 recs

Abrams Quote
Sounds like I'd label the incident "Failure to properly access the situation" and punish the officers.

by alcor805 on Nov 15, 2006 5:51 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

hmm...
That was 4 pm this afternoon when I cut and pasted this quote from the release on the UCPD website:

"... the student was not shot with a Taser; rather officers used the 'drive stun' capability."

Now, the same link at the UCPD website reads:

"A crowd gathering around the officers and Tabatebainejad's continued resistance made it urgent to remove Tabatabainejad from the area.  The officers deemed it necessary to use the Taser in a 'drive stun' capacity."

The UCPD release edited out any occurance of the word 'student.'  The victim is now referred to like this:

"When a person, who was later identified as Mostafa Tabatabainejad, refused to provide any identification ..."

by bruinecon08 on Nov 15, 2006 8:19 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Mostafa Tabatabainejad
so was he a student?

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 8:24 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

sorry
I read the release totally wrong.  The release still calls him a student.  My mistake.

by bruinecon08 on Nov 15, 2006 8:27 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

interesting
again this will be very interesting how admin. handles this. I don't recall reading any stories like this in which a UCLA student (if that's still a fact) was shot up inside our library.

I was talking to my wife about this tonight. She was  a UCLA student too. And both of us went down campus a lot to study after dinner hours. And lot of times we forgot our ID.  And kids can be silly. Students are teenagers after all. Sure they need to respect authority. But using multiple officers and taser guns on a UCLA student on our campus?

Again we need all the facts before making any conclusive judgment.

by Nestor on Nov 15, 2006 8:32 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

One phraseology suggestion
Nestor, your posts are great and invariably well thought and expressed.  But (there's always a but, isn't there?)  But the manner in which you express the notion that one must not make hasty conclusions sounds eerily like General Turgidson in "Dr. Strangelove."  "Ah, Mr. President, I'd like to reserve judgment until all the facts are in."

The thesis is sound, but the phrasing could be improved.  But I don't have all the facts, and I guess I'd like to reserve judgment until all the facts are in.

It would be interesting to review the police policy on using their phasers set on stun, or whatever they want to call it.  My experience in dealing with bureaucracies is that there is a written policy for everything.  If any Bruins are that interested, the policy should be available to the public, and maybe even on line.  A request under the Freedom of Information Act would undoubtedly get results, but it could take months and some of those responses have a lot of things redacted (invariably what you're really looking for.)

by Fox 71 on Nov 16, 2006 5:15 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Ridiculous
I made a facebook group.
http://ucla.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2217298211

When I called the UCPD they told me that same crap.  "He wasn't shot, he was stunned."  WHAT IS THE FRICKIN DIFFERENCE THERE??  I hate manipulative public relations on the part of a guilty party.  While he was hanging limp in the officers' arms they could have easily lifted him the rest of the way up to standing position.  And considering the fact that their job was merely to escort him out of the building because he forgot his bruincard, force was absolutely unecessary no matter how much shit he talked.
Complete side note:  We are a PUBLIC university.  UCLA pastes that "owned by all Californians" slogan everywhere it possibly can.  Since I first found out about the bruincard check I've thought it was absolutely ridiculous.  I remember once that my friend from Santa Cruz was staying with her sister, and we had to leave the library because she wasn't a student.  We were just sitting on the frickin' couch, studying!  Honestly!  That is a ridiculous rule in my opinion.
However, the main issue here is not a stupid rule, but two idiots whose incompetence should leave them job-less, in my opinion.

by jatteratious on Nov 15, 2006 5:42 PM PST   0 recs

Bill Hicks
Hicks did a stand-up bit about the Rodney King trial.  Went something like this:

Judge:  Officer Koon, how do you explain what happened on the videotape?

Koon:  Well ... I suppose it's all in how you look at it.

Judge:  Really ... Officer Koon ... Well, then how exactly should we look at it?

Koon: Well ... if you play the tape backwards ... you see us help Mr. King up and send him on his way.

