Eight More Games To Go
Guest post from Bruin Blue. Again it is always good to get this perspective from long suffering UCLA alums who are sick and tired of constant let downs and mediocrity from underachieving UCLA football program. GO BRUINS. -N
I am not looking forward to the rest of this season. It's not going to be pretty, whatever happens. In my mind, there is no way that Karl Dorrell is going to go quietly, in any sense of the word. His team has enough talent; and there are enough beatable teams left on the schedule, for him to make a real bid to keep his job. This isn't Ohio State or Alabama; we don't fire coaches who go 9-3. So this is not going to be a lame-duck season for Dorrell by any means, despite the absolutely woeful loss to Utah. As it was with his mentor, Terry Donahue, UCLA "bounces back" from losses, because the talent is better than the coaching. Their teams sort of plod along from game to game and sometimes they play well, sometimes they don't. There is usually no real improvement or learning curve; and they don't helpfully implode like you sometimes see happen at better programs where the disappointment of early losses is so great that all sorts of pressure and internal strife sets in.
I'm not rooting for the team to lose; but it wouldn't upset me too much. I know that the future of UCLA football is pretty bleak as long as Dorrell hangs around. I can't see us winning more than six games next year if we're lucky. So why should it excite me if we somehow manage to grind out 9-3, with the schedule so much in our favor, and a talent edge on most Pac-10 teams? Can Dorrell get to 9-3 and save his job? I think it's certainly possible, IF UCLA can win at Oregon State. That is the key game in Dorrell's career. If he loses that one, then he'd have to run the table going into the USC game to get his nine wins. If we lose at Corvallis, I could see a six- or seven-win season. But since I'm very familiar with bad UCLA coaches hanging on and saving their jobs way past the time that they should have lost them, I'm expecting a win up there. Then we beat the Irish, and we're 5-1. And the L.A. media, so loath to criticize Dorrell, would certainly be full of "redemption" stories, about how well we have done since Utah. And you know that Dorrell is going to scratch and claw for this job. I am convinced that he actually thinks that he has done a great job here, even this year. I am also convinced that he would play the race card if necessary. That's why it's so important that if we don't have the big year that we were expecting, we have one that is unequivocally bad, so as to leave no doubt what we must do. Of course, the very fact that we have to weigh and parse each season to see if it is bad enough to get the coach fired should really be all the proof necessary that he is not the man for the job. Really good coaches don't weave and bob and do just enough to keep their jobs--not at big-time programs like UCLA.
I totally agree with Nestor that the Washington game shouldn't have meant anything as far as whether Dorrell should go or stay, but of course it does. Any win UCLA can eke out is going to give ammunition to those who want Dorrell around for at least another year. Saturday night, I heard someone mention one of the most bogus statistics in the world--the fact that "Dorrell is the only UCLA football coach to take them to four straight Bowl games in his first four years." Now, there's one for the books. The fact is, of course, that the great Red Sanders couldn't have taken UCLA to four straight Bowls if he had gone undefeated every year, because of course the only Bowl which UCLA was eligible for back then was the Rose Bowl, and there was a no-repeat rule for conference champions put in early in his tenure. Prothro would have had to have won the conference every year; so would Rodgers, since the only Bowl that a Pac-10 team was eligible for then was the Rose Bowl. Vermeil only stayed two years. So in fact the only two coaches who could have theoretically matched that "achievement" would have been Donahue (back when there were very few Bowls) and Toledo (more Bowls, but not close to the 28 or so there are now). Also, when did they start inviting six-win teams to Bowl games--a few years ago? Dorrell "earned" Bowl berths by going 6-5, 6-6, and 7-5. Of course, all those Bowls were third-tier, and he lost all of them. But, hey; that doesn't stop the announcers from pointing it out as a "positive" of the Dorrell regime. With that kind of uninsightful, buddy-buddy journalism in this city, you can bet that any win over anyone is going to be described as a major credit to our head coach. So I still believe, much as I don't want to, that there is better than a 50-50 chance that Dorrell is going to be around next year. Now, if we lose to the Beavers, then it's a wholly different story.
