Has Karl Dorrell Really Cleaned Up The "Underbelly?"

by Ajax on Sep 22, 2007 12:07 AM PDT in Football Comment 15 comments

When attempting to defend their indefensible position that Karl Dorrell has achieved at least some progress during his tenure at UCLA, Dorrellistas invariably cite to Dorrell's cleaning up of the football program's "underbelly" that grew out of control towards the end of the Bob Toledo era. Of course, I don't recall Toledo ever hiring buddies that had been arrested multiple times for packing firearms, but I digress.

Dohn has an interesting, but not surprising response to one of his readers questions presented for his ongoing Q&A feature:

Matt Stevens (former Bruin QB, does color during the game) said in an interview this week that Karl confided in him during the summer that he was having trouble getting this group of players to work hard. How does this team's work ethic in practice compare to what you have seen when covering other programs? Do you see Karl doing anything at practice to motivate his players to work harder? How does the tempo of the practices compare to what you have seen elsewhere (a lot is made of how much USC's 'Competition Tuesdays' keeps people working hard to maintain their positions)?

Let's see, when I worked in Connecticut, I covered a pair of Division I-AAs, so there is no comparison there. When I was in New Jersey, I did not cover a team on a daily basis, so no comparison there. As for as what is done at practice, I am not at liberty to say. That is part of being allowed into a closed practice. And on the competition aspect, it would be a bigger factor is there were backups more qualified to challenge for a starting spot.

I am moving to strike Dohn's answer as non-responsive.

I did not happen to catch that comment from Stevens. If anyone else happened to hear that interview, please chime in. If true, it completely contradicts all of the crap we heard in the pre-season about how hard these kids have worked and how committed they are to the goal of taking this program to the next level. And that all falls squarely at the feet of coach "make-a-move." Seems to me that Dorrell has grown an underbelly of his own. Yet another example of why this cruel experiment must be terminated now.

Dan Guererro: We trust that you are making preparations to jettison this fraud when the time is right.

Go Bruins!

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Very interesting

and I agree.

It reminds me a bit of the old argument surrounding the Fifth Amendment. I think we can say that Dohn "took the Fifth" here.

We all have to agree, especially us lawyers, that yes, the Fifth Amendment is a very good thing and no one should be made to testify against themselves. It is up to the State to prove that you robbed that bank.

On the other hand, and let's just admit it, folks, when someone takes the Fifth in answer to question like, "Well, did you do it" somewhere in your mind, you are probably thinking, "Yep, he did it. If he didn't do it, he would just say no."

I know this is not fair to the Fifth Amendment but the part of my brain which is not grounded in legal theory just thinks, "Answer the damn question!"

This is not in any way an excuse but it sounds to me like Dohn is just too nice and he may not want to get barred from practice next year if he spills the beans.

By now, I think it is clear that Dorrell is not a good motivator and there were plenty of reports about how poorly our practices have gone. And, yes, Dohn, you can compare the work ethic of teams from different Divisions. Either a team works hard in practice or they do not, whether they are a Pop Warner team or the Miami Dolphins. Working hard is not the same as size and skill level.

In this case, I suspect we know our answers based on Dohn's "taking the Fifth."

by Barnes2JJ on Sep 22, 2007 4:49 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I guess I don't get it.

The column isn't exactly live TV. Rather than not answer the question, all Dohn had to do was not ask himself the question. And if he wasn't going to answer it and was obviously the case, why did he even bother printing it?

Is there a deeper meaning? Or is Dohn as stupid as CTS? Does he think he actually answered the question?

Here's another question for Dohn's Q & A. Why should Bruin fans have any more passion for their team than their head coach, Sleepy (aka Dopey)?

by Fox 71 on Sep 22, 2007 7:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Who's in charge here?

Isn't it Dorrells job to push these guys to work hard? Isn't it Dorrells job to motivate his players? When I hear comments like these, that he's having trouble getting these guys to work hard, it makes me wonder how much control does he really have. Both of my boys play high school FB. I guarentee they know who's charge, and they respond to it. When I hear Christian Taylor come out and say things will be different, well kudos to Taylor. But where is Dorrell in all of this? That's his responsibility.