Judge: Case Dismissed!

by bruinecon08 on Nov 15, 2006 6:27 PM PST   0 recs

Very Sad day for the alma mater
Great publicity for the school.  You tube has the vid, and so does www.crooksandliars.com. Seen some bad things on campus before - the dorm suicides in the 70's and 80's, the mysterious disappearance of the young San Diego Student (Willie?) in the 90's, the organ trafficking from a few years ago at the Med Center. We sometimes forget it is a big city unto itself sometimes.  

But it wasn't that long ago that all the doors in Powell were left open during bus hours - there were no dead ends in that place like there are now. The Coffee House was open til midnight or 1 am on weekends, and it had its collection of "regulars" there. There were transients who lived on campus in the early 80's - one who was  harmless, and another who behaved almost like a rabid dog, but never saw either one of them get treated like this guy did. I don't care that he was himself being histrionic in the beginning - he was, but that did not justify the repeated use of the taser, nor the apparent threats to other student witnesses who asked for badge numbers/names.  That is really beyond the pale.  

The Mad Bruin

by lostnacfgop on Nov 16, 2006 11:32 AM PST   0 recs

How did they decide to ask this guy for ID, anyway
So.. no one has commented on the fact that the guy's name is "Mostafa Tabatabainejad"?

And that therefore, he's probably visibly of middle eastern or arab descent?

The video I watched didn't really show him, so I don't know for sure, but jeebus, anyone think that maybe that played into the Kampus Kops decision? (And no, I'm not in favour of that, just speculating... the whole thing is terrifying and incredibly infuriating. Aren't cops of all varieties required to provide their info when asked? Hell, it's a damned good thing that they were caught on camera.)

by kanga on Nov 16, 2006 12:29 PM PST   0 recs

THANK YOU!
THANK YOU for pointing that out!!  I was going to, and was relieved that SOMEBODY else noticed that part of it.  It seems pretty key to me.

I'm not a UCLA person (I'm a senior at WashU St. Louis), but dammit, this is outrageous.  I suggest that the students shut down the campus until satisfactory action is taken against the police department.  It CAN be done.  We did it to get fair pay for our service employees, and you can do it too.

Also, if I remember correctly from the DB story, the kid had got up and was on his way out, under his own volition, when this all went down.  Were the cops on PCP or what???

by NBWUStL on Nov 16, 2006 12:55 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Someone Brought Up This Point
Wouldn't it be possible for officials to look up the campus student registry (with pictures) from a library terminal if you can verify someone's identity?

And if they don't have that functionality right now, shouldn't they have it?

by laertes on Nov 16, 2006 12:55 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

ID check
During my time at UCLA (2002-04), CSO's would conduct ID sweeps of night Powell; the timing varied, but when they occured, everyone in the library had to produce an ID (Bruincard).

by bruinhoo on Nov 16, 2006 2:57 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Other forms of IDs
At the University of Chicago, you don't necessarily have to have your student ID card to get into certain buildings.  Just remember your Student ID no. and have at least another photo ID. That seems reasonable, but it wouldn't work for sweeps.
josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 1:18 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

I guess you can't just tell anyone to F off
and not expect repercussions. The UCPD is due for some drastic changes.

by cv on Nov 16, 2006 3:06 PM PST   0 recs

UCLA Students Must be a Hardy Bunch
I went to college years ago, and--while I have spent some time in L.A.--I have never visited the UCLA campus. But color me impressed: while I was utterly disgusted by the brutal behavior of those cops, I was no less struck by the class and courage which several of those young students displayed. Rather than cower like sheep, they bravely took these out-of-line officers to task, demanding their badge numbers and thus putting them on notice that they would be held accountable for their actions. People who subscribe to the stereotypical notion that all Angelinos are shallow, self-serving, superficial airheads should see this video.

While I live in Seattle, I'm a Jayhawk from KU. But I just became a Bruin fan, too.  

Hats Off,

Robert

by Robert Murphy on Nov 16, 2006 10:13 PM PST   0 recs

ID Check
I never heard of an ID check when I went to UCLA (97-01).  I mean, it's a library at a public university.  I understand that there is a problem with theft, but it's someone's responsibility to watch after their stuff.  I was disturbed by that on top of the video.  