I'm sure everyone realizes that Dorrell's dream of being a head coach in the NFL is essentially gone. No owner, no matter how stupid or desperate, is gong to hire this guy. So he needs this job more than ever, or he is likely never to be given a head coaching opportunity again--at least not at any significant program. It's all or nothing, now; and you can bet that Dorrell, who has shown a perfect willingness to blame players and assistants for his own failures; and to actually tell one journalist that "because of his race, he is not sure if he'll ever be given enough opportunity to succeed here," is never going to just walk away from it, or ever admit that he didn't do the job here.
It is interesting to see that very much like Steve Lavin, Dorrell attempts to buffalo the fans and media into thinking that when we lose it's because the players weren't "up" for the game, and that he's not sure why, having done everything he could. Lavin would always say things like that: "I told the team that this opponent was dangerous, but they just weren't focused; I wish I knew why." The fact is that motivation is highly overrated as a reason for winning or losing college football or basketball games. Yes, sometimes it can matter; but mostly it's about fundamentals and schemes. UCLA lost to Utah primarily because their coaches had no answer for the Utah offensive schemes, which sought to neutralize the Bruins' superior athleticism and speed by spreading the field, and letting the quarterback read the defense at the line of scrimmage, often throwing short passes to the backs designed for short but effective gains, and almost never testing the Bruins' speed by going wide. That's pretty much what Washington did to us last year at Seattle, and it's the formula for moving the ball on this defense. Last Saturday, Washington again moved the ball effectively, but Locker doesn't yet have the experience of Stanback; and of course this time UCLA's offense, and primarily its superior athletes, were able to wear down the mediocre Husky defense. Rest assured that Willingham will use the same strategy at Seattle next year, and should get the win that time--which Dorrell, if he's still around, will of course attribute to the team not being sufficiently self-motivated.
As we all know, the second part of the necessary equation--hiring the right head coach here--must be given every attention. I am not at all cheered by the names I see people on other sites bring up. The answer is not the untested SC assistant Sarkasian. It's not some slightly-above-average middle-rung coach like Leavitt or Patterson, neither of whom is as good as Carroll, Erickson or Tedford. It's not Leach, who gave up another 49 points last week, and who would never stop the Pac-10 offenses. It's not Jim Mora, Jr., who lost control of his team in Atlanta, and who has really not proven much of anything anywhere, except that his name is familiar. It's certainly not Dennis Green, who has all sorts of personal baggage, and who is a lousy coach besides. And who is this NFL assistant who Mike Waldner (the guy who supported Harrick and Lavin all those years) says that the rumors have Guerrero possibly choosing as our next coach? I don't want an NFL assistant, even someone like Musgrave, because he hasn't shown what he might do as a head coach. Why is it so difficult to understand that UCLA needs someone who has proven himself as a head football coach? Yes, all head coaches start as assistants, but UCLA is not the testing ground for their abilities. Ben Howland was a proven winner in a major conference, and a sure bet to be successful here. Red Sanders was coach of the year in the SEC at lowly Vanderbilt. Tommy Prothro had taken Oregon State to two Rose Bowls, and had a Heisman Trophy winner. Vermeil was admittedly a bit of a gamble, except that he was a Stoops-like assistant who had been championed by Prothro and George Allen. Otherwise, all our great coaches in football and basketball had been very successful as head coaches, albeit some (like the Wizard) at smaller schools.
I said last week that I was not thrilled at the "usual suspect" prospects that we might be considering. So I decided to raise my standards; and here is a list (in no order) of some people that we should actually at least sound out about their availability. Why not think big, for once?
1. Urban Meyer. Yes, the Urban Meyer who is at Florida, making all that money. Meyer isn't a Southerner; he's not wedded to that region. He is a great admirer of John Wooden. Obviously, we can't pay him what Florida does, but what if we finally decide to really ante up for a coach? Is it impossible that he would consider leaving the SEC for the excitement of coaching against other wide-open teams in this league? The SEC really isn't nearly as competitive as it is supposed to be, with only LSU and maybe ultimately Saban's Alabama as a threat to Florida. Here, Meyer could go against the USC juggernaut. I realize it's a major longshot, but why not ask him?
2. Mark Richt of Georgia. A young, dynamic coach who has had more than notable success. Southern background; but still might he be interested in a new challenge. UCLA can recruit better talent than Georgia, believe it or not.
3. Bill Cowher. He may not want to coach again, but who knows? He may be more of a motivator than a technician, but he has proven his ability to win. He obviously chooses great staffs, witness how many of his assistants got head jobs. He would be a great antidote to Pete Carroll.
4. Jon Gruden. I have always liked him as a coach, and think he would be a great college mentor. The problem is that he's have to be fired at Tampa Bay first, and it looks like he's putting that franchise on the right track again now.
5. Jimmy Johnson. Okay, that's a real longshot, but we could ask him, at least.
My point is that we need to hit a homerun with this next hire, like Arizona State did with Erickson. We need someone who is an almost sure bet to take this program to another level. We do not need a "pretty good" coach from somewhere else, or an ex-pro coach whose only cachet is simply the fact that he was in the NFL. The NFL is not some rarified realm, and most of the coaches who have come to college from there have done little--consider Al Groh, Chan Gailey, Bill Callahan. Carroll is the only exception. The man we hire should be a proven winner; or if such is simply unavailable, the most dynamic assistant coach out there.
Well, that's a lot to ponder, as the season continues. We'll see if this all bears fruition, or if we will be forced to go through all of this again next year.
- BruinBlue
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of BruinsNation's (BN) editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of BN's editors.
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54 comments
Comments
Home Run Post
BruinBlue is correct: If we go 9-3, even if we lose 100-0 to SuC, we will go to a bowl and, even if we lose the bowl, it will be enough to save the Sleeper's job. And then we will suck next year and have to hear from the Dorrellista apologists about all of Dorrell's bowl games, his amazing 10-2 and 9-3 seasons, and oh, what this year could have been without all the injuries....
This is the nightmare scenario.
by Barnes2JJ on Sep 25, 2007 5:30 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
No, NEXT year is a REBUILDING year.
by Chandler on Sep 26, 2007 12:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here is a KD record no one will break
by bluegold on Sep 25, 2007 7:00 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
maybe he will go down the lavin route
by bruinbunz on Sep 25, 2007 10:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure
by CAJason80 on Sep 25, 2007 7:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
SEC
And as for Ole Piss putting on 24 on Florida tells us a little more about UF than about Ole Piss.
Georgia with its joke offense would have a hard time finishing as a top-3 team in the Pac-10.
SEC is what it is - an overhyped product courtesy of BSPN.
by bluestreet on Sep 25, 2007 7:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting list
- Steve Spurrier: He will get at least 20 times the talent at UCLA than he gets at USC. Can you imagine what the Bawl Coach can do with QB talents coming out of So Cal high schools?
- Steve Mariucci: I think his style (ala Gruden) will work really well at college environment, specially at a school like UCLA.
by bluestreet on Sep 25, 2007 8:02 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Spurrier would be interesting
Mariucci, I am not that sold on. I do think he is a fine coach, better than KD for sure. But my last memory of his coaching the 49ers is of a pure dorrelian moment, and in the playoffs no less - down by quite a bit, ball near midfield with a minute left in the 1st half, taking a knee rather than try throwing to TO (or any sort of offenseive action). the decision essentially indicated his giving up on the game, and the season, and was fired by the 49ers soon after.
by bruinhoo on Sep 25, 2007 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Richt Of Georgia Would Be A Fine Pick
Bill Cowher is an interesting possibility; I've always liked his intensity and he's got a Super Bowl ring so the guy knows how to win. Whether he could adapt to the college game might be another question entirely....
As a footnote, Ive always wondered what the deal was with Pepper Rodgers. Even as a 7th grader back home in Iowa, I remember the 1973 season vividly and how we were rolling up points on most teams. Even though we got hammered by the Cornhuskers in Lincoln that season, I thought for sure that we'd beat USC and FINALLY get to the Rose Bowl. As you can imagine, I was pretty crushed watching that game on TV and us going down, 23-13. Is that what ultimately cost Rodger his job?
by Minnesota Bruinfan on Sep 25, 2007 8:40 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You are thinking of
by bluestreet on Sep 25, 2007 8:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bowl Games
by Bruin77 on Sep 25, 2007 8:50 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
"first four years - bowl eligible"
Looking through the football media guide this morning, I was actually surprised that Red Sanders is the only former coach that would have had bowl-eligible teams over his first 4 seasons (every one of his teams would have been bowl eligible, in fact - 1949-57).
To be fair, Prothro did have one losing season in his first four (1968, 3-7-0). However, the fact that in his other 5 seasons, his teams finished no worse than 2nd in conference, and had 4 top-10 rankings allows me to forgive him for this fault.
While the state of early UCLA football may make it an unfair point for comparison, William Spaulding had teams whose records would make them bowl eligible during his first 5 years (1925-29).
by bruinhoo on Sep 25, 2007 9:00 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Great post
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Sep 25, 2007 9:27 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Is there really a good HC candidate out there?
by Peter Petersen on Sep 25, 2007 9:28 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think Chris Peterson's available
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Sep 25, 2007 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bad > Mediocre
Of course, I still want this team to have a great season. I'd love for them to win out and get to the Rose Bowl. I really want that to happen.
But if given the choice between a bad season and a mediocre season, I'd take the bad season -- at least we'd know for sure that Dorrell would be gone, and that change would be coming.
The worst thing that can happen is 8-9 wins, enough to save Dorrell's job.
by gilbert on Sep 25, 2007 9:31 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Two points
But more important, 9-3 or 8-4 or 7-5 might be enough to keep Dopey, I mean Sleepy in his job. That is why it was important to have fired him the day after the Utah game. The timing would never have been better.
He will, of course, lose some more games. I would not at all be surprised to see ND's first win come against us. Bruins - we cannot buy into the "Oh, you can't fire a coach during the season" baloney. Of course you can! You can and should fire an inept leader at the earliest possible moment. The worst case scenario is four loss season, with this pathetic loser keeping his job. We are then screwed for yet another season.
In my opinion, nothing is more important to the success of the UCLA football program in both the short run and the long run than to replace this coach.
by Fox 71 on Sep 25, 2007 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fox, You Won Me Over
As long as Dorrell is our coach, his proclivity for unfathomable losses will undermine any chance we have to make anything more than an occasional visit to the upper echelon of college football.
by Bruin77 on Sep 25, 2007 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
National Championship?
We are screwed.
by joeb on Sep 26, 2007 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice job Blue
by Ajax on Sep 25, 2007 10:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
big winners at small schools
by Ian on Sep 25, 2007 11:02 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed
They should definitely be looked at.
by gilbert on Sep 25, 2007 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
by bruin8uclap on Sep 25, 2007 11:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Coaching candidates are fun to talk about
by bluegold on Sep 25, 2007 11:14 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Big or Small HC, It doesn't matter...
by OutOThsWrld on Sep 25, 2007 11:15 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
big winners at small schools
by Peter Petersen on Sep 25, 2007 11:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Huh?
by bluestreet on Sep 25, 2007 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
oops
by Peter Petersen on Sep 25, 2007 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ya lost me here:
This is categorically not true. All the talent and fundamental soundness won't save you if you are not "up" for the game - the best one can hope for is a few breaks on the furious comeback trail (see Michigan and Appalachian State, or $C Oregon State last year, or Bruins at U of Oregon in basketball last year) to a squeaker win.