I remember Toledo forming a players counsel when things were getting out of control. It's not up to the players. It's the head coaches job. While I think players need to hold each other accountable, ultimately it's the coach's job when things are not going right. For me, it gives the appearance that he (KD) is not in the forefront, but sitting back waiting for something to happen. There's no reason, especially with a large group of seniors, that this should even be a discussion. But here we go again with another story about UCLA football players not giving their best. Amazing!

by NickBruin on Sep 22, 2007 7:56 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Dang! All you people are up already?

already dumping on Sleeping Beauty while he's still catching some zzz's prior to his showcase game -- the game his supporters say will prove to you that he has lost none of his coaching prowess.

by bluegold on Sep 22, 2007 8:19 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

"if there were backups more qualified"

I guess Dohn is telling us that KD's 2nd and 3rd string suck. That's too bad, because these less than "qualified" individuals will be our starters next year. So typical of this administration.

As a compassionate soul, I vote to fire KD immediately and put him out of his misery.

by bornagainbruin on Sep 22, 2007 8:30 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

You know

It's kind of hard to motivate your players when you yourself spend the summer golfing instead of scheming and preparing for the biggest season in your career.

F U Dorrell.

by Nestor on Sep 22, 2007 9:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Seriously

What is Karl Dorrell's greatest strength as a coach? What is he known for? What is his philosophy? What is UCLA's identity? What are KD's teams known for? When we take the field on Saturday, what is Dorrell trying to get done?

I asked these questions my buddy, a UCLA fanatic, during last week's game. He couldnt answer. I wonder if Mannequin Karl knows?

by BillyZoom on Sep 22, 2007 9:25 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Billy holding the fort at BZ

great questions. A couple of other good questions:

Could Dorrell win or even challenge for the national championship with SuC's team? LSU's? Florida's? Oklahoma's? Dorrell cultists constantly point out how we should be patient with Dorrell because he doesn't have the talent yet, even in his 5th year and 100% his recruits, because he had to rebuild a disaster of a program. Just wait until 2010 when 2008 recruits start to play!!
Has any other college program with a head coach opening EVER inquired about stealing Dorrell, the head coach of one of the marquee programs in the country? How about an NFL team? One would think that if Dorrell were any good as a coach that he would be easy to poach because of the low salary we are paying. Dorrell cultists are quick to point out how lucky we are to have a coach of Dorrell's caliber given how little we pay him ... well if that were true and if he is such a good coach, it would be very hard to keep him. Turns out, it's hard to get rid of him because no one wants him.
Does Dorrell's name come up ever as one of the top coaches in the country? We know the answer to that ... not only does he not, but Dorrell's name comes up when analysts talk about one of the worst coaches in the country.

editor, DumpDorrell.com ... formerly posted as DumpDorrell

by BruinCore on Sep 22, 2007 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

UCLA's (lack-of) Identity

For the few weeks after last year's USC win and before the Nut Bowl collapse I thought we had finally found an identity as a fast, athletic, and aggressive team led by the defense. This attitude was epitomized by Reggie Carter's famous words after sacking Booty: "Get used to it." Unfortunately we could not sustain this...

by MarcoTheBruin on Sep 22, 2007 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

As they say

the silence is deafening. The reader asked a direct and specific question and all he got back was some unrelated anecdotes. It's rare to see this kind of evasiveness. Maybe in politics, but in a question about football practice? Surely Dohn's confidentiality agreement does not extend to "were the players practicing hard"? I would have to think that's right up there with hard hitting questions like "was it cold yesterday"? I'm sick of the media throwing this guy softballs and dancing around the obvious. This ain't the ballet, and it's time to ask the tough questions to KD. I know, he'll probably give us unintelligible nonsense back, but once again, the silence will be deafening.