Oh, and lostnacfgop: "the mysterious disappearance of the young San Diego Student (Willie?) in the 90's"

Michael Negrete--he was from Long Beach, went to my high school.  

by Westwood Wizard on Nov 17, 2006 7:13 AM PST   0 recs

No, it's not a public library
the way your local public library is.  There are definitely ID checks during exam weeks at night, and this is to guarantee study space for UCLA students.

BTW, if you really think the libraries at UCLA are public, try going into the Law Library.

by stevenucla on Nov 17, 2006 9:07 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

I swear
the library of congress doesn't have the security presence at entrance that the UCLA Law library does.

by bruinhoo on Nov 17, 2006 5:09 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Well
if you go to the filing clerk at the Federal Court building, then you kind of get the idea why they have so much security at the law library.

For those who don't know: total freaks.

by stevenucla on Nov 17, 2006 5:29 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

The people filing that is
not the clerks.  They are nice.

by stevenucla on Nov 17, 2006 5:29 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

POLICE WEREN'T WRONG
I saw the video. How many times the police told the guy to "Get up"??? Please count and explain this guy's actions and how he just "couldn't get up".

You simply can't. But even take a step further: How did it escalate to the point of trouble?

Any intelligent person at the first sign of trouble would think: "I'm caught. No ID. Leave now." It's over. End of story.

There were choices for that student to make at that point. The best choice? Leave quickly and quietly.

But no.

It had to escalate.

And when it did, he should have known that (1) I'm making a fool out of myself, (2) I'm disturbing the other patrons in the library right now (for whatever reason), (3) These people (police) are serious, I better cooperate and leave now.

Nobody can justify why this guy started this trouble. Immaturity, spoiled nature, pride, ego. For WHATEVER reason, he felt he should stay. He just HAD to be in that library. And he couldn't leave quickly when he was told to.

It was his fault. That's where this whole story begins and ends.

josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 10:57 AM PST   0 recs

No need to shout
Per the video police was asking him to "get up" after tasing him.

I am assuming you have never been tased in your life so you have no idea whether it is possible for one to 'get up' right after being tased?

And please read the thread before offering your take here. Your argument has been offered up number of times in this thread and the one above.

by Nestor on Nov 17, 2006 11:26 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

You missed the message
I don't need to read other points to start a thread.  Unless you're the moderator and have made it a requirement, otherwise, thanks but "no thanks" to your "suggestion."

And you missed the point--Someone has to try very hard not listening in the first place to get into a position to be tased.  You should be asking him what made him make that choice.

You don't have an explanation as to why he behaved this way.  Because if you did, you'd shore up the weakness of the argument of being tased after the fact.

josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 12:24 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

actually
I'd advise you read the long thread before adding your take. If you read the home page it would be obvious to you that yes I am the moderator of this blog.  

And yes the take you offered has already been offered. And we usually don't like seeing same repetitive takes once it's has been offered up multiple times in the same thread - specially from someone who is posting on this blog for the first time in this blog. This is a real community and I'd advise you be respectful when talking to others. Thanks.

by Nestor on Nov 17, 2006 12:29 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

If you insist...
I can move these posts under a specific thread.

Then, I was hoping you'd at least address the questions I asked in the thread as a courtesy as well.

josephbbl

by josephbbl on Nov 17, 2006 12:47 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

That's why
you read the other posts in the thread, because your questions have been answered many times over already. We have heard every point of view possible already in the two threads on this topic.

So as a "courtesy", please read the rest of this thread and the other one as N said, because no one likes to repeat themselves. It's irritating.

by Tydides on Nov 17, 2006 12:54 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Already addressed
your specific point has already been raised and addressed in the thread above.

by Nestor on Nov 17, 2006 12:55 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Not only that
But the guy was on his way out when he was grabbed by the UCPD and yelled out "don't touch me". There is no reason for him to be escorted out by the police like some criminial, when he was already on his way out. It is embarrassing, in front of the other students, some of which probably knew him. I had the same thing happen to me at the Rose Bowl, though that was the Pasadena PD. I was getting kicked out because some drunk bastard behind me was throwing the halftime cards and they thought it was me. The officer grabbed my arm to escort me out in front of everyone. It is demeaning, and I asked him to stop. So of course, he got rougher and started pushing me and grabbing my collar. Some of these guys are itching for some action and are just waiting for an excuse to lash out. You taser people to incapacitate them, for 5-15 minutes. How can you ask someone to stand up once you've incapacitated them??!! I too am disgusted and angry.

by tasser10 on Nov 18, 2006 12:47 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

OK
Clearly, everyone here needs to understand how Tasers (not Tazers) work.  There are two completely different modes, one is when you shoot it like a gun, two probes come out, and the battery is completely discharged.  That is when the subject is completely incapcitated.

The other is when you use it like those stun gun women keep in their purses.  Painful, but doesn't incapcitate.  And yes, that's why there's a difference between being shot and stunned by a Taser.

I'm not saying I defend the use of Tasers, but I do defend the fact that some people commenting on this situation are definitely jumping to unsubstantiated conclusions.  And please stop quoting the Lancet article--that really did not apply to what happened here.

by stevenucla on Nov 18, 2006 3:23 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Okay Folks
I think we have exhausted this topic to death folks.

Let's now all wait till the investigation is over. A thorough investigation we hope.

Meanwhile lets get back to the games.

GO BRUINS.

by Nestor on Nov 18, 2006 4:12 PM PST to parent up   0 recs

Tasered student
I hope the student sues and gets millions. I hope the 'officers' that tasered him are criminally charged. I hope the imbecils posting on this site who are so divorced from their own humanity, and any shred of sanity, look in the mirror and see the Nazi thugs they are for thinking that a student deserves to be tasered for being an 'ass.'

I am a reentry student and finishing in Dec with all As...then moving out of this country.

If I had a billion $ and UCLA needed a dollar to stay afloat I wouldn't give it...and just for the unbelievable arrogance that has been displayed in all of this. That those thugs in the uniforms who couldn't even spell this kids majors (have you ever SEEN cop writing...they're all a bunch of donut munching nimrods) and they threatened to taser other students for asking for their badge # etc..and the jerks on that site think that is fine.

I don't owe the police any respect...they are thugs. And the people in this country are stupid sheeple giving away all of their rights. Those cops had no right to put their hands on the kid when he was walking out of the door with the backpack over his shoulder.  

I hope those cops get what they deserve.

by not divorced from my own humanity on Nov 18, 2006 12:08 AM PST   0 recs

Exhibit A
This is the kind of baseless name-calling rant that we are trying to avoid. Those who sympathize with the student and those that sympathize with law enforcement may not agree on the details of the incident, but at least the vast majority of them presented their points of view in a clear and concise manner based on a logical argument, and so I could accept it as legitimate discussion of the topic.

By painting those who do not agree with your point of view with a broad brush without taking the arguments into account and instead resorting to infantile name-calling (like Nazi thugs and "donut munching nimrods"), your post is reduced to intellectual garbage. If you have something of substance to contribute to the discussion, then it is welcome, otherwise, keep the name calling to a minimum or take your garbage posts elsewhere. Thank you.

by Tydides on Nov 18, 2006 12:52 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Your lack of education is showing
You should find out more about Nimrod before using it as a derisive term.  A person who thinks "Nimrod" is someone to be ashamed of probably things the Trojans won the war, or that the Trojan Horse is a symbol of a glorious victory.  My guess is that your education, and in your case that is a pure assumption on my part, was acquired closer to Figueroa than Westwood Blvd.

But otherwise a great post.  Insightful arguments, well supported by logic, and expressed in a very intelligent manner.

by Fox 71 on Nov 18, 2006 10:14 AM PST to parent up   0 recs

Please Fox 71
I use nimrod all the time and will not apologize for using the term wheneven I think it is approp.

Lets stop taking ourselves a little too seriously. After all this is a blog for sports. It's ok to let our guard down once in a while.

by Nestor on Nov 18, 2006 10:26 AM PST to parent up   0 recs