At trail's end, though, our quarrel may be a distinction without a difference. IMO it is and REMAINS the coach's job to get the team emotionally ready and "up" for games - especially against those whose on-paper stats would suggest a rout just by showing up - and these are the kinds of games that Dorrell has excelled at - so long as it's understood that "Excell" in this context means successfully finding a way to deliver a completely flat performance by a more talented team (See the Gambler's bowl in '03, the Mud Bowl against Fresno in '04, See UA in '05, UW last year, WSU last year, and of course Utah two weeks ago)
by lostnacfgop on Sep 25, 2007 11:58 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Coach never...
You don't want to have to worry that the other team is, on paper, a "lesser" opponent - or even a better one... to have success the team need only concern itself with performing as well as they are capable, regardless of the outcome on the scoreboard. "Success is peace of mind that comes from knowing you made every effort to become the best you are capable of being." Or something like that, I'm paraphrasing.
by haywood nighttrain on Sep 25, 2007 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Love to get an HC that can handle Carroll
by SinnerBoy 99 on Sep 25, 2007 1:37 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Possible successor coaches to KD.
See EDSBS's Fullmer Cup scoreboard.
Players discharging, semi- automatics, & hand-guns, multiple drug offenses.
I'd rather see UCLA mired in mediocrity than to turn into a USC north-east L A, or a mirror image of any number of SEC programs.
Why not the new coaches at UCincinnati, MSU, Schiano at Rupters, sorry Lou Holtzism, Rutgers. The guy from UCF, etc.
On another semi-positive note, Konrad Rueland, a five star tight end out of So. Cal. is transferring from ND. His short list includes UCLA.
I think CW & ND will release him to the Bruins. He will sit out this year, as the UCLA semester doesn't start until 10/12 or 10/18.
Have a good day gentlemen & women.
by jim masterson on Sep 25, 2007 1:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
UCLA is on the quarter system
by SuperBruinMan on Sep 25, 2007 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
First things first
Part 1 - in my opinion the most important thing for the future of UCLA football - is to get the current coach dismissed. Every day that goes by is another day with a lost opportunity to fire him. We should continue to put pressure on Mr. Guerrero.
Maybe a daily question. Like "Dear Mr. Guerrero: Here's the question for the day - do you think Coach Toledo's successor will ever lead us to a conference championship? If so, why - tell us what you see that no one else in the entire world can see." Maybe the question could be phrased a little more delicately. But we should be sending something every day to keep the pressure on this guy.
So here's my question for the BN: In which scenario do we have a better chance of winning at Oregon State: (a) Coach Toledo's successor is fired today and someone else is appointed acting head coach, or (b) Coach Toledo's successor continues business as usual?
If you believe that (a) is the better chance scenario, then what can we do to make that come to pass? Alternatively, if you think (b) presents the best chance for us to win, please save some Kool Aid for me, because I'll need it.
by Fox 71 on Sep 25, 2007 1:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This is the vicious cycle
Dorrell's apologists always want to give him "one last chance." "Let's see what his record is at the end of the year." And so on.
So, Dorrell, who seems to be the Teflon Coach (helped along by the wimpering MSM, including TJ Simers who now feels sorry for him), can eke his way to 8 or 9 wins and a crappy bowl. Just enough to satisfy the all-too-many complacent UCLA fans and alums.
The best time to fire him is yesterday. If not yesterday, today. As soon as possible. The program needs to heal and rebuild. Or learn and grow.
Whatever.
by Barnes2JJ on Sep 25, 2007 1:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here is what scares me
Last year, we wanted to get rid of Karl Dorrell.
Beating U$C meant we would not get rid of Karl Dorrell. That is, as they say, a Catch-22.
The score of the game was 13-9. 13 + 9 = 22
The date of the game was 12/2/2006. 12 + 2 + 2 + 6 = 22
Are you freaked out yet? Still don't think we're cursed?
by tasser10 on Sep 25, 2007 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And 22 just happens to be KD's IQ
by bluegold on Sep 25, 2007 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Tasser
Yes, it is a little freaky. I don't know how he does it, but Dorrell is the Teflon Coach. When TJ Simers threw in the towel on attacking him, I just about lost it.
by Barnes2JJ on Sep 25, 2007 2:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not till May!
It's been crazy, I haven't had time to catch up with everything and post for a while, and now KD is making me almost not care. I foresee a 6-game losing streak after Notre Dame, believe it or not. I can honestly even fathom an 8-game losing streak starting this weekend, except that we've had the Beavers' number for some reason (hint: Mike Riley runs a NFL system). That's the sad thing: you can imagine it because it is possible and you can justify it too.
by tasser10 on Sep 25, 2007 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yikes
I agree--a 6 or 8 game losing streak IS possible. The little voice in my head keeps secretly hoping for one or two more blowout losses...
by Barnes2JJ on Sep 25, 2007 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The planning is nearly done!
Seriously, look at the schedule:
- Oregon State: we should win this, but it's on the road, BO is the QB and he has no confidence. I see the defense winning this one but much closer than it should be.
- Notre Dame: will the Irish have their sh%t together by then? They've improved every week, luckily it's in the Rose Bowl and we should win. Wish Cowan played in this to get his due revenge.
- Cal: it doesn't matter that it's in the Rose Bowl. No MJD, no DO, no Marcedes...no chance
- @ WSU: Pullman = bad mojo, Cougars have our number
- @ Arizona: again, they might have their sh%t together by then and it's on the road
- ASU: team with a real coach...nuff said.
- Oregon: unless the Ducks collapse late as usual, we are toast
- @ U$C: exhibit 1: coffin. exhibit 2: nail. exhibit 3: door, shown to KD.
by tasser10 on Sep 25, 2007 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can't disagree
Best of luck with all the planning. I was pretty darn happy when it was all over.
by Barnes2JJ on Sep 25, 2007 3:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hardly analysis
I'm just looking forward to the honeymoon. The actual wedding will be fun too. I can't believe I'm coming back to Cali!
by tasser10 on Sep 25, 2007 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
12 + 1 + 2 + 0 + 0 + 7 = 22
by SuperBruinMan on Sep 25, 2007 8:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amount of perscriptions drugs I need to take
by joeb on Sep 26, 2007 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Simers is an $c fanboy...
by haywood nighttrain on Sep 25, 2007 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fox 71 sentiments
I believe Fox71 is hinting that this type of exchange takes place. I, frankly, was hoping KD would stay in SLC and find legitimate work training, but that was not to be.
I agree with Fox71 all the way.
Bill
by Mensgym on Sep 25, 2007 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jim Leavitt at USF
by BillyZoom on Sep 25, 2007 2:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
He's the anti-CTS
He would be an excellent acquisition by any program, but he's looked on sort of like Joe Pa or Bowden pere. A very revered guy here in Tampa. I would be very surprised if he would leave.
by Fox 71 on Sep 25, 2007 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Possible Coaching Candidates
- Terry Bowden (Just heard this possibility today and thought it was genius. Proven winner. Won a championship at Auburn and desires to get back into coaching and leave the broadcasting booth as long as it is the right situation)
- Steve Mariucci - west coast connection
- Rick Neuheisel - UCLA connection
by uclabruinn on Sep 25, 2007 4:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
My take
- Bowden- Nope. I'm not sold and no west coast connections.
- Marriucci- Nope. The WCO is a no no.
- Neuheisel- Definately should be interviewed and considered. He did hire KD as his OC so my respect for him went down considerably though.
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Sep 25, 2007 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bill Cowher - mucho dinero
by SinnerBoy 99 on Sep 25, 2007 4:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Even if we had $
by Ryan Rosenblatt on Sep 25, 2007 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
List of Coaches
Anyway, how about Rich Brooks? He's got a good record as a HC and plenty of ties out here.
by Calchas on Sep 27, 2007 10:01 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

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