by Tydides on Sep 22, 2007 10:17 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Dohn

I have been saying this for a while. The guy is decent compared to his peers (which is not saying much). But he still often fails to ask the right questions and skirt around the main issues, and often maintains just a caustic attitude towards the UCLA fanbase. I have been very disappointed with his football coverage in recent months. I expect better from him because based on his previous work, it seems like he can do much better job of being candid and frank.

by Nestor on Sep 22, 2007 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

There is something unsaid in his writing. He has mentioned many times the issues other reporters are having with Morgan Center and the football program regarding writing anything negative. Morgan Center is withholding access to those reporters. Dohn is quick to point out he has never experienced that himself. However, his consistent avoidance of key issues raises many questions. Key things that come to mind:

The Scott affair - what did Dorrell know and when did he know it?! Dorrell specifically avoided that issue and Dohn did not call him on it, only Chris Foster of the LA Times did, and he is new to the beat.
Why did Dorrell leave in starters at the end of a blow out loss, risking injury to starers and CAUSING injuries to starters?? Dohn is not asking the obvious question. Now there is a video of the hit Olson took with less than 8 minutes remaining and Utah already up 44-6. Was this the hit that gave him the concussion??
Fan disapproval. Dohn has been very politic about fan disapproval on his site, and with us at DD in his emails in the past, asking us to tone it down. Seriously, the response that he gave regarding who wants Dorrell gone did not surprise us, so much that we didn't think it worthy of reporting. But our numbness towards Dohn's position clouded for us the fact that what he wrote said a lot to everyone else. Thanks for printing it.

editor, DumpDorrell.com ... formerly posted as DumpDorrell

by BruinCore on Sep 22, 2007 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dohn Answered Q About Leaving Starters In

He said he could not get a straight answer from anyone (coaches), but that he thought it was to "teach the players a lesson". I guess we didn't do enough growing, grinding, learning during the past 4+ years...

Link:
http://www.insidesocal.com/ucla/2007/09/answers_part_ii_1.html#more

by MarcoTheBruin on Sep 22, 2007 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Interview Link, Dorrell's NFL Approach Not Working

I was the one who posted the question in Dohn's weekly Q&A session on his blog. Yes I feel that he avoided the specifics and the general intent of my question, "What does Karl Dorrell do to motivate his players?". I am beginning to suspect that the central lesson of the Karl Dorrell debacle is that an NFL approach to football does not work in college. (1) Players are not paid so coaches need to do more to motivate players. (2) Practice time is limited so the game plan needs to be less complex.

The interview with Matt Stevens is from hour 1 of the Joe McDonnnell experience heard on KLAC AM 570 on 9/17. I compiled a transcript of the section of the interview that I am referring to in the question to Dohn.

Tim Cates (16:26): You play 12 games a year and then spend an entire offseason in the weightroom working out five days a week, twice a day, running, doing stairs, practicing, hell week, two-a-days. How do you not get up for 12 games in a season?

Matt Stevens (16:40): Well I mean and that is the point right there. Karl Dorrell I mean he was having problems even before the year. He had mentioned before: "Hey you know what, these guys don't practice perfection". I gave him an article about Joe Thomas, he was the second round pick in the draft, the big dominant left tackle that went to Cleveland and he says that he practiced perfection. UCLA you go out there and sometimes you see some balls dropped, guys not really hustling around. Well that is not going to get it done."

You can download the complete interview from:
http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18227/1h/cchannel.download.akamai.com/18227/podcast/LOSANGELES-CA/K LAC-AM/070917%20JMC%20Hour%201.mp3?CPROG=PCAST&MARKET=LOSANGELES-CA&NG_FORMAT=sports&SIT E_ID=727&STATION_ID=KLAC-AM&PCAST_AUTHOR=AM570_KLAC&PCAST_CAT=Arts_and_Entertainment& ;PCAST_TITLE=AM570_KLAC_SHOWS

by MarcoTheBruin on Sep 22, 2007 11:